78 replies to this topic

[Protection]

I agree. It doesn't necessarily have to be done for release, but having one would be the smart move.

It would greatly increase publicity (think of youtube videos/channels for other recordable games like Halo, DotA, TF2, CS:S, etc).

It would help people analyze games and see what went wrong/right, and how to do better.

And it would add loads of playtime for players.

[Eradicator]

devs explicitly stated it will not be done in time for release, they are interested though

source:https://twitter.com/...442038064492544

[Rodney28021]

yeah, i hope this is included in the future.

[Halfinax]

PirateNixon, on 31 May 2012 - 12:43 PM, said:

My only fear with this is that this would allow opposing forces to completely dissect your team's strategy. Sure this may not matter in some random game, but if there are ever any organised battles that have any implications you'd have a complete dissection of the opposing forces strategy after every battle.

That's the whole point of it. To work on counter strategies and improve your strategies. You can see what different teams are doing, and what works both for your own team and your opposition teams. In the long wrong it makes for a more skilled level of play by allowing constant adaptation.

[Teqheat]

Second that!

[PirateNixon]

Halfinax, on 01 June 2012 - 07:14 PM, said:

That's the whole point of it. To work on counter strategies and improve your strategies. You can see what different teams are doing, and what works both for your own team and your opposition teams. In the long wrong it makes for a more skilled level of play by allowing constant adaptation.

But that is unrealistic. If my force beats your so thoroughly that you can't even tell how we did it why should you get a free look at our strategy?

[Halfinax]

PirateNixon, on 02 June 2012 - 09:16 AM, said:

But that is unrealistic. If my force beats your so thoroughly that you can't even tell how we did it why should you get a free look at our strategy?

First off, it's not a "free look." Both teams competed in the match, and put in the time. Second, winner and loser isn't the point. It's improving your game, and team strategies. In your scenario, you to would have the battlerom and be able to watch it and see where things may have gone wrong for your team as well. Work out any kinks that might wreck your strategy against a more skilled team. My team would be able to learn both from our own mistakes and your successes, and improve and that creates a much more dynamic and competitive game for everyone.

As to, "unrealistic" this is how sports teams do it all the time. They watch videos of each others games to better prepare themselves for matches, and to find areas that they can improve.

[chainedbeast]

I think this would be a great aspect. If you could review this and reflect you will be able to learn. Just like watch a recorded football game to prepare the game this week.

[PirateNixon]

Halfinax, on 03 June 2012 - 09:20 AM, said:

First off, it's not a "free look." Both teams competed in the match, and put in the time. Second, winner and loser isn't the point. It's improving your game, and team strategies. In your scenario, you to would have the battlerom and be able to watch it and see where things may have gone wrong for your team as well. Work out any kinks that might wreck your strategy against a more skilled team. My team would be able to learn both from our own mistakes and your successes, and improve and that creates a much more dynamic and competitive game for everyone. As to, "unrealistic" this is how sports teams do it all the time. They watch videos of each others games to better prepare themselves for matches, and to find areas that they can improve.

But I'd rather this game simulate combat than sports as it is not a sports game, but a combat based one. I don't want to spend days of practice developing a strategy with my commander and then give that strategy away for free to the first group of guys that attack us. If I find a really unconventional position for my long range support mechs, and the enemy exposes themselves to their fire assuming they are not there, I should be able to reuse that discovery, not throw it away because the opposing force gets to know everything I did just because they brought out 12 light mechs to see what I was doing and be ready for my strategies the next time we fight. By forcing opposing teams to only see what was revealed to them live, you can still dissect what went wrong on your side, but also makes your info warfare that much more important. Sure, all your support mechs are down, but your light mech can still gather intel for the after-action evaluation. Maybe your losing, and your team chooses to hide a pair of light mechs shut down until the opposing force passes, then you can move out and see what they are doing behind the scenes. Sure, you lost, but now the other side either has to run a new strategy because you exposed theirs, or risk you knowing how to take them down. If your team isn't smart enough to gather intel in combat, why should you get more intel after the fact? Forcing players to earn intel adds to the games dynamics and rewards smart play.

Also, if you want replays to contain all info on the battle, you'll either have to have the server store that and transmit it at the end, transmit it live which leaves you open to client side hacks, or transmit two battle feeds simultaneously: one containing what live info is available and one contains all info that is encrypted and the decryption key isn't sent until post battle.

[CyBerkut]

If you are banking on making significant re-use of particular tactics / positions against forces that you have previously enocountered, you're probably doing it wrong. Expecting to keep such things secret in an online game of repeated combat is unrealistic.

Setting that aside. Players/teams who want recordings for analysis badly enough will get them. If the game doesn't handle it server side, then they can still have pilots recording the game play client side on their individual machines. Yes, that could mean that they would have to work harder at making sense out of it. However, leaving that as the only way to get replay footage also introduces a potential problem... that being pilots running FRAPS or something similar could end up being more laggy. Depending on how the netcode on MWO handles things, that might only be a problem for the lagged pilot... but that isn't how it usually goes with online combative games. Usually, everybody else suffers. It is almost certainly in the best interest of both PGI and the player community for PGI to handle it server side, if they feel they can do so in a feasible manner.

