39 replies to this topic

[DGTLDaemon]

So I was reading the discussion topic for the current Rifleman event, and a couple of lines caught my eye:

SideWinderBLN, on 18 February 2016 - 09:17 AM, said:

At reasonable stats in a heavy or assault (W/L around 1, average scores around 150, average damage over 300, 1-2 KMDD and 3-4 Assists per game) I am guessing it will be done in 10-15 games. So maybe 2 or 3 hours.

And everything in that paragraph seemed reasonable to me, except for the "1-2 KMDD" part. Actually, getting KMDDs has become the most difficult component of event challenges for me since I moved up into Tier 3. At long range, enemy players just don't stay in the open long enough to deal sustained damage to them. At medium to short range, you are either focusing an enemy mech with your teammates (with no guarantees that you'll end up the one dealing the most damage), or pursuing a single enemy on your own, which can lead to all kinds of problems (running into enemy ambushes, being outgunned by a heavier mech or outrun by a lighter one etc.). So far, the only tactic that I've found to work is to take my good old 2xcERLL + 2xcUAC/5 Hellbringer and just go crazy aggressive with it. I mean - maniacal. Like abandoning all caution, forgetting about teamwork and just fixating on one thing: to find myself a target and pursue it relentlessly until either of us goes down. Rinse and repeat. It tends to get the job done, and does provide some memorable experiences (ever seen an 85-ton Warhawk literally running away from a UAC-spamming 65-ton Hellbringer?), but it's kind of ruining my matches, both in terms of personal enjoyment and my contribution to the team.

In view of the above, I'd really appreciate other member's thoughts on: what is the best way to get the most KMDDs in the shortest possible amount of time at higher PSR tiers without compromising other aspects of the match? What weapons or weapon combinations tend to get more KMDDs? What tactics work best, in your experience? Maybe someone can suggest specific builds? I'm currently running a 4xcLPL Warhawk, a 2xcERLL + 2xcUAC/5 Hellbringer (also have a 4xcERML + 2xcUAC/5 version for closer-range work in CW), a 2xcLPL Shadow Cat and a 2xcERLL Arctic Cheetah. The Shadow Cat and the Cheetah seem no good at grinding KMDDs, for obvious reasons, although I just might be using them in a wrong way. The Warhawk sometimes works well because of its sheer firepower, but requires good teamwork (as all assaults do) which doesn't always happen in Quick Play. My best bet is currently the Hellbringer, but it forces me into a playstyle which would probably get me institutionalized in real life So, any advice or thoughts, however general they might be, will be greatly appreciated

[Zionkan]

Try midrange Lazor Builds (er ml / lpl) i usually do tons of damage with but dont get the Killshot.
Dont Stay in frontline but some Meters apart and support your assaults, maybe focussing Torsos instead of cts.
Dont try 2 get the killshot, if it happens its not bad either.

[Rushin Roulette]

Zionkan, on 19 February 2016 - 04:14 AM, said:

Dont try 2 get the killshot, if it happens its not bad either.

You can still get KMDD with a killshot, you get the solokill and killshot in addition to the KMDD in that case.

The best way to get KMDD is to press R and focus that target until it is either dead or can not be shot (Behind cover for example). Then switch to the next target and rince and repeat. If your target is not shootable, then remeber which one it was and switch to is once you notice it is shootable again.

[DGTLDaemon]

Zionkan, on 19 February 2016 - 04:14 AM, said:

Try midrange Lazor Builds (er ml / lpl) i usually do tons of damage with but dont get the Killshot.
Dont Stay in frontline but some Meters apart and support your assaults, maybe focussing Torsos instead of cts.
Dont try 2 get the killshot, if it happens its not bad either.

Interesting. A 3xcLPL Hellbringer, maybe? Will give it a try tonight. Already thought about trying it, but never got around to it. Thanks And I never bother going for the killshots, either.

