91 replies to this topic

[Bishop Steiner]

ChronoBear, on 17 March 2016 - 09:00 AM, said:

You are assuming that you are running around solo'ing people? This is a team game no? I find if I stay with the pack, second row. Using the tools available I feel relatively successful. Fire support is not insta gibbing people like the meta ******. Fire support is putting damage on folks, keeping them honest, and harassing until the meta ****** can get to them.

Last night I had several matches where I did something like 700+ 2 kills 10 assists. I had a couple narc bonuses and a ton of spotting with my Tag and UAV.

If you have to rely on others, it's not a good build, sorry. Because unless you are dropping with a decent team to begin with, you can't rely on anyone else.

So basically, you stay in the back, and use your "teammates" as meatshields, and then spread damage ineffectually, and call it good.

Great to know.

[Dagada Moor]

Don't have Archer, but I do agree LRMs need looking at. The person who mentioned the difference between 15s vs 20s is correct. 15s are much better damage dealers than 20s because of the spread of missiles. You should have a limit as far as heat penalty on LRM 5s to be fair but straighten out spread and recycle times. I think they should base spread on LOS and distance.

As far as the P-Hawk being DOA, that is funny. A 45 ton Mech running over 130 with 6 JJ and 4 energy/ 2 ballistic hard points with ECM fully armoured will be a monster and a serious threat to light mechs. I can't wait. There so many ways you could go with this Mech as far as speed and armament. Please underestimate this Mech..............

[MerryIguana]

Playing archer right now is akin to playing IS mechs during summer/fall '14. If you catch my drift.

[Bishop Steiner]

MerryIguana, on 17 March 2016 - 09:12 AM, said:

Playing archer right now is akin to playing IS mechs during summer/fall '14. If you catch my drift.

But the IS was OP then! Gyrok said so!

[ChronoBear]

Bishop Steiner, on 17 March 2016 - 09:06 AM, said:

If you have to rely on others, it's not a good build, sorry. Because unless you are dropping with a decent team to begin with, you can't rely on anyone else.
So basically, you stay in the back, and use your "teammates" as meatshields, and then spread damage ineffectually, and call it good.
Great to know.

2nd row is not "stand in the back", you troll. Come on man, you know what I mean.
Someone with LRMs that is competent still gets up and takes hits.

So you invalidate Tag?
So you invalidate NARC?
So you invalidate the psychological aspect of missiles on the enemy?

Good to know you only now LAZORSOMGWTFBBQ ... see I can make assumptions too.

[Cabusha]

Didn't buy it myself since it looked like a 70 ton Vulture. Pretty much performs as expected from what I've seen.

[mogs01gt]

Bishop Steiner, on 17 March 2016 - 08:17 AM, said:

And really why would it have been fragile?
There was no mechanic in TT for fragile vs durable save stock armor values. The RFL I argued as fragile, because itwas described as such in lore (along with the Jagermech) and because both carried Light MEch levels of Armor. The Archer was noted for it's ruggedness, toughness and reliability, and carried near maximum Armor, in fact the same or more than half of the Assault Mechs in the 3025 TRO did. And more than the really Structurally buffed Marauder or Warhammer-.
Seriously:
Dragon- 10 tons
Ostroc- 9 tons
Ostsol- 9 tons
Quickdraw- 8 tons
Rifleman- 7.5 tons
Catapult- 10 tons
Crusader- 12 tons
Jagermech- 6 tons
Thunderbolt- 13 tons
Archer- 13 tons armor (That's for every variant in MWO )
Grasshopper- 13 tons
Warhammer- 10 tons
Marauder- 11.5 tons
Orion- 14.5 tons
-------------------------------------
Awesome- 15 tons
Charger- 10 tons
Goliath- 14.5 tons
Victor- 11.5 tons
Zeus- 11.5 tons
Battlemaster- 14.5 tons
Stalker- 13.5 tons
Cyclops- 10 tons
Banshee- 15 tons
Atlas- 19 tons
Out of the entire TRO 3025, there were 7 Mechs with more armor, stock, than an Archer. And but one were Assault Mechs.
Simple fact is, it actually should be TOUGHER than the Marauder or Warhammer.
It's offensive capability, while boring, was potent. LRms are lackluster enough on their own to cover that. But the fact that LRM15-20s are just BAD, further damns the poor versions like the 2R that despite being the "Original Missile Boat" of Battletech, gets...3 Missile Hardpoints.
And because of it's fragility, and quirks, it's categorically worse at the role than the CPLT-C1

When I said fragile, I wasnt referring to lore. Fragile by fact it has a protruding CT. Any mech with a CT like that has had issues in MWO. Its an MWO mechanic not a lore issue.

In Lore, it was a tough mech! Kell's withstood multiple alphas from a Warhammer! Well, a lot missed

Edited by mogs01gt, 17 March 2016 - 09:41 AM.

[The Lobsters]

QuantumButler, on 17 March 2016 - 05:58 AM, said:

The best LRMboat is still probably the Awesome or Stalker.

Best lurmtard boats you mean.

