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So Has Anyone Seen Quirks Lately?

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#1 Koniving

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 05:14 PM

Has anyone taken note of quirks as of lately?

Because I'm sitting on a 45 ton mech with 326 structure.
For comparison, I should probably mention that after quirks, a Hunchback gets 178+12 for 190 structure. For 50 tons.

The King Crab, Dire Wolf, and Atlas before quirks...which there aren't that many quirks to be had there... have 316 structure.

Yet I have a Blackjack with 326 structure. Not only that, but evidently ALL the Blackjacks have MORE structure than the 100 ton assaults. (Before assault quirks, which are pretty slim to say the least as they should be... nothing should get quirked with 2x its stock structure values, it's a 45 ton mech NOT a 90 ton mech).

Just...what....the... what are they thinking?

....Do they think?

Has this gone unnoticed?

Edited by Koniving, 09 January 2016 - 06:50 AM.


#2 Lyoto Machida

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 05:17 PM

Blame the players for that.

#3 Koniving

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 05:17 PM

I mean I have an idea of how this happened. There was a patchnote where "All armor strength" bonuses became additional armor. In turn, structure strength if they existed probably became additional structure... meaning if it was supposed to be +22% and became +22, no wonder...

But the thing is, that's just about literally doubling the entire mech's structure strength to herculean proportions!

#4 Y E O N N E

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 05:21 PM

We noticed. We all noticed. In fact, PGI nerfed the BJ-1X's other quirks after we noticed so they could keep the extra durability.

I have no idea why they decided to make the Blackjack a tank, but they did and a good one is about as hard to take down as a good Storm Crow.

Personally, I'll take the weapon quirks but I didn't need any more structure than it had before.

#5 Thunder Child

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 05:24 PM

It has not gone unnoticed by the Competitive CW teams.

Blackjacks are all the rage at the moment.

#6 Y E O N N E

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 05:25 PM

View PostThunder Child, on 07 January 2016 - 05:24 PM, said:

It has not gone unnoticed by the Competitive CW teams.

Blackjacks are all the rage at the moment.


The BJ-3 was excellent for destroying faces in CW before the patch, using ER/PPCs. Now that it can take a tremendous beating, it's goddamn easy mode.

#7 Navid A1

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 05:48 PM

View PostKoniving, on 07 January 2016 - 05:14 PM, said:

Has anyone taken note of quirks as of lately?

Because I'm sitting on a 45 ton mech with 326 structure.
For comparison, I should probably mention that after quirks, a Hunchback gets 178+12 for 190 structure. For 50 tons.

The King Crab, Dire Wolf, and Atlas before quirks...which there aren't that many quirks to be had there... have 316 structure.

Yet I have a Blackjack with 326 structure. Not only that, but evidently ALL the Blackjacks have MORE structure than the 100 ton assaults.

Just...what....the... what are they thinking?

....Do they think?

Has this gone unnoticed?


Actually players noticed that, and asked for a nerf to the mech (massive) structure quirks

unfortunately PGI just heard the "nerf" part and shaved off some heat gen quirks instead!

#8 Aresye

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 05:49 PM

View PostYeonne Greene, on 07 January 2016 - 05:25 PM, said:

The BJ-3 was excellent for destroying faces in CW before the patch, using ER/PPCs. Now that it can take a tremendous beating, it's goddamn easy mode.


Have you tried the 3 LPL build on it? The energy heat quirks keeps it running fairly cool, and the energy range quirks give you quite a bit of reach. No laser duration quirks, but let's be honest, the LPL doesn't need any help with duration.

I ran the BJ-3 with 2 ERPPCs for PTS4, and for a couple days after the patch went live, but as soon as I stuck 3 LPL on its right side instead, it went from, "annoying 20 ppfld poptarting gnat," to, "holy amazeballs batman, this thing is a freaking monster!"

#9 Y E O N N E

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 05:57 PM

View PostAresye Kerensky, on 07 January 2016 - 05:49 PM, said:


Have you tried the 3 LPL build on it? The energy heat quirks keeps it running fairly cool, and the energy range quirks give you quite a bit of reach. No laser duration quirks, but let's be honest, the LPL doesn't need any help with duration.

I ran the BJ-3 with 2 ERPPCs for PTS4, and for a couple days after the patch went live, but as soon as I stuck 3 LPL on its right side instead, it went from, "annoying 20 ppfld poptarting gnat," to, "holy amazeballs batman, this thing is a freaking monster!"


I haven't yet, actually. The thing is that you can run 3x LPL on any Blackjack and it's actually pretty amazing even without the heat gen quirks. I've run all sorts of laser vomit on all of the other variants (besides the Arrow) with fantastic results, but I bought the BJ-3 way back when specifically for PPCs. Ergo, I haven't tried lasers on the BJ-3.

Edited by Yeonne Greene, 07 January 2016 - 05:58 PM.


#10 Alexandrix

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 06:02 PM

yea.it's pretty gd ridiculous to be honest.

#11 Cyborne Elemental

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 06:10 PM

I talked to Russ about it on Twitter after the patch and notes went public, said I thought the BJ structure was a bit excessive.

BJ is a great medium, was before quirks, was after quirks.

Out of all of them, the only one that really needed help in that regard was the Arrow, all other BJ's do just fine, and the BJ-1X was like the mutant monster of the group.

BJ's never needed that much structure to make them viable, a little on the CT maybe, otherwise.. nope.

#12 Deathlike

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 06:18 PM

I like how our balance overlord takes some cues from other sources (like NGNG) and not from people that tell them the exact same thing multiple times.

Maybe hittin' the dartboard is a bad idea.

Edited by Deathlike, 07 January 2016 - 06:18 PM.