[aGentleWarrior]

[color=#959595]And everything in that paragraph seemed reasonable to me, except for the "1-2 KMDD" part. Actually, getting KMDDs has become the most difficult component of event challenges for me since I moved up into Tier 3. [/color]

Exactly also my problem.
Needed about 2,5 hours to get everything in the rifleman event ... beside KMDDs!
Started to play my crabs and got some KMDs with just trying to win, trying to get the daily double.
Then switched to Heavies + Assaults which were the way to go in Tier4 to get KMDDs.
But instead of the 3-4 KMD matches which I remember in the Dakkacrab, somehow things started to get bad (beside some KMDDs with my stalkers).
While trying to focus on DMG i got killed so often so fast, started to loose patience.
When I took a slow Assault with AC20 + SRM, Polar map was chosen...
With Direwolf on canyon network I was put in a outer lance with 2 Locusts and a cheetah. The obvious thing happened, soon enemy found me, and although the cheetah tried to save me the match did not last long for me...

I even tried that suicidal tactic 1-2 times. (for that my timberwolf-s with 5 MPL + 4x6SRM is quite good), ok got some KMDs even win but there was a bad taste left.

After 2 hours of disappointed game I decided to at least get the daily double for my leveling Cataphract 0xp...
Trying to play again the "usual" way --- more cautious..
lost another 2 games, but ... hell yay!
700dmg, 1 KMDD, 1 Kill
850 DMG, 3 KMDD, 3 Kill ... last survivor - FUN
then 3rd game won, but my whole team rolled over enemy - my contribution was nothing extraordinary.

Conclusion, just try to play as usual and KMDDs will hopefully flow over time (need 7 more atm), but it is really hard to ignore that KMDD tension

Edited by aGentleWarrior, 19 February 2016 - 06:01 AM.

[Wildstreak]

Find the big Mechs and shoot the coolant out of them.

[Exard3k]

The best way to get kill most damage dealt is to deal the most damage to your targets!

[aGentleWarrior]

Exard3k, on 19 February 2016 - 06:13 AM, said:

The best way to get kill most damage dealt is to deal the most damage to your targets!

good point, I would even extend that by:
Make sure the mentioned targets are killed before your team gets wiped out

[DGTLDaemon]

Wildstreak, on 19 February 2016 - 06:05 AM, said:

Find the big Mechs and shoot the coolant out of them.

Yeah, finding an unfriendly assault who is friendly enough not to be shooting back at you tends to do the trick

[Not A Real RAbbi]

Best way to get KMDD:

Pick your targets wisely, and FOCUS them until they're dead.

If you have to disengage your target (his buddies came to get his back), remember that target and be sure to focus on it again when next you encounter it.

AIM WELL! And don't waste your aim! Sure, you COULD pick the arms off of that HBK-IIC-B first, but you still (last I heard) get the damage for the arm if you destroy the side torso to which it is attached. So focus a side torso, instead! It's really a great way to buff damage while still working honestly toward the kill; that is, carving off the side torsos (which take the arms, and therefore, ST and A weapons, with them when destroyed) is the right way to go.

But don't WASTE! If the enemy is already open and cherry red in the CT, then don't bother with its fresh side torsos. Just finish the poor sucker and move on.

KNOW THE LAYOUT! If it's a ballistic or missile mech, and it's not STOCK, then the ammo is most likely in a leg, then the head, and then the CT. If one of those components is vulnerable on your target, may as well give it a hard poke and see if it pops. All that ammo explosion damage? YOU did that!

Strike, baby, strike! Okay, so it may not be worth the CBills to you on a normal day. But if you're trying to fish some KMDDs out of a match for a contest/challenge, then air/artillery strikes are your friends. Use them well. A lot of players that have racked up a bunch of headshots, got a significant bunch of those from strike consumables. But what's more, they're heat-free damage applied to multiple spots in an area with splash, and require only an instant of face time to use. Your 10-40 points of damage from one round splashing/hitting that enemy mech? It's still YOUR damage done to that mech. So remember to use the strike when you find the right opportunity, and remember WHICH enemies you hit with it, and try to catch and focus one of those, so as to increase your chance of KMDD.

