38 replies to this topic

[M3 SABLE]

I remember Russ mentioning that that idea was completely scrapped for too many complaints, and etc. But if I am not mistaken, it did have some sort of trial period people were able to test out. If there are any people who tried it out here, was it any good,?

It still seems to me like a perfect fix for this game where the perfect convergence is a problem.
And never ending cries about laser meta ofc (though peeps will cry about whichever weapon-type becomes popular)


Plus, there is new kind of incentive for people to value mechs that posses appropriate sensor buffs and intelligence equipment, instead of opting-out just for the higher alphas, with higher count of double-heatsinks.

[TheCaptainJZ]

I didn't test it but it was pulled because it was too complicated a mechanic and it was too hard to convey to players not familiar. I mean, it got the name "ghost damage" after all.

[M3 SABLE]

TheCaptainJZ, on 27 April 2016 - 09:49 PM, said:

I didn't test it but it was pulled because it was too complicated a mechanic and it was too hard to convey to players not familiar. I mean, it got the name "ghost damage" after all.

ah, shame.

Well, i guess it is for the better. Now that i think about it, everyone will just boat ballistics, and i will have a shaky screen 24/7.
Laser meta for life lol

[Gas Guzzler]

M3 SABLE, on 27 April 2016 - 09:45 PM, said:

I remember Russ mentioning that that idea was completely scrapped for too many complaints, and etc. But if I am not mistaken, it did have some sort of trial period people were able to test out. If there are any people who tried it out here, was it any good,?

It still seems to me like a perfect fix for this game where the perfect convergence is a problem.
And never ending cries about laser meta ofc (though peeps will cry about whichever weapon-type becomes popular)


Plus, there is new kind of incentive for people to value mechs that posses appropriate sensor buffs and intelligence equipment, instead of opting-out just for the higher alphas, with higher count of double-heatsinks.

Nah it was garbage.

And really, everyone cries about laser vomit, but there are other extremely strong weapon systems, lasers are just kind of middle of the road range wise, so its a safe bet to bring lasers to public drops when you don't know what your team is doing or what map you are on.

[Sigilum Sanctum]

No. It was horse **** and needs to stay dead.

[Navid A1]

In that system a dire wolf had 238 m sensor range and could not damage anything beyond point blank with lasers!


In other words... that idea was bad on so many unholy levels.


Sadly Russ was upset enough to pull other positive aspects of those changes as well... such as target retention time boosts, and target acquisition delays.

[Mcgral18]

Navid A1, on 27 April 2016 - 10:23 PM, said:

In that system a dire wolf had 238 m sensor range and could not damage anything beyond point blank with lasers!


In other words... that idea was bad on so many unholy levels.


Sadly Russ was upset enough to pull other positive aspects of those changes as well... such as target retention time boosts, and target acquisition delays.

And the removal of the Magic Jesus Field from the Magic Jesus Box ('targetingfactor' set to 1, instead of 0.25)


Ghost Damage was pretty rubbish as it affected OPTIMAL RANGE of the lasers. If it was extended only, I wouldn't have minded as much (a bit worse than the non Large class Clam laser nerf, 60% IIRC, to the current 80%)

Combine that with needing to stare at a target for over 3 seconds (without the Jesus Box, just normal targeting) due to NegaQuirks (of the sensor variety) means you could never really use your lasers to full effect.

There were some obvious typos...I hope.
That 450M sensor range Cute Fox was just upsetting. If it was on the live server, it couldn't target a DDC until 112M, due to the Magic Jesus Field (removed on the PTS).



There was talk of the Magic Jesus Box creating a Dorito Delay (much like those sensor NegaQuirks) which would be POTENT for long range pokers, as those ERLLs may not even reach you, while his may (or may not) deal full damage.
The PTS just had Paperdoll delay, and no Dorito Delay, even at 1300M
http://imgur.com/a/sMhFE

Those were some results. ECM added ~25% to the Paperdoll gathering time
Should have snapped picks of the quirks too...but it seems the Jesus Box does cancel the bonus sensor range of the AP regardless.

[TheCharlatan]

I played it.
It was intresting, but needed A LOT of polish: coupled with IW it made certain builds and weapons unusable.
It's a shame they cut it out instantly, with some tweaks (for example, making it not hit small and medium lasers) it would have helped reduce the long range superiority of lazors.