[Jaxwen]

zverofaust, on 08 December 2011 - 06:54 AM, said:

Please for the love of whatever god exists in 3048, include some sort of battlerecorder-type capability, so that matches can be recorded and then replayed and broadcasted. This IMHO will greatly increase the "meta-appeal" of the game, giving would-be presenters the opportunity to make cool commentary videos of cool and/or important matches for tournaments, historical events or for just plain fun.

Yes please!

[TripleHex]

There really is an in-universe "battlerecorder"... it's called the BAP (Beagle Active Probe). Here are the specs on it, for those who doubt me: http://www.sarna.net...le_Active_Probe . Whether it'll make into the game or not, well... that's one's up to the devs!

[Wildkarrde]

As I said in a previous post, I do not like the idea of giving away tactical strategy. This is a combat sim not football. You can have a debriefing with your own team about what you experienced in-game and dissect how the Opfor engaged you. To force this upon teams that do not want a camera following them around is a bad idea. Teams should have the choice to opt-in if they wish. I also agree that teams should develop their own strategies to counter a superior team. If they cannot develop a counter, then that's just tough luck. You can become a better team without having footage of the other teams strategies. I've seen mediocre teams become elite teams in NBT and the same will hold true here. The other teams that do not improve...well, that's just natural selection.

From my previous post:
You can learn how another team beat you by talking about it in a debriefing after a match. You won't know every single aspect of what the Opfor did, but you will know where on the map they engaged you, from what side(s), the terrain and weather conditions, what their mech config and loadouts were, if they were long range attack, snipers, in-fighters, etc. Kill cam is fine, IMO. I like the idea of having people opt-in if they want a match to be rebroadcast. However, I do not want a camera following my mech and or my lance around as we beat down opponents.

Edited by Wildkarrde, 10 June 2012 - 12:36 PM.

[PANZERBUNNY]

PirateNixon, on 02 June 2012 - 09:16 AM, said:

But that is unrealistic. If my force beats your so thoroughly that you can't even tell how we did it why should you get a free look at our strategy?

It's a game. why not.

We're talking about giant mechs that aren't destroyed when they are destroyed and you the pilot can't die.

realism has little weight at the moment.

Edited by PANZERBUNNY, 10 June 2012 - 01:46 PM.

[Supremacist]

zverofaust, on 08 December 2011 - 06:54 AM, said:

Please for the love of whatever god exists in 3048, include some sort of battlerecorder-type capability, so that matches can be recorded and then replayed and broadcasted. This IMHO will greatly increase the "meta-appeal" of the game, giving would-be presenters the opportunity to make cool commentary videos of cool and/or important matches for tournaments, historical events or for just plain fun.

And if storage is a problem, allow the user an option to immediately save the game replay.
If that is still too much, PGI should team up with fraps to allow us the option to begin recording before the drop starts. that way PGI uses no resources to save a video copy of thousands of games happening all the time.

[Wildkarrde]

PANZERBUNNY, on 10 June 2012 - 01:45 PM, said:

It's a game. why not.

realism has little weight at the moment.

The same argument can be made for the other side. It's a game. Why? This game just like many others can be a very competitive sport. Teams should not be given a look at how the other team operates except for the moments when they are actually engaging each other. IMO, the only fair way to implement this option is for both teams to vote in favor of the recording prior to match commencement.

[UseTheForc3]

As far as how "realistic" we can be in a science fiction universe, one could argue that with dropships/satellites in orbit, active probes and spy planes over the battlefield and various sensors and recording devices onboard mechs, no tactical strategy that is used once can stay a secret that will give an advantage over and over again. (For real military outfits that is, seeing as how we are being realistic here :-)

From a gaming point of view, tactics will develop as we have seen in other games. Teams will find strategies, others will catch on, implement and improve those strategies, still others will find ways to counter them. Because of the nature of this particular game, it will be very difficult to get up to 12 teammates online for a debriefing after every game. Not allowing a recording function will not only greatly stunt/slow down analysis of battles and improvement of a given team (which I assume will be primarily the function of a designated commander), it will also hinder pinning down and exemplifying of balance and gameplay issues, which are essential for the longevity of any game.

I can understand hardcore players who work on a strategy and want to reap the benefits for as long as possible. But do you really want to have a smaller player base on your level. Making the analysis of a battle more inconvenient will just drive away casual players who are contemplating joining or founding a team, I think. Are you prepared to drive that wedge between hardcore and casual?

For that short lived tactical advantage, are you willing to sacrifice the ability to rewatch and enjoy a good battle that you (or some completely other team for that matter) have played? See how your other teammates did? Do you really want to block the "possibility" of entertaining videocasts, MWO becoming hugely popular beyond our dreams, becoming a legitimate e-sport?

Anyway, all of the above is loosely based on my experiences with Starcraft 2 and I may be wrong on all accounts, so I apologize beforehand, lest my predictions should lie way off the mark.

P.S. I don't hold with the idea of voting down replays. What if you played a beautiful game and some d*** on the other team said "no". In the case of a tournament (who knows? can happen) the tournament management may withold the replays, but any online game should be available to both playing parties to do with as they wish.

[Schtirlitz]

Recording or replays should be present.

[Dammer]

That is a great suggestion! The recording would be great for hyping up or laughing at a blunder!!