23 replies to this topic

[Puresin]

so in what event in the world did lights or anything referred to as a light become invincible or unstoppable? in what part of the world did LIGHT tanks have the ability to take on an Assault Tank?

Since I can't post the picture here because the posting system for pictures on here is even busted.

Hey PGI, stop tryin to make the game better (which you aren't) and fix what you have, (which you won't do)

hey PGI, I DARE YOU to TAKE out a direwolf. NOT a team of them. drop pug in a direwolf. I bet not a single one of you would. cause you all know how you he nerfed the game into a LIGHTS pew pew game. to give you a scale of how realistically it should work, it should take 2 lights to kill a medium, 2 meds to kill a heavy and 2 heavies to kill a assault.

reason for this, because I just watched a firestarter ( I don't care what weight it is) with 8 small pulse lasers fire several times with out even overheating.

My direwolf can't even fire 6 lasers of any kind without needing 14 double heatsinks, which I still can't fire the SEVERAL times without overheating.

PGI you have no idea what you are ding anymore do you? in what world could something 35 tonnes fire that many HEAT BASED weapons and not MELT INTO SLAG. but yet something 100 tonnes can't fire half that without needing a ******** amount of heatsinks.

8 x small pulse lasers =8 tonnes out of 35 that generate heat and how many tonnes of that are heatsinks? they can't be double heatsinks either.

PGI please stop turning this game into COD for mechs. each side has its differences for a reason. This game was never meant to be for everyone ages russ and up. it was meant to use skill and tactics and strategy.

not who has the most jenner oxides on their team.

[Roland09]

Puresin, on 15 February 2016 - 06:17 PM, said:

so in what event in the world did lights or anything referred to as a light become invincible or unstoppable? in what part of the world did LIGHT tanks have the ability to take on an Assault Tank?

Since I can't post the picture here because the posting system for pictures on here is even busted.

Hey PGI, stop tryin to make the game better (which you aren't) and fix what you have, (which you won't do)

hey PGI, I DARE YOU to TAKE out a direwolf. NOT a team of them. drop pug in a direwolf. I bet not a single one of you would. cause you all know how you he nerfed the game into a LIGHTS pew pew game. to give you a scale of how realistically it should work, it should take 2 lights to kill a medium, 2 meds to kill a heavy and 2 heavies to kill a assault.

reason for this, because I just watched a firestarter ( I don't care what weight it is) with 8 small pulse lasers fire several times with out even overheating.

My direwolf can't even fire 6 lasers of any kind without needing 14 double heatsinks, which I still can't fire the SEVERAL times without overheating.

PGI you have no idea what you are ding anymore do you? in what world could something 35 tonnes fire that many HEAT BASED weapons and not MELT INTO SLAG. but yet something 100 tonnes can't fire half that without needing a ******** amount of heatsinks.

8 x small pulse lasers =8 tonnes out of 35 that generate heat and how many tonnes of that are heatsinks? they can't be double heatsinks either.

PGI please stop turning this game into COD for mechs. each side has its differences for a reason. This game was never meant to be for everyone ages russ and up. it was meant to use skill and tactics and strategy.

not who has the most jenner oxides on their team.

I feel your pain, oh BRAVE CLAN WARRIOR™. Some simple solutions to your problem:

1. Put more armor on the back of your mech, at least as much as on the front side. Imagine the surprise of the light mech pilot when he is pouring one alpha strike after another into your rear armour without even penetrating, and then, when he finally shuts down in frustration, you turn around and WHAM!, you kill him just like that. Easy.

2. Bring an Urbanmech. With some tweaking, you can be just as fast as a Dire Wolf, but you will enjoy 360° torso twist. When that light mech tries sneaking up on you and tries to run out of your field of fire, ZAP!, you just blast him. Imagine what the look on his face will be like. (You could also retain the original speed of the Urbie for more firepower, but then you would need to ask a friendly assault mech to carry you into battle.)

