47 replies to this topic

[SplashDown]

3xnihilo, on 07 March 2016 - 09:20 AM, said:

So I know conventional wisdom says buy 3 variants of a chassis, get the one(s) you like to elite and move on to the next chassis. However, after the skill tree nerf, is this still the best strategy? Especially for a newer player or an alternate account where one is limited on options starting out. Case in point: on my clan account right now I own 1 hellbringer and that is it. There are many clan mechs I would like to try out, but my instinct is to buy 2 more hellbringers. Since this is not my main account I am looking at a significant amount of time to actually save the cbills and level those mechs. So the impatient side of me says: "Buy more, different mechs! The skill tree doesn't make much difference anymore!" So, back to my original question, is it still worth taking the time to elite a chassis before moving on to the next?

IMO the elite skills arent worth the trouble..only 2 of them are slightly usefull...and the last mech mod slot is not a big deal..so unless you intend to use the mech for CW i personaly dont see a need to master a mech or elite it....save ur C-Bills for a mech you know ur going to use in CW...especialy if ur gonna use 2-3 varients of the same mech in CW

[Mcgral18]

Burke IV, on 07 March 2016 - 12:19 PM, said:

so does pinpoint actually do anything yet? Sorry if this is a little ot

It gives you doubled basics...so, no.

[Dan Nashe]

Assuming we're using the same terminology. I call buying all 4 elite skills "eliting" but some people call unlocking elite skills eliting (i.e. buying all 8 basic skills).

You should unlock elite skills on any mech you play. To purchase the 4 elite skills, you must purchase all 8 basic skills on 3 variants.

After you purchase all 4 elite skills on one variant, you doublet he effect of the basic skills on that variant.

So if you want to play a cataphract 3D, you buy the 3d and two other cataphracts. Then buy the 8 basic skills on the other two cataphracts. Then strip all the equipment from the 2 extra cataphracts and sell them or (if you can afford the $2 mechbays) keep them but don't play them.

But yes, absolutely important to get the elite skills. Also, if you aren't going to play enough to get speed tweak, why would you even want the mech? Having 8500 skill points and not being able to buy skills would be frustrating. But mostly speed tweak plus doubled basics is a difference you can really feel. It matters.

*Note, never sell engines. Unless you want to spend a ton of real $$$ to convert champions to cbills. Strip the mech, sell the unused chassis.

*You can save money by just tweaking the mechs you don't care about to earn basics. Max torso armor tweak weapons for 1.2 heat efficiency. But at $2 a mechbay, you may not want to sell. Meta change.

Edited by Dan Nashe, 07 March 2016 - 12:33 PM.

[Sandpit]

Mcgral18, on 07 March 2016 - 12:26 PM, said:

It gives you doubled basics...so, no.

NOPE

they reduced the bonus from double. I want to say it's in the 10-15% range now

[Burke IV]

If there was a gameplay manual, updated with every patch, there would be much less confusion. How is anybody supposed to know whats going on atm

[Jables McBarty]

I'd say it's worth it for the 'mechs you love. I'm in this conundrum right now, since I've saved up enough to buy a third direwolf. Is it worth the third direwolf? Should I try to elite my EBJ, MDD, or TBRs instead? Get an IS Assault? Get a 3pack of IS mediums?

I've mostly bought singles on impulse and elited the ones I liked. So I have 3 ACHs, JR7s, LCTs and UMs, but only one SDR, MLX, EBJ, AS7, MDD. And I've never really regretted it. However...

Whatever people say, there is a salient difference between a basic'd and elite'd 'mech. How it scales compared to previous iterations is not for me to say. But case in point:

My friend and I went 1v1 in TBRs on one of the new Solaris maps. His was mastered, mine was only basic'd. As we were circling, I could barely keep him in my sights, even with jumpjet repositioning, and he rekked me. And in general he concedes that I am the better pilot. People have been talking about heat and speed, both of which are important, but the double Anchor Turn and Twist X are especially important for brawlers that rely on that agility.