REMEMBER TO BE A TEAM PLAYER, THOUGH! Not going to do you much good to go focusing that Ilya Muromets off by yourself, if it means your team is getting slaughtered without you. Maybe you WILL get that one KMDD/SOLO, but then the rest of his team descends upon you, the lone remaining mechwarrior of your team, and you got exactly ONE for that match. Makes for a long grind, doesn't it? Better to stick with the team, help them out, let them help YOU out, and WIN together. If there are TWELVE enemies destroyed, there's a better chance of you getting KMDD on one or more of them than if there were only 5. And if you survive the match, all else being equal, there's better opportunity for you to get a KMDD than if you were destroyed out before it finished.

TL;DR- Side torsos, ammo-bearing locations, focus fire, good aim, strikes, teamwork.

[Khereg]

In my experience, getting KMDD's really relies on a few key variables:

* Having a high alpha build that lets you put a lot of damage into a single target in a short amount of time (e.g. bring brawlers, ambushers - avoid harassers and low dps builds)

* Trying to stay on a single target until it it goes down before switching

* Choosing targets that require less damage to take down, but remain easy to hit (e.g. slower lights, most mediums, fragile heavies running XL engines)

If you are really focused on the KMDD and don't care about the larger win/loss, these things will pretty much guarantee at least one KMDD per match, assuming you can maneuver to ambush at least one suitable mech and ensure it dies before you go down. Your team can clean up after you if you put a lot of damage into one opponent but die before getting the kill, but if you die too quickly your team may get rolled and may not kill the mech you heavily wounded.

Edited to add: you did mention "without compromising other aspects of the match" to which I would say playing an ambush style doesn't have to be selfish. If you effectively jump an opponent and have some help, you can easily survive to cool down and move on to the next target. I personally use a 13 SPL stormcrow that can dish out 150+ damage in 5 seconds before needing to cool off. It can easily get 1 - 2 KMDD's match (or more if things go well) and I don't think my teams suffer for my running it.

Edited by Khereg, 19 February 2016 - 08:09 AM.

[Jeffrey Wilder]

DGTLDaemon, on 19 February 2016 - 03:55 AM, said:

So I was reading the discussion topic for the current Rifleman event, and a couple of lines caught my eye:



And everything in that paragraph seemed reasonable to me, except for the "1-2 KMDD" part. Actually, getting KMDDs has become the most difficult component of event challenges for me since I moved up into Tier 3. At long range, enemy players just don't stay in the open long enough to deal sustained damage to them. At medium to short range, you are either focusing an enemy mech with your teammates (with no guarantees that you'll end up the one dealing the most damage), or pursuing a single enemy on your own, which can lead to all kinds of problems (running into enemy ambushes, being outgunned by a heavier mech or outrun by a lighter one etc.). So far, the only tactic that I've found to work is to take my good old 2xcERLL + 2xcUAC/5 Hellbringer and just go crazy aggressive with it. I mean - maniacal. Like abandoning all caution, forgetting about teamwork and just fixating on one thing: to find myself a target and pursue it relentlessly until either of us goes down. Rinse and repeat. It tends to get the job done, and does provide some memorable experiences (ever seen an 85-ton Warhawk literally running away from a UAC-spamming 65-ton Hellbringer?), but it's kind of ruining my matches, both in terms of personal enjoyment and my contribution to the team.

In view of the above, I'd really appreciate other member's thoughts on: what is the best way to get the most KMDDs in the shortest possible amount of time at higher PSR tiers without compromising other aspects of the match? What weapons or weapon combinations tend to get more KMDDs? What tactics work best, in your experience? Maybe someone can suggest specific builds? I'm currently running a 4xcLPL Warhawk, a 2xcERLL + 2xcUAC/5 Hellbringer (also have a 4xcERML + 2xcUAC/5 version for closer-range work in CW), a 2xcLPL Shadow Cat and a 2xcERLL Arctic Cheetah. The Shadow Cat and the Cheetah seem no good at grinding KMDDs, for obvious reasons, although I just might be using them in a wrong way. The Warhawk sometimes works well because of its sheer firepower, but requires good teamwork (as all assaults do) which doesn't always happen in Quick Play. My best bet is currently the Hellbringer, but it forces me into a playstyle which would probably get me institutionalized in real life So, any advice or thoughts, however general they might be, will be greatly appreciated

I always seem to clear my KMDD first and assist last; Maybe I just kill too efficiently.