3. Change your player name to something like "Russ Shouter" or something, so PGI knows who is responsible for you not having fun, and start threads with titles like "CLAN MECHS COMPLETELY UNPLAYABLE!". After all, PGI have shown to be susceptible to Clan temper tantrums. As such, your post above was a damn good start, but this needs to be a daily exercise from now on.

4. Be more constructive in your posts. You know, you are totally right about that 2 light mechs = one medium mech thing and so on, but in order for PGI to know what to do, you should be more specific. Like, you should demand that all IS light mechs should get their speed reduced by 50% because of quirks, or something like that.

[Rushin Roulette]

lol, because of players like the OP being tier 1 is not a guarantee fro a player to be skilled... but for him/her to play the game more.

Ill make a tl;dr for others who dont want to read that rant

Quote

"How dare a smaller mech than mine can kill me. If I sit in my biggest mech I should rek face!"

Have you tried running 8 SPL on that Direwolf? I can guarantee you that it will run considerably cooler than the same 8 SPL on the Firestarter. You rant write about not being able to fire 8 energy weapons with your Direwolf without running into heat problems... pray tell us which energy weapons are you talking about and could it be that those 8 energy weapons you mention together weigh just about as much as the entire Firestarter you are ranting writing about?

For your information. It has always been the fact that light mechs are and should be the the best assault hunters. If you want to hunt lights bring a Medium. If you want to hunt mediums, bring a Heavy. If you want to hunt Heavies, you are already sitting in an Assault.

[Der Hesse]

*rofl*
This is too good to be true.
Nice trolling though!

[Nightshade24]

Puresin, on 15 February 2016 - 06:17 PM, said:

in what part of the world did LIGHT tanks have the ability to take on an Assault Tank?

Well even though this is a completely different debate all together...
How about the fact that the Stuart is extremely effective of dispatching a Panther in WWII? sure... Panther is technically a medium tank but it's weight was heavier than US, UK, and some Russian Heavy tanks like the M6A1... churchill.... KV-1.... etc

The Panther as the side and rear armour of a potato farm on fire. Even SPAA and armoured trucks like a Staghound, bloodhound, AEC mk II, or an AEC mk II AA [the SPAA with 20 mm's) can kill a panther in ease as these are all fast vehicles that can out maneuver, penetrate, and kill a panther with ease much like how a locust can easily kill a Direwolf if the Locust doesn't epxlode to smitherines by a 50 damage + alpha strike before hand trying to get to you much like how a staghound doesn't explode if the Panther didn't shot at it.

More modern example? Well we got the fact that these days quite a lot of the most advance and reasonable successful tanks are technically armorless (only armoured against small arm fire) and have anti ballistic weapon laser systems and such... however it's still an MBT. "Assault tank" is a term that died slightly after WWII as this rather meant assault guns on tanks (StuG III) or stuff like what basically is a modern seige weapon (Tortoise, T95 / T28, etc). which was a failed concept. Light tanks nearly died out due to MBT's (essentually everything good of a light, medium, and heavy tank rolled up in one in terms of role) and only exist these days as light recon vehicles and cheap additions to a force.

Oh, let's not forget the RBT-5 light tank...

Two 420 mm [blaze?] Anti tank TORPEDOES. [can kill virtually any tank of the period if it hits... this includes the infamous Maus and possibly the blueprint wounder weapon the Ratte as that thing even though bigger than a factory that would have built it, HAs relatively light top armour... you may need a few RBT-5's to kill it)

This is similar to how a locust in MW:O with 4 SRM 2's smashing you... however that doesn't cover it...
This is more like how in canon there is "Rocket laucnhers", they deal lots of damage for nearly no weight but can't reload. so large burst of salvo... if in MW: O (it's in time line) we got a locust that can 1 shot kill a heavy from the front or an assault from the side... that and than he's reduced to being a single medium pulse laser or large. How fun would this be in MW: O....

So talking about 1910-1960... "in what part of the world did..."