[Jables McBarty]

Dan Nashe, on 07 March 2016 - 12:28 PM, said:

Having 8500 skill points and not being able to buy skills would be frustrating.

Lol, I have 100,000+ points on my TBR-C, 45,000 on my DWF-F, probably a similar amount on my MDD-Prime. I've just always looked at the price tag to get two more and thought "But look at all the shiny new Light Mechs I could get for that money...." Really helps mitigate the frustration.

[Sandpit]

Dan Nashe, on 07 March 2016 - 12:28 PM, said:

Having 8500 skill points and not being able to buy skills would be frustrating.

pffft

try having hundreds of thousands of skill points on a mech with nothing to spend it on

Burke IV, on 07 March 2016 - 12:40 PM, said:

If there was a gameplay manual, updated with every patch, there would be much less confusion. How is anybody supposed to know whats going on atm

relying on some of us faithful forumites to spread the info here on the forums honestly.

PGI never has and, apparently, never will be real great at spreading info to the community (although it's better than it used to be)

Jables McBarty, on 07 March 2016 - 12:53 PM, said:

Lol, I have 100,000+ points on my TBR-C, 45,000 on my DWF-F, probably a similar amount on my MDD-Prime. I've just always looked at the price tag to get two more and thought "But look at all the shiny new Light Mechs I could get for that money...." Really helps mitigate the frustration.

I've got over 300k on a couple of my stalkers and hundreds of thousands on several mechs

I feel your pain yo

[WarHippy]

Sandpit, on 07 March 2016 - 12:36 PM, said:

NOPE

they reduced the bonus from double. I want to say it's in the 10-15% range now

...
When did this happen? I'm pretty sure it still says X2 next to basics after you finish all of the elites, or am I misunderstanding something here? If it really is only 10-15% now then as far as I am concerned there is pretty much no reason to ever buy 3 mechs to get the elites, and the complete redo on the mech trees is needed now more than ever.

[Brimbooze]

3xnihilo, on 07 March 2016 - 09:55 AM, said:

So, a little clarification. My question is not if it is worth EVER eliting a mech or not, it is whether the priority is still buy 3 variants, elite them, then get the next chassis or if there was now more weight in favor of buying a few different mechs for a more diverse hangar before going back to elite your favorites.


Ps. The clan alt occurred because I am a Davion loyalist on this account and I am still holding onto a small hope that CW will be worth playing someday. So clan account for clan CW (I may be an optimist).

For my clan alt I grinded out the cbills to get 3 Stormcrows and unlock elite on them. I then bought a Mad Dog-A so I had a mech that could be a cbill farming LRM boat on Polar Highlands and also swap to a decent SRM boat. However, I'm planning on saving up for a different mech because other than basic tier, I didn't see as noticeable difference between basic and elite. It really does depend on the chassis, though. Brawlers, assaults especially (I'm looking at you Dire, Mauler and Atlas) really do need elite skills to really shine. Something like a Hellbringer could benefit from the heat buffs, but the other skills aren't as noticeable.

In short, for clan especially, just go with the mechs you want to play and worry less about buying 3 variants. Unless it's a mech you REALLY want to play a lot, or a Dire Wolf because them fellas are slow as molasses and need all the help they can get.

[Burke IV]

Sandpit, on 07 March 2016 - 12:58 PM, said:

relying on some of us faithful forumites to spread the info here on the forums honestly.

Appreciated when its honest

[cazidin]

Sandpit, on 07 March 2016 - 12:36 PM, said:

NOPE

they reduced the bonus from double. I want to say it's in the 10-15% range now

It's still a double bonus if you've elited the mech. They just reduced the benefits.

[JediPanther]

The only time you don't want to elite a mech is for the lol. As for master I hardly ever master a mech because by the time i get elite I never want to look at the mech and use a diffrent one. Same goes for upgrades. A lot of my mechs still have standard armor and single heat sinks just because i can do stupid and fun builds such as my awesome raven 4x ac 20. I don't need ecm I have big gun!