[jss78]

This goes squarely against what you're supposed to tell new players, but I've found "lurmisher" type LRM mechs highly effective at farming KMDD's.

"Lurmishers" are generally understood to be relatively light, highly mobile LRM boats, which pack reasonable direct-fire weaponry too. They are typically played as mid-range LRM boats which relocate frequently to maintain unobstructed missile trajectories. I find them great at pounding in raw damage, even at Tier 2 where LRM's are supposed to be useless. Either using LRM's alone, but preferably using LRM's and direct-fire weapons at the same time.

Example gameplay below (using a Jagermech-A):

Spoiler

Edited by jss78, 19 February 2016 - 08:21 AM.

[aGentleWarrior]

Jeffrey Wilder, on 19 February 2016 - 08:01 AM, said:

I always seem to clear my KMDD first and assist last; Maybe I just kill too efficiently.

That contributes to the Khereg's thesis that Harrassers are KMDD contraproductive.
Unfortunately that playstyles suits me more. I have often 8-9 assists per match, usually less then 2 kills, and likely an average of 0.5 KMDD per match.

@jss78 ... yep however good Lurmishing on tier 3 is much harder then brawling

Edited by aGentleWarrior, 19 February 2016 - 08:24 AM.

[KodiakGW]

Zionkan, on 19 February 2016 - 04:14 AM, said:

Try midrange Lazor Builds (er ml / lpl)

This. I've had people question why I only ran 3 LPL on a Marauder, then they see my damage at the end. When I drop with a decent PUG, I can sustain a good poke-while-moving tactic and get 3-4 KMMD.

Now, if your drops are all stomped/stomps, you won't get a lot of KMMD.

[Zookeeper Dan]

I know it's a different tier, but I've been getting my KMMD's in a Streakcrow and hunting lights. 2-3 alpha and they are dead or easy pickings for someone else and you'll still have highest damage.

[Jeffrey Wilder]

aGentleWarrior, on 19 February 2016 - 08:23 AM, said:

That contributes to the Khereg's thesis that Harrassers are KMDD contraproductive.
Unfortunately that playstyles suits me more. I have often 8-9 assists per match, usually less then 2 kills, and likely an average of 0.5 KMDD per match.

@jss78 ... yep however good Lurmishing on tier 3 is much harder then brawling

I kill with the least damage even if it's not event time and I mean pretty fresh enemies, not end of match.

Had a match where I saw an enemy 6xLRM5 MDD which did a miserable 97 damage. I really wonder why people still bring LRMs to events.

A confirm kill means KMDD, LRMs are just so inefficient.

[Khereg]

Zookeeper Dan, on 19 February 2016 - 08:34 AM, said:

I know it's a different tier, but I've been getting my KMMD's in a Streakcrow and hunting lights. 2-3 alpha and they are dead or easy pickings for someone else and you'll still have highest damage.

I would say that this is the exact definition of an ambush playstyle. You're attacking targets that take relatively little damage to kill and using a build that avoids the issue of being inaccurate when trying to shoot a bouncing, fast-moving light. I use SPL's, you use streaks. Tomayto, tomahto. Good on you.

[Jeffrey Wilder]

jss78, on 19 February 2016 - 08:20 AM, said:

This goes squarely against what you're supposed to tell new players, but I've found "lurmisher" type LRM mechs highly effective at farming KMDD's.

"Lurmishers" are generally understood to be relatively light, highly mobile LRM boats, which pack reasonable direct-fire weaponry too. They are typically played as mid-range LRM boats which relocate frequently to maintain unobstructed missile trajectories. I find them great at pounding in raw damage, even at Tier 2 where LRM's are supposed to be useless. Either using LRM's alone, but preferably using LRM's and direct-fire weapons at the same time.

Example gameplay below (using a Jagermech-A):

Spoiler

This is more like it; Plenty of LRM boats I see are 1/3 of your skill.

[NRP]

How to get KMDD? Shoot enemy mechs. A lot.