Germany, Normandy, Manchuria, Russia, Sweden [let's not forget those BT-42's...]. China, Korea, Britain, Iran, Iraq, India, South africa, Tunisia, Libya, France, USA, canada, Italy... list goes on.

Modern day? well the meta in modern day is spam all the MBT's and Artillery... kinda like spamming all the heavy mechs with the occasional direwolf or king crab with twin gauss and large lasers... kinda mirrors quite well to be honest...

Who in the right mind in "PGI" would take a direwolf? well technically Sean is part of PGI [not as a dev ofc...] and he is more than happy to take one out...
However without taking that question out of proportion... let me counter question you... who would take a light mech over a direwolf? sure in rock paper scissors a light may kill a direwolf, but a direwolf will kill basically any medium, heavy, or assault mech with relative ease in the certain situation... light mech? assaults and sometimes other lights in SPECIFIC situations... one of the hardest weight classes to do well in...

[RincewindWizzard]

Noobs get cored in the back lol. If you alpha the face of that light instead of just tanking with your rear.....

Edited by RincewindWizzard, 16 February 2016 - 01:04 PM.

[Wildstreak]

This section still open?
Devolved into another complaint area.

Lights are an endangered species, except for events that require them, I rarely see more than 2 per team in a Solo Quick Play match, sometimes just 1. Compare that to the pile of Heavies, Mediums and Assaults, how exactly are Lights a big threat?

[SockSlayer]

Puresin, I severely disagree that lights are in any way op, I die pretty easily in them, and I do incur a lot of heat with energy weapons. You say it should take 2 lights to kill a medium, and in armor amount that would be the case. But lights do and should equal assaults in their own way. Let me explain. Of course, a light should overheat much quicker than an assault, and not have as much armor or damage. But lights have chance to outmatch an assault in one area...speed, and that speed should always be around, lights may kill assaults a lot, but its usually because they cannot turn quick enough to hit them, if an assault gets even one lucky hit, the light will take severe damage (depending on loadout).

My experience is that every mech has its advantages, even the seemingly most unbeatable mech, will have another mech that can best it in some way. Also, what skills have you researched for the direwolf or your used assault mech? If all the skills are mastered, you might be able to get overheating down. And the overheating issue you described, it might be that the firestarter has mastered all mech skills, where your assault might not be all mastered, causing the firestarter to receive better heat management, try upgrading your skills to help gain abit of mobility as well. Also, it is possible that the light might be using override shutdown, or has coolshot consumables, in which case, it can prevent an overheat up to 2 times.

I'm yet to see any mech that is truly too weak or strong, every mech has its best loadout, the key is finding it, and not demanding nerf this and nerf that(I've seen many games lose players that way). And try chain firing if you have not. And if a mech seems stronger than yours unfairly, then get the mech in question, its not rocket science!

[Unknown Pwn]

Actually, I am pretty confused myself. Before my Wolv 6k was nurfed today, I ran quad ERLL's with 5 double heat sinks.
12 strong, well landed shots of constant chain fire were shot into the left torso of a Jenner II'C and it didnt even open the armor, before I came to max heat.

The same is true when I fired directly into the rear center torso of a LCT-PB sitting still a full quad shot of ERLL's and it didnt open armor.

Then the same is true when I fired roughly 20 shots into a powered down afk Raven and it didnt open armor until the last shot.

All of these attacks described were conducted at ranges below 200m.

Further still, these were the best case scenarios where I could sink my teeth into a light, and during an actual active pilot, I could protract my destruction against a light for two cooling cycles by hosing with the 'quads until max heat and going to 1/3'rd heat to continue.

I am not the greatest shot of all time, but I am also not the worst either, and for that, I am going to backup the original poster on the matter.

There is a real disparity here in terms of their toughness.

I am not going to even go into the matter about ACH's.

[Vyx]

The issue at hand is the current trend of PGI to add structural and armor quirks to mechs that do not need them. If speed is the defense of the light mech, then leave it to that -- just speed. Fudging the system with internal structure quirks is an abomination. It is basically like getting the strength of a mech a weight class above, but with the maneuverability of the lower weight class. Pure imbalance.