The best LRMboat is the JM6-A or the CPLT-C4




Ed. Which btw do death by lurm better than the Archer. The archer seems to do LRM's well by the looks, just not the best. It does have good scope for secondary weapons though. Maybe that's it's thing...

Edited by The Lobsters, 17 March 2016 - 09:52 AM.

[QuantumButler]

The Lobsters, on 17 March 2016 - 09:49 AM, said:

Best lurmtard boats you mean.

The best LRMboat is the JM6-A or the CPLT-C4

[The Lobsters]

QuantumButler, on 17 March 2016 - 09:51 AM, said:

Some get their own locks and make sure the lurmlove is touching all the right places. X

Decent spread quirks to the Archer would be enough to give it the LRM specialist vibe it needs. +15 or 20%?

[Bishop Steiner]

mogs01gt, on 17 March 2016 - 09:37 AM, said:

When I said fragile, I wasnt referring to lore. Fragile by fact it has a protruding CT. Any mech with a CT like that has had issues in MWO. Its an MWO mechanic not a lore issue.

In Lore, it was a tough mech! Kell's withstood multiple alphas from a Warhammer! Well, a lot missed

And that was the point..in Lore it was a tough mech. The whole original point of Quirks was to bring out these factors. (And to fix mechs that FASA artist geometry cursed to FPS doom!).

Seriously, if there was a Mech beside the Atlas and Awesome that was famed for it's toughness, Archer was it's name.

[wanderer]

They didn't have to make the Archer a god-machine, but they deliberately quirked it -worse- than already released machines.

BALLISTIC COOLDOWN: 15.00 % BALLISTIC VELOCITY: 30.00 % ENERGY COOLDOWN: 15.00 % MISSILE COOLDOWN: 20.00 % MISSILE VELOCITY: 10.00 % ACCELERATION RATE: 35.00 % DECELERATION RATE: 35.00 % TURN RATE: 20.00 % TORSO TURN RATE (YAW): 35.00 % ADDITIONAL STRUCTURE (CT): 22.00 ADDITIONAL STRUCTURE (LT): 15.00 ADDITIONAL STRUCTURE (RT): 15.00 ADDITIONAL STRUCTURE (LA): 11.00 ADDITIONAL STRUCTURE (RA): 11.00 ADDITIONAL STRUCTURE (LL): 15.00 ADDITIONAL STRUCTURE (RL): 15.00

That's a Cataphract-2X, and it's still got better missile quirks than every single Archer. Never mind stuff like, say the Orion or Catapult.

[Dread Render]

Tarogato, on 17 March 2016 - 03:45 AM, said:

I can't wait for all the people crying for refunds when the PXH drops. 'Cause lemme tell ya... it's gonna drop.

PXH ? What is that ?

[wanderer]

PhoeniX Hawk.

[Blue Boutique]

wanderer, on 17 March 2016 - 10:05 AM, said:

That's a Cataphract-2X, and it's still got better missile quirks than every single Archer. Never mind stuff like, say the Orion or Catapult.

For the 2 6 tubed arm hardpoint.

Face it, everyone wanted a 9 LRM5 mech that killed anything when the brawling starts.

[Bishop Steiner]

Blue Boutique, on 17 March 2016 - 10:23 AM, said:

For the 2 6 tubed arm hardpoint.

Face it, everyone wanted a 9 LRM5 mech that killed anything when the brawling starts.

uh..... wut?

No, I don't think anyone but the bads who hide back at 900 meters asking for locks wanted that. And weapons with a 180 minimum range are kinda terribad when the brawling starts?

[ExplicitContent]

Blue Boutique, on 17 March 2016 - 10:23 AM, said:

For the 2 6 tubed arm hardpoint.

Face it, everyone wanted a 9 LRM5 mech that killed anything when the brawling starts.

I was looking for a nice SRM brawler, that requires a certain amount of ruggedness due to the nature of SRM brawling. I would understand not being able to SRM brawl with it if it did LRMs well (by well I mean as good as what are currently recognized as the go to LRM boats).

I will admit that I do not run LRMs frequently as a primary weapon. That's the one point I will concede to those that say it's good.

[Novakaine]

Lurmers got unabashedly shafted right out of the door with the Archer.
I was sad now I'm just angry.

[wanderer]

Quote

For the 2 6 tubed arm hardpoint.

Which, thanks to the quirks are more accurate and fire faster than an Archer with, say, 2ALRM15. And that's literally on the bottom end of the scale.

It gets whipped on quirks compared to more logical boats like the Orion-VA, for example that can strap on, say 4ALRM 10...of course, most Archers can't even do that.

[Blue Boutique]

Bishop Steiner, on 17 March 2016 - 10:24 AM, said:

uh..... wut?

No, I don't think anyone but the bads who hide back at 900 meters asking for locks wanted that. And weapons with a 180 minimum range are kinda terribad when the brawling starts?

When everyone gets close together and locks are guaranteed, that's when you close to 200-300 and start firing.

Edited by Blue Boutique, 17 March 2016 - 11:01 AM.