28 replies to this topic

[Alistair Winter]

My team just had the perfect victory in Domination. Basically, we drove the enemy out of the center immediately, pushing them back under a hail of fire and assumed control of the objective.



A few fun facts about the match:

• The match lasted 3 minutes and 13 seconds.
  
• I got a match score of 71, earning me about 50,000 C-bills, 800 XP and no PSR change.
  
• Only 5 guys on the winning team got a 100+ match score.
  
• 6 guys on the losing team got a 100+ match score

Working as intended? Flawless victory, absolutely garbage rewards? Make Paulconomy great again?

Thoughts?

[Deathlike]

Alistair Winter, on 13 April 2016 - 05:48 PM, said:

My team just had the perfect victory in Domination. Basically, we drove the enemy out of the center immediately, pushing them back under a hail of fire and assumed control of the objective.



A few fun facts about the match:

• The match lasted 3 minutes and 13 seconds.
  
• I got a match score of 71, earning me about 50,000 C-bills, 800 XP and no PSR change.
  
• Only 5 guys on the winning team got a 100+ match score.
  
• 6 guys on the losing team got a 100+ match score

Working as intended? Flawless victory, absolutely garbage rewards? Make Paulconomy great again?


Thoughts?

Was it ever really good in the first place?

The Great Mech Depression of 3050 is everlasting.

[Ultimax]

Alistair Winter, on 13 April 2016 - 05:48 PM, said:

Thoughts?

Cowards ran from combat and lost.

[Tristan Winter]

Ultimax, on 13 April 2016 - 06:01 PM, said:

Cowards ran from combat and lost.

Thus robbing even the victors of their income. I don't think I've ever played any other game with a flawless victory is actually penalized. In terms of C-bills, XP and PSR, we would have been rewarded more for actually stepping away from the objective to farm the enemy team.

It's silly.

Deathlike, on 13 April 2016 - 05:51 PM, said:

Was it ever really good in the first place?
The Great Mech Depression of 3050 is everlasting.

At least Skirmish rewards flawless victories. It doesn't actually require you to pull back on the throttle to make a decent income.

[Deathlike]

Alistair Winter, on 13 April 2016 - 05:48 PM, said:

My team just had the perfect victory in Domination. Basically, we drove the enemy out of the center immediately, pushing them back under a hail of fire and assumed control of the objective.



A few fun facts about the match:

• The match lasted 3 minutes and 13 seconds.
  
• I got a match score of 71, earning me about 50,000 C-bills, 800 XP and no PSR change.
  
• Only 5 guys on the winning team got a 100+ match score.
  
• 6 guys on the losing team got a 100+ match score

Working as intended? Flawless victory, absolutely garbage rewards? Make Paulconomy great again?




Thoughts?

The simple answer is this... just like Assault - if noone comes back to stop the cap victory, ggrewards.

What you should aim for is to tell people to GTFO of the green circle with 10-15 seconds of a cap victory - if only to "farm the rest".

Shockingly, the old Assault method of farming the opfor is the optimal rewarding strategy (talking about getting off the cap when you're about to win - so you can farm the rest), except it's not a "base" - it's just a circle in the middle of everything.

Tristan Winter, on 13 April 2016 - 06:08 PM, said:

At least Skirmish rewards flawless victories. It doesn't actually require you to pull back on the throttle to make a decent income.

What I said is in reference to the Paulconomy... nothing more.

Edited by Deathlike, 13 April 2016 - 06:12 PM.

[oldradagast]

Didn't Conquest or Assault use to pay out LESS if the objectives were met instead of destroying all the enemy mechs?

And don't even get me started on the idiocy in Community Snorefare, where all damage dealt to the objectives didn't count towards your rewards in any way. Not sure if they fixed that, but it was yet another brilliant example of "objective based combat" that totally fails thanks to paying out worse for winning via the objectives.

[axe64]

i had a game long time ago back when it was a 8v8 entire enemy team did no damage 0 down the board forgot to add we killed entire enemy team to

Edited by axe64, 13 April 2016 - 07:28 PM.

[wanderer]

Killing the opponent is always the most rewarding option, regardless of mode.

[ColdPsyker1]

Alistair Winter, on 13 April 2016 - 05:48 PM, said:

Working as intended? Flawless victory, absolutely garbage rewards? Make Paulconomy great again?


Thoughts?

Look, I think the obvious solution here is to build a wall between the Inner Sphere and the Kerensky Cluster; and we should make the freebirth scum pay for it.

[SeaLabCaptn]

ColdPsyker1, on 13 April 2016 - 07:28 PM, said:

Look, I think the obvious solution here is to build a wall between the Inner Sphere and the Kerensky Cluster; and we should make the freebirth scum pay for it.

Don't do Drumpf kids, not even once.

[El Bandito]

Deathlike, on 13 April 2016 - 06:10 PM, said:

What you should aim for is to tell people to GTFO of the green circle with 10-15 seconds of a cap victory - if only to "farm the rest".