[Autobot9000]

The OP is right. PGI made lights competitive combat machines. If MWO had any real gameplay light mechs could serve the purpose they have in the BT universe. But MWO isn't BT based, it's a COD based robot shooter.

[Sunstruck]

I've run into the same problem with an arctic cheetah in my stalker, the cheetah practically ran into my dual large lasers and 3 srm4s and a med pulse laser and barely took a scratch on its armor color.

[Autobot9000]

Yeah, it applies to all lights, whether clan or IS. I am not sure what the real reason behind this is, whether it is the tiny size of the hitboxes, that causes all damage to spread over multiple zones or whether it is the tiny overall size, that works in conjunction with network lag / ping and causes misses. I can only imagine, that lasers could miss a high number of their damage dots due to network lag. Sometimes I get awkward feelings, where hits register on mechs, that are already rendered at another location and vice versa hits not registering where the mech is clearly rendered where the shots go. This is an issue, that is amplified with light mechs.

It's a clear defect in the game, if you cant get shots to register reliably. I don't know what is the best way to solve this, but it should be solved. Whether this happens through a global deceleration of game pace or other means. It's PGIs duty to come up with the best solution. They have the code, they can test and dig for root causes.

[Jack Spade Ward]

Rushin Roulette, on 15 February 2016 - 11:23 PM, said:

lol, because of players like the OP being tier 1 is not a guarantee fro a player to be skilled... but for him/her to play the game more.

Ill make a tl;dr for others who dont want to read that rant


Have you tried running 8 SPL on that Direwolf? I can guarantee you that it will run considerably cooler than the same 8 SPL on the Firestarter. You rant write about not being able to fire 8 energy weapons with your Direwolf without running into heat problems... pray tell us which energy weapons are you talking about and could it be that those 8 energy weapons you mention together weigh just about as much as the entire Firestarter you are ranting writing about?

For your information. It has always been the fact that light mechs are and should be the the best assault hunters. If you want to hunt lights bring a Medium. If you want to hunt mediums, bring a Heavy. If you want to hunt Heavies, you are already sitting in an Assault.

Actually, you wont run cooler than a firestarter...
remember the heatsink nerf on clans...

[Jack Spade Ward]

Wildstreak, on 16 February 2016 - 01:11 PM, said:

This section still open?
Devolved into another complaint area.

Lights are an endangered species, except for events that require them, I rarely see more than 2 per team in a Solo Quick Play match, sometimes just 1. Compare that to the pile of Heavies, Mediums and Assaults, how exactly are Lights a big threat?

Lights have been the most OP mechs since the beggining of this game!
Does anyone still remembers how OP was the spider? Before the clans? There are videos on Youtube showing that a spider could be hit by an AC20 and do 0 dmg! Hit reg on spiders were a real problem! Even PGI knew that,
Nowadays, lights still suffer from bad hit reg, but not as problematic as the spider used to be.
All in all, when piloting an Atlas, a King Crab and specially a DireWolf, be very afraid of light mechs! Whenever im in one of those mechs, i always keep an eye out for lights!
Remember, the best way to kill an assault, bring a light! Best way to kill a light, bring a medium! Best way to kill a medium, bring a heavy! And, the best way to kill a heavy, its with an assault

[xe N on]

Puresin, on 15 February 2016 - 06:17 PM, said:

so in what event in the world did lights or anything referred to as a light become invincible or unstoppable? in what part of the world did LIGHT tanks have the ability to take on an Assault Tank?

How you could even reached tier 1 without realizing that Assault mechs are not meant to tank damage? There is no "tank" class in MWO. If you get focued assisted by more then 2 people that are worth their money any mech will be cored in seconds.

Assault mechs are also not meant to 1on1 but are heavily relying on support forces to bring their firepower. Got a problem with a light? Ask your 5xC-SSRM6 Stormcrow to get rid of it. Oh, no friend by your side? Somebody did make a huge misktake.

