366 replies to this topic

[Kotev]

Still dont think that Clan recived enough buffs to compete with IS on equal footing but its a start.

[Sereglach]

Lily from animove, on 15 February 2016 - 04:32 AM, said:

yes but wouldn't work. Because in the other MW's there was open terrain, and terrain was WIDE. and a single laser battery took out a light mech. if we had these flamers in MWO, FS9's would be Op beyong imagination with the small maps and "cover everywhere" deisgn + the ability for lights to tank like baws.

would be a hell of a new broken meta gameplay, but surely fun in it's first days.

Almond Brown, on 15 February 2016 - 06:38 AM, said:

So you would advocate for Flamers that Insta-Gib enemy Mechs, or Randomly cause them to explode...? Ok, no thanks...

Maybe when SP play is available for MWO....perhaps...

Well, the statement wasn't advocating for that kind of flamer in MWO, it was merely rebutting yet another false statement from other people, that Flamers have always been useless weapon systems in the MechWarrior series of games. I'll completely agree that the Flamers of the MW2 series (Clans, GBL, Mercs) and MW3 were dangerous to the point of potential overpowered-ness. However, they did a better job of highlighting their effectiveness against mechs for both damage and heat damage. Also, in those games you could forcibly overload people's reactors by dousing them in excessive amounts of heat . . . in MWO you cannot do that.

For MWO, I just want a functional and viable weapon system. It doesn't need to be OP, but it should be functional in all facets of the weapons usage (Damage, Heat Damage, and Heat Generation). I also don't want this fix to release with a huge exploit still in place . . . which it's currently going to.

[SteelBruiser]

Monkey Lover, on 12 February 2016 - 03:38 PM, said:

Ya the op locust and spiders where just pushing clans back to their home planets.....

Yup, you can leg other mechs with MG...as long as they stand still for 5 minutes or so for you...and of course you have to hugging that leg in order for the bullets to reach it...but you'll probably run out of ammo long before you ever finish cutting through...the only place I get a kcik out of the MGs is on those larger Mechs who put them on their left and right torsos...when they shoot at you, it looks like they have glowing boobs!

[Lootax]

I like the patch notes. I might actually pilot again my IS mechs and not feeling myself guilty of taking an "I win" button.

[Gumon Choji]

Alexander Garden, on 12 February 2016 - 03:30 PM, said:

Every Hatchetman request has the inverse effect of delaying its arrival by 1 more day.
By my count you have delayed the arrival of the Hatchmen by 237 years.

News flash! PGI does not want money!!

After years of developing MWO they have decided to not take money when asked about this business choice and the popular pictures of "shut up and take my money" the response was tepid. However the audience of MWO was confused. What trauma could have caused this personality change? Because who does not like money? All other MMO developers stated this move away from desiring paychecks was odd and showed mental breaks with reality. EA released this:
https://youtu.be/sZHCVyllnck

[Deathlike]

Almond Brown, on 15 February 2016 - 06:38 AM, said:

So you would advocate for Flamers that Insta-Gib enemy Mechs, or Randomly cause them to explode...? Ok, no thanks...

Maybe when SP play is available for MWO....perhaps...

The point was actually that it was actually useful... not necessarily that it was OP.

It would be nice if you weren't so dense.

In MW3, it actually worked in multiplayer, not just Single Player. The difference was in the single player, there was a massive overheat explosion (like a mini-nuke) when a death by overheating occurred. That was totally disabled in Multiplayer for obvious reasons.

[Bloodweaver]

Sereglach, on 14 February 2016 - 09:40 PM, said:

The sad thing is that there were several really good suggestions/conversations about turning pulse lasers into a completely different kind of short-range-pinpoint-brawler weapon system by cutting the cooldown and damage in half (give or take), but also having the burn time only be no more than a half second for even the LPL. It would have been a great way to differentiate the weapon systems in form, function, and purpose.

Instead we've got the laser types that are so close in functionality that there's only modest difference, at best, in the grand scheme of things. We've gotten pulse lasers range increased multiple times, damage increased multiple times and heat brought closer to the standard counterparts. At this point they're just higher damage standard lasers with slightly shorter burn time, at the cost of some weight.

No kidding. Some of the different proposals I've seen over the years for a more distinct version of pulse lasers in MWO:

1) Drastically shorter beam times, as you said. None of this, "we'll translate the significant accuracy advantage of pulse lasers in TT by lowering their beam duration to... 66% of a standard laser!" Nah. Just NAH. With TT stats, that basically just makes them into alternative standard lasers that do a LITTLE more damage, at the cost of tonnage and heat. This poor implementation is exactly why pulse lasers have gotten so many buffs from PGI over the years. Over and over and over again. They compare to standard lasers favorably NOW, but only because their stats have been buffed so much to compensate for their poor mechanics.