#13 Y E O N N E

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 06:40 PM

View PostMister D, on 07 January 2016 - 06:10 PM, said:

I talked to Russ about it on Twitter after the patch and notes went public, said I thought the BJ structure was a bit excessive.

BJ is a great medium, was before quirks, was after quirks.

Out of all of them, the only one that really needed help in that regard was the Arrow, all other BJ's do just fine, and the BJ-1X was like the mutant monster of the group.

BJ's never needed that much structure to make them viable, a little on the CT maybe, otherwise.. nope.


You know, I also don't understand why they keep buffing structure and not armor. Like, what's the logic? The problem is that some 'Mechs are getting disarmed or killed extra quick due to bad geometry/twist/etc., so they compensate with more durability. Okay, fine. But then they come out and show us that durability as structure. So...having all my weapons critted out as fast as I used to simply lose that whole component is an improvement...how? Are they thinking that structure is less of a boost than armor because it's soft? Well, they are right, and that's why the extra structure doesn't solve the problem unless you boost it way the hell up and even then it only works if most of the weapons are in a place that doesn't typically get opened up anyway. Atlas still loses its guns damn quick...it just gets to keep its torso intact. Meanwhile, the Blackjack has all of its guns in arms which rarely get hit, and so even when its torso sections are exposed it can still wreck your face, making all of that extra structure way more effective than it ought to be.

So...they've created a new problem without solving one. All they have to do is add a few points of armor instead of 100% more structure to get the result they wanted without turning the 'Mech into the Second Coming of MechaJesus...or is that RNGesus based on how they figure this stuff out?

#14 FupDup

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 06:43 PM

View PostYeonne Greene, on 07 January 2016 - 06:40 PM, said:

You know, I also don't understand why they keep buffing structure and not armor. Like, what's the logic?

It's because they want to trick people into thinking that crit-seeking weapons are viable.

Posted Image

#15 Mcgral18

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 06:51 PM

View PostYeonne Greene, on 07 January 2016 - 06:40 PM, said:


You know, I also don't understand why they keep buffing structure and not armor. Like, what's the logic?


It also increases fall damage.


I like that fact. It makes the Summoner sad.

#16 Wintersdark

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 06:59 PM

View PostKoniving, on 07 January 2016 - 05:14 PM, said:

Has anyone taken note of quirks as of lately?

Because I'm sitting on a 45 ton mech with 326 structure.
For comparison, I should probably mention that after quirks, a Hunchback gets 178+12 for 190 structure. For 50 tons.

The King Crab, Dire Wolf, and Atlas before quirks...which there aren't that many quirks to be had there... have 316 structure.

Yet I have a Blackjack with 326 structure. Not only that, but evidently ALL the Blackjacks have MORE structure than the 100 ton assaults.

Just...what....the... what are they thinking?

....Do they think?

Has this gone unnoticed?


Yeah, everyone noticed the Blackjack. Pretty much right away.

As a clan player, it's pretty tough to NOT notice it. Blackjacks can tank damage better than any Clan mech. ANY Clan mech, period - not just "like a stormcrow"; they have fantastic hitboxes AND structure comparable to a Dire Wolf.

I certainly don't begrude IS mechs more sturdiness, but I find it absurd that the Blackjack is such a monsterous tank, able to withstand more fire than a King Crab while the Vindicator is still one of the worst mechs in the game. The Blackjack was decent before quirks. Why did it get god-quirks and the Vindi nothing?

#17 Y E O N N E

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 07:04 PM

Next Pass:

Firestarters receive +20 Structure (LT/RT), + 22 Structure (CT), + 12 Armor (LL/RL), + 8 Armor (LA/RA), +10% Heat Gen, +15% Energy Range

Mist Lynx: -2.5% Energy Cooldown, -5% Energy Duration, Removed Structure quirks.

Trolololololo

#18 Mcgral18

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 07:04 PM

View PostWintersdark, on 07 January 2016 - 06:59 PM, said:


Yeah, everyone noticed the Blackjack. Pretty much right away.

As a clan player, it's pretty tough to NOT notice it. Blackjacks can tank damage better than any Clan mech. ANY Clan mech, period - not just "like a stormcrow"; they have fantastic hitboxes AND structure comparable to a Dire Wolf.

I certainly don't begrude IS mechs more sturdiness, but I find it absurd that the Blackjack is such a monsterous tank, able to withstand more fire than a King Crab while the Vindicator is still one of the worst mechs in the game. The Blackjack was decent before quirks. Why did it get god-quirks and the Vindi nothing?

View PostDeathlike, on 07 January 2016 - 06:18 PM, said:

I like how our balance overlord takes some cues from other sources (like NGNG) and not from people that tell them the exact same thing multiple times.

Maybe hittin' the dartboard is a bad idea.


#19 Deathlike

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 07:04 PM

View PostWintersdark, on 07 January 2016 - 06:59 PM, said:

I certainly don't begrude IS mechs more sturdiness, but I find it absurd that the Blackjack is such a monsterous tank, able to withstand more fire than a King Crab while the Vindicator is still one of the worst mechs in the game. The Blackjack was decent before quirks. Why did it get god-quirks and the Vindi nothing?


Dartboard of Balance said:

Vindicator (mech) needs no quirks (selected quirk(s)) because RNGesus said so (reason).

Edited by Deathlike, 07 January 2016 - 07:05 PM.


#20 Wintersdark

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 07:08 PM

Someone needs to make a Dartboard of Balance web-app.

Then have it spit out a full set of quirks for all the mechs.

This has to happen.


I mean, seriously, how could it be worse than what we currently have, when mechs that don't even have ballistic hardpoints get ballistic quirks.

Edited by Wintersdark, 07 January 2016 - 07:32 PM.






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