Fast Medium and Lights mechs should be the bane of slow and clumsy assault class mechs if cought 1on1. In fact, if I get in the fireline of an Direwolf a mech, I'm mostly toast - independent of what mech I'm piloting.

Assuming that assault mechs would be the tankiest class with the most firepower in terms of DPS, alpha and range and the king of any 1on1 ... what reason anyone would have to play anything other?

Edited by xe N on, 21 February 2016 - 12:12 AM.

[Strength Damage Cliff Racer]

Consider one thing: While nerfing skills was bad for everyone, same change widened the orbit of light around assault by good 8 metres. Now just more of them fits in that orbit, making wolfpacking easier while reducing effectiveness of lone light. Then, quite some mechs got fast yaw.
For example, light is useless against new guy in king crab which read one guide about turn wars WITHOUT tactical cornering your back. And you can take it even further. Actually, I ride my King Crab-0000 with 4 SSRM2s specifically to screw up any mook trying to be smart about it. For a lone light, it's way easier to find other prey than eating 16 damage every 3 seconds on top of every laser swipe I am lucky (Because I am bad at aiming) to land on.
If you got several mechs against you alone, then it's a part of coordination problem. Part of YOUR problem and part of YOUR TEAM's INDIFFERENCE problem. Solutions: get some knowledge of usual light hunting grounds, arm yourself accordingly and talk about your problem with team before this problem bit you. Usually, you get one light/med to cover you in random battles.

Oh, and one funny trick with King Crabs - you can fit a non-nova/centurion medium mech between your hands and shoot over his head with your upper (Non-ballistic) points.

[Strength Damage Cliff Racer]

xe N on, on 21 February 2016 - 12:10 AM, said:

Assuming that assault mechs would be the tankiest class with the most firepower in terms of DPS, alpha and range and the king of any 1on1 ... what reason anyone would have to play anything other?

Actually, they ARE the tankiest class with the most firepower in terms of DPS, alpha and range. It's compensated by their slow speed which means inability to pick fights, being forced to any they stumble upon.

[Nightshade24]

Spadejack, on 20 February 2016 - 06:27 PM, said:

Lights have been the most OP mechs since the beggining of this game!
Does anyone still remembers how OP was the spider? Before the clans? There are videos on Youtube showing that a spider could be hit by an AC20 and do 0 dmg! Hit reg on spiders were a real problem! Even PGI knew that,
Nowadays, lights still suffer from bad hit reg, but not as problematic as the spider used to be.
All in all, when piloting an Atlas, a King Crab and specially a DireWolf, be very afraid of light mechs! Whenever im in one of those mechs, i always keep an eye out for lights!
Remember, the best way to kill an assault, bring a light! Best way to kill a light, bring a medium! Best way to kill a medium, bring a heavy! And, the best way to kill a heavy, its with an assault

Since the begining of the game eh?
I am pretty sure we all saw that 2009 we saw that Jenner get killed by a single volley of SRM 6.
We also saw that after a engine cap was added as well as jumpjets that the light mech population nearly went extinct.
Also let's not forget the first month of clans coming out, Lights being obliterated to quote: "Streak 40's" (Cl LRM 20's with full damage min range)... etc... etc... etc.... Let's not also forget that whole like 6 month period there was rarely a light ever in game and if there was it was only just the one...
I should also state there are more videos about how light mechs are useless/ UP than there are videos claiming they are OP. Unless you count the games where someone did good in a light which is about the same frequency as any other class or lower in terms of showcases of good games. etc...

Funny how lights are apparently OP when light mechs often only have 4-11% of the cue while heavies half the time hit 40-50%.

[T R3]

"Funny how lights are apparently OP when light mechs often only have 4-11% of the cue while heavies half the time hit 40-50%. "

He has a Direwolf, which for assaults the queue's are almost the same as lights these days. This tells me that assaults need to be a lot harder to kill...