2) Continuous beam, as in MW3. Hold down the trigger, beam is active. Release trigger, beam deactivates. You don't automatically expend the full laser by shooting the weapon; you decide how long the beam lasts. Lets you choose just how much of the laser's heat and duration you want to expend, thus making it do more damage per heat and weight due to a decrease in missed shots.

3) Continuous fire, but in pulses instead of a single beam. The laser keeps firing for as long as you hold down the trigger, with no beam duration and extremely short cooldown. In other words, a laser machine-gun. Will do a lot of damage quickly, but also massively increase your heat if you keep firing for more than a second. Similar to the way the SPL worked in MW2. The effect would be similar to a less-extreme version of the 1000% missile cooldown quirk the QKD-4G got in the test server not too long ago.

4) Charge mechanic. Hold down the trigger to charge the pulse "bank" - release trigger to fire full bank together in a burst for severe damage. Difference from gauss would be, that you can also just click the trigger to fire a single pulse instead of charging the bank. And can release the trigger at any point during charging to release what you've charged so far - no need to wait for the charge to get to "full" before firing, as you do with gauss. This mechanic would also be good for RACs, if they ever get put into MWO.

I prefer the last two myself, but any of those systems would be better than what PGI did. The pulse laser in MWO is basically just a stronger standard laser. While it is true that pulse lasers do put out a little more damage than standard lasers in TT, that was never what defined them. The main advantage of the pulse laser was its -2 accuracy modifier, making it a far more accurate weapon than others. The increase in damage exacerbated this advantage, and its heat, range, and weight disadvantages were so significant compared to standard lasers because the -2 modifier was so good.

PGI instead gave it only a tiny "accuracy modifier" via a decrease in beam duration which does not at all scale to the effect of a -2 modifier on a to-hit table. As a result, in order to make their implementation of pulse lasers balanced against standard lasers, they then had to massively boost their range, completely eliminate their higher heat, and in the case of the LPL even feed a steroid cocktail to its damage output. All of which could have been prevented by simply being a little more creative with how one of the TT game's more unique weapon systems was implemented.

[Brienne]

You crush LCT-1E. Nobody had complained about him though.
Just because you missed something with Cicada.
You're right. It was far too dangerous.
Pff.


Got it. I'll play Fire or Artic, as every one. Well done PGI.

Edited by Brienne, 15 February 2016 - 12:53 PM.

[MechWarrior4023212]

PFC Carsten, on 15 February 2016 - 12:59 AM, said:

BTW - PGI, please delay the patch, cancel the blunt IS nerf to <=10% energy range and only apply it to those mechs who get „abused“ (or rather overused). Maybe even there don't cut it to 10% but go down step by step in 5% increments until you found the right balance.

So Clan suffers as the IS slowly stays much better....nope! silly idea!

[Brienne]

If you were to choose 2 mechs out of these one, you would take ? -> Firestarter, Arctic, Locust.

Guess now which mech is nerfed ?



Bye Locust. So long.

[Dawnstealer]

Alexander Garden, on 12 February 2016 - 03:30 PM, said:

Every Hatchetman request has the inverse effect of delaying its arrival by 1 more day.
By my count you have delayed the arrival of the Hatchmen by 237 years.

D:

Does a negative request reduce the number? And Alexander? You know what would help you guys CHOP through that delay?

Edited by Dawnstealer, 15 February 2016 - 02:12 PM.

[SQW]

When will we get the knock-down effect of MW4?

landing a AC20 or Guass on a fast moving light's leg should NOT be just about armor dmg.

[Dee Eight]

Exactly... on mechs with a 15% energy boost... 5% loss is 40 meters for a ER PPC... on those wtih 25%... its 120 meters plus shortened. Bad enough they already made clan ERPPCs useless by having them deal the same damage as the IS version for 15 heat.

[Monkey Lover]

Dee Eight, on 15 February 2016 - 04:19 PM, said:

Exactly... on mechs with a 15% energy boost... 5% loss is 40 meters for a ER PPC... on those wtih 25%... its 120 meters plus shortened. Bad enough they already made clan ERPPCs useless by having them deal the same damage as the IS version for 15 heat.

Clans ppc does 15dmg per shot. Is only does 10. Clan ppc is 33% better for the same heat. Clan also only takes up 2 slots compared to the IS 3.

Exentius, on 15 February 2016 - 09:46 AM, said:

I like the patch notes. I might actually pilot again my IS mechs and not feeling myself guilty of taking an "I win" button.

Its ok its back to clan easy mode

[NocturnalBeast]

Monkey Lover, on 15 February 2016 - 05:25 PM, said:

Clans ppc does 15dmg per shot. Is only does 10. Clan ppc is 33% better for the same heat. Clan also only takes up 2 slots compared to the IS 3.