Judging from the fact the OP's side actually lost way more mechs than the enemy, I doubt they could farm the rest.

[Troutmonkey]

Playing the objective for an early win is both unsatisfying and unrewarding. Playing the game as Skirmish is always more fun and pays better.

Without respawns there is no real eb and flow to a match. Either one team wins quickly or the game plays out like skirmish.

[Alistair Winter]

Deathlike, on 13 April 2016 - 06:10 PM, said:

Shockingly, the old Assault method of farming the opfor is the optimal rewarding strategy (talking about getting off the cap when you're about to win - so you can farm the rest), except it's not a "base" - it's just a circle in the middle of everything.

Yeah, and it's a huge circle in what is usually the most important area of the map. In Assault, it's not so bad, because you can usually get your guys to step off the little base square to farm the enemy team, if you want. It's also not so bad because the tiny bases are far behind the enemy team, so you have to go out of your way to cap in almost every match. It's usually some sort of risk.

In Domination, it's completely different.

• If you don't step on the circle ASAP, you lose the game inside 2 minutes.
  
• The circle is between you and your enemy, and trying to avoid the circle is a huge risk because it means you're giving up the center and you're allowing the enemy to take it.
  
• If you're getting close to a cap victory, you actually have to abandon a good position, and it usually involves spreading in multiple directions unless your team is super-disciplined. The circle is huge, so you have to move quite a lot to avoid it once you've taken the center.

I do think it's dumb that a flawless victory in Assault pays peanuts too, because it's just bad game design. But it's not such a big problem in Assault, because of the reasons mentioned above, and also because it's easier for the players to work around the bad game mode. People learned to avoid base cap victories in 2012, kind of like a gentleman's agreement to compensate for an obviously flawed game mode.

oldradagast, on 13 April 2016 - 06:11 PM, said:

Didn't Conquest or Assault use to pay out LESS if the objectives were met instead of destroying all the enemy mechs?

And don't even get me started on the idiocy in Community Snorefare, where all damage dealt to the objectives didn't count towards your rewards in any way. Not sure if they fixed that, but it was yet another brilliant example of "objective based combat" that totally fails thanks to paying out worse for winning via the objectives.

It's still the same way quite often. If you take a light mech and cap 5 bases on Conquest, winning the match single-handedly, you get paid less than pretty much everyone on your team, unless you were involved in fighting on top of capping. Another obvious flaw in another obviously terrible game mode, but people have learned to deal with it. For the most part, light mechs will cap 1 or 2 bases and then start fighting, because standing on squares is boring and the rewards are terrible.

You still get a lot of matches where teams are complaining about light mechs not capping. Some light mech players don't want to cap at all, which speaks to the flawed nature of the game mode.

El Bandito, on 13 April 2016 - 08:06 PM, said:

Judging from the fact the OP's side actually lost way more mechs than the enemy, I doubt they could farm the rest.

In this particular match, we would have won anyway. A few guys on their team sacrificed position to score a few kills, and as a result their whole team took a major beating and was forced to retreat. If the match had continued, we would almost certainly have won anyway.

But the point isn't this match in particular, the point is that you can have a perfect match and be penalized for it.

Troutmonkey, on 13 April 2016 - 08:07 PM, said:

Playing the objective for an early win is both unsatisfying and unrewarding. Playing the game as Skirmish is always more fun and pays better.
Without respawns there is no real eb and flow to a match. Either one team wins quickly or the game plays out like skirmish.

Yep, very true. Although I should say "without respawns or dynamic objectives". Dynamic objectives do change games quite a lot.

[TexAce]

I still have no clue why the put the damn circle in the damn center of the map.

The gamemode would play TOTALLY different if the circle would be at the top center of the map and the two teams would spawn on opposite corners on the bottom of the map. (think of it as a triangle). It would then be a race towards the circle and the closer you get the closer is the enemy on your flank.

[Navid A1]

"F* you, F* your mech, F* your match and F* your victory" - Paulconomy

[Kristian Radoulov]

There is something to be said about this OP...until we get better maps with real objectives true Battletech style, this is the best we have.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Alistair Winter, on 13 April 2016 - 05:48 PM, said:

Thoughts?

dom is garbage

[Alistair Winter]

Kristian Radoulov, on 14 April 2016 - 01:24 AM, said:

There is something to be said about this OP...until we get better maps with real objectives true Battletech style, this is the best we have.

How about a flat 150,000 C-bill bonus for cap victory inside 3 minutes, 100,000 C-bill bonus for cap victoy inside 5 minutes, and regular rewards after that? If the whole point of the game mode is to make people immediately fight over the center, I see absolutely no good reason why the rewards should be terrible for instant victory. The only effect is to make people more cautious about actually trying to complete the objectives.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

The circle locations are completely garbage, the mode is so bugged that half the games I get it counts down the enemy's time when they only have one mech inside, so thats garbage, etc

[MeiSooHaityu]