[3xnihilo]

GRiPSViGiL, on 07 March 2016 - 12:15 PM, said:

Since the skill tree and XP system is borderline pointless now it should just be deleted. I wouldn't worry about the minimal boosts for actually eliting the mechs. The benefit is so negligible that it won't show a difference on the battlefield.

They won't revamp the skill tree since they are terrible at actual game design, which is their job yet they kinda stink at it. Baffling.

Anyway, If the skill tree was totally revamped to have a reason or create some depth in allowing player choice concerning quirks and builds coined with the module system it would be glorious. And yet it always goes back to how lazy and/or incompetent they are at developing this game.

I would love to see the skill tree completely reworked. It seems so pointless to have to own 3 omnimechs when the omnipods let you make them all basically the same anyway. A system that had real choices would be great.

[Kyynele]

Speed tweak and double basics are still such considerable buffs to your mech's agility and cooling, that you don't want to skip them unless you don't really care about how you perform in matches.

[Dan Nashe]

I guess I should say it's not mandatory and back up a little. There is something to be said for buying a light heavy medium and assault, playing them, deciding on favorite, then buying two more mechbays and mastering one of them. There's no right way to play. But I stand by the recommendation that unlocking elit
skills is really important if you play that mech enough to actually buy the elite skills.
What I really mean is: if you have purchased all 8 basic skills, and earned 8500 extra xp, ask yourself if you think you'll play another 50 games on that mech. If yes it really is worth getting basics on two others. And you might find you really like those others. Plus on the omniscient you can use pods to modify stuff.

I admit I forgot about clan mechs. None were available for cbills when I built my original stable. I have only done this with enforcer since I got back.

But even on a stormcrow I think it is worth paying 11 million (assuming you sell for half in order to unlock elite and master skills if you plan on playing another 50 games in your ryoken after all 8 basic skills are unlocked. Especially since 2x daily xp makes the grind fast AND those other two Ryokens have dhs endo ff and engine tax already paid so they will all perform well.

Use trials liberally. If you don't care about skills, a lot of them are really good.

[Dawnstealer]

Kodyn, on 07 March 2016 - 09:39 AM, said:

This really shouldn't even be a question...

Yes, of course it's still worth it. Always, unless you don't plan on using the mech in question. Speed tweak? Double basics? Why would you not want that?

smh....

I wouldn't have been quite as condescending, but yeah - for double basics alone, it's worth it. You can torso twist faster, farther, arms move faster, etc. Yeah - it's totally worth it. Just grind through it.

[cazidin]

3xnihilo, on 07 March 2016 - 03:23 PM, said:

I would love to see the skill tree completely reworked. It seems so pointless to have to own 3 omnimechs when the omnipods let you make them all basically the same anyway. A system that had real choices would be great.

Personally, I'd like to see PGI either remove the skill tree entirely and make its benefits baseline or make it a general pilot skill that applies to all your mechs.

[Bilbo]

Sandpit, on 07 March 2016 - 12:58 PM, said:

pffft

try having hundreds of thousands of skill points on a mech with nothing to spend it on


relying on some of us faithful forumites to spread the info here on the forums honestly.

PGI never has and, apparently, never will be real great at spreading info to the community (although it's better than it used to be)


I've got over 300k on a couple of my stalkers and hundreds of thousands on several mechs

I feel your pain yo

I have millions on an Atlas. Unfortunately, it's only usefulness is not having to grind any other chassis.

[OznerpaG]

120 mechs into MWO, all i can say is piloting any mech un-elited is absolutely unbearable torture, for me akin to controlling a fully loaded 18 wheeler in a swamp

if yer just starting out you won't notice that much of a difference because you won't know any better, but after a few thousand drops experience it starts to hurt when you know you have to basic 3 mechs just to elite 1 or 2 of them

but i could just be a big pu*ssy too haha

Edited by JagdFlanker, 07 March 2016 - 05:10 PM.