Its ok its back to clan easy mode

Clan ERPPCs do 15 damage per shot in MWO, but PGI nerfed them by making 5 points of that damage splash damage. Also, IS has pinpoint damage Autocannons, Clans were nerfed once again by having burst fire Autocannons, which makes it unlikely that they will do full damage to a single location more often than not.

Nothing I have read in the patch notes makes me believe that IS mechs will no longer be viable, or that Clan Mechs will be "easy mode".

[GI Journalist]

Please explain how Targeting Computers make bullets faster. Why do they increase the velocity of the projectile, instead of the range of the autocannon?

[Wintersdark]

GI Journalist, on 15 February 2016 - 05:54 PM, said:

Please explain how Targeting Computers make bullets faster. Why do they increase the velocity of the projectile, instead of the range of the autocannon?

Because that's the only way to increase accuracy in MWO. Targeting computer's express purpose is to increase targeting accuracy. That's what they *do*. But because people are adamant that, no matter what's going on, shots fired always fly *exactly* to the crosshairs. Whether that's a good idea or not is irrelevant, it is what it is.

As such, the only way to make players more accurate with a TC is by having it increase projectile velocity.

Faulting it on "realism" is stupid anyways, given how absurd our projectile velocities are to start with and how much Space Magic there already is. It's an abstraction to make the thing work as it should.

[Wintersdark]

Monkey Lover, on 15 February 2016 - 05:25 PM, said:

Clans ppc does 15dmg per shot. Is only does 10. Clan ppc is 33% better for the same heat.

Come on, you damn well know better. That is grossly misleading.

Clan ERPPC's do 10 damage to what you hit, and +2.5 more to each adjacent component. However if you hit an arm or a leg, you'll only get one +2.5, to the relevant side torso, for 12.5 damage total, and you NEVER get the +2.5 to the head.

But you know well that that +2.5 damage to an adjacent component is not anywhere near worth damage to the main shot.

So it's ABSOLUTELY not "33% better".

The cERPPC is a bit better in usage than an IS ERPPC before quirks, and it is a bit lighter/smaller. But it is NOT a clan energy gauss rifle.

Note also that unquirked, ERPPC's AND Clan ERPPC's are both utter garbage.



However, even in this nerfed range world, ANY IS mech with +energy range quirks have ERPPC's that fire further than the cERPPC, as well as any with energy (or PPC, or ERPPC) quirks have lower heat ERPPC's, and any IS mechs with Velocity or Cooldown quirks also have better ERPPC's.

That +2.5 damage to one or two neighboring components is worthless.

Edited by Wintersdark, 15 February 2016 - 07:36 PM.

[pbiggz]

Wintersdark, on 15 February 2016 - 07:35 PM, said:

Come on, you damn well know better. That is grossly misleading.

Clan ERPPC's do 10 damage to what you hit, and +2.5 more to each adjacent component. However if you hit an arm or a leg, you'll only get one +2.5, to the relevant side torso, for 12.5 damage total, and you NEVER get the +2.5 to the head.

But you know well that that +2.5 damage to an adjacent component is not anywhere near worth damage to the main shot.

So it's ABSOLUTELY not "33% better".

The cERPPC is a bit better in usage than an IS ERPPC before quirks, and it is a bit lighter/smaller. But it is NOT a clan energy gauss rifle.

Note also that unquirked, ERPPC's AND Clan ERPPC's are both utter garbage.



However, even in this nerfed range world, ANY IS mech with +energy range quirks have ERPPC's that fire further than the cERPPC, as well as any with energy (or PPC, or ERPPC) quirks have lower heat ERPPC's, and any IS mechs with Velocity or Cooldown quirks also have better ERPPC's.

That +2.5 damage to one or two neighboring components is worthless.

He knows its grossly misleading, he just doesn't care. He's pushing a constructed narrative because he's bitter about that TT game he lost 26 years ago when clans got released still, and no power in the world will prevent him from spreading that bitterness to all living things for all time until the moon crashes into the sea and the sun burns out.

Everyone sees through the act Monkey Lover. Nobody respects your opinion when your opinion is informed by blind hatred without reason.

[Monkey Lover]

Wintersdark, on 15 February 2016 - 07:35 PM, said:

So it's ABSOLUTELY not "33% better".

"
So it's ABSOLUTELY not "33% better"."

Other than when it hits the ct and st and you get 33% more dmg like i said.... Even when hitting a arm or leg you still get 16% more dmg.

As for "splash dmg" being worthless i have killed lots of mechs with that splash dmg finishing off cored st's or even ct. I dont know anyone running around with 1 ppc. At the very least youre doing 5dmg on both sides. This is more than enough to take our a red cit if you hit anywhere close.

Lets of course not count the 1 ton target computer that increases range,speed and crits, thats nothing like a quirk haha

Edited by Monkey Lover, 15 February 2016 - 08:08 PM.