[Red Shrike]

I remember it. Haven't played it though. All I remember is that as soon as it was mentioned the forums caught fire with posts ranging from well-constructed counter arguments to temper tantrums. Haven't heard anything about it since.

Edited by Red Shrike, 28 April 2016 - 02:31 AM.

[sycocys]

It was a fine mechanic, needed to be tuned to the specific weapons but it actually added an interesting layer to the targeting system and forcing you to approach fights differently - no more laser alphas at shadows.

But it added thinking to the gameplay and we all know that goes to the same place as having mission objectives with much this playerbase.

[Darian DelFord]

One of the BIG problems with it is it made SPL's damn near useless as a Jenner who runs almost all SPL's on his build trying to target every damn mech I am firing at in close range is difficult. Especially when your trying to avoid fire. Add to that when you did hit the R Key it does not mean it would target the one under the reticle but some random other mech.

Now it did drop damage and over all DPS for ALL mechs. I think I dropped like 100 to 200 points per match because of this one fix. Which made most lights useless. Even though people cried "Its not hard to hit the 'R' Key" When you are in a light, Trying to hit that one extra key when your taking fire is not as easy as people think.

However I still think they needed to leave the sensor stuff in there. I really wish my 35 Jenner did NOT have the same sensor profile as a 100 ton Dire.

[FupDup]

Ghost Range died the undignified death that it deserved.

Maybe some of the OTHER things from the PTS could have been salvaged, like different sensor ranges or red dorito times, but Ghost Range itself cannot be salvaged.

[Tordin]

Navid A1, on 27 April 2016 - 10:23 PM, said:

In that system a dire wolf had 238 m sensor range and could not damage anything beyond point blank with lasers!


In other words... that idea was bad on so many unholy levels.


Sadly Russ was upset enough to pull other positive aspects of those changes as well... such as target retention time boosts, and target acquisition delays.

Couldnt someone convince Russ to include the other things EXCEPT that laser/ energy weapon lock on, ghost range thing? Seems reasonable.

[cazidin]

Laser Lock a.k.a. Ghost Range was a poorly conceived, poorly implemented mechanic that would've achieved the often requested result of nerfing Laser Vomit by introducing RNG or another superfluous mechanic rather than adjusting base weapon stats to make their alternatives more attractive.

[Mystere]

PGI listened but not carefully. Many people wanted "convergence on lock" for all weapons, not "lock for full laser damage".

The rest of the IW stuff seemed fine though and as such was a shame to have also been shelved.

PGI, are you even looking? BRING THE REST BACK!!!

[WarHippy]

M3 SABLE, on 27 April 2016 - 09:45 PM, said:

I remember Russ mentioning that that idea was completely scrapped for too many complaints, and etc. But if I am not mistaken, it did have some sort of trial period people were able to test out. If there are any people who tried it out here, was it any good,?

It still seems to me like a perfect fix for this game where the perfect convergence is a problem.
And never ending cries about laser meta ofc (though peeps will cry about whichever weapon-type becomes popular)


Plus, there is new kind of incentive for people to value mechs that posses appropriate sensor buffs and intelligence equipment, instead of opting-out just for the higher alphas, with higher count of double-heatsinks.

Having tried it on the test server I will flat out say it was complete garbage and I am ecstatic that it is not going to happen. It was just terrible game play, and it caused most of the other things going on in the test server at the same time to be ignored.

[Astrocanis]

M3 SABLE, on 27 April 2016 - 09:45 PM, said:

I remember Russ mentioning that that idea was completely scrapped for too many complaints, and etc. But if I am not mistaken, it did have some sort of trial period people were able to test out. If there are any people who tried it out here, was it any good,?

It still seems to me like a perfect fix for this game where the perfect convergence is a problem.
And never ending cries about laser meta ofc (though peeps will cry about whichever weapon-type becomes popular)


Plus, there is new kind of incentive for people to value mechs that posses appropriate sensor buffs and intelligence equipment, instead of opting-out just for the higher alphas, with higher count of double-heatsinks.

I tested it. It was horrendous, particularly for snipers or assaults. Snipers because the damage fell off too quickly (pretty much removed energy sniping) and assaults because they couldn't bring their weapons to bear in time with all the radar derp in the game.

[MechaBattler]

"It's too complicated" Gimme a break. If you don't lock on, you lose range on your lasers. Is that complicated to you? No, it's not. People just didn't want their favorite thing to get nerfed. For as much as people want things to get better. They don't want things to change.

They also should have given the idea more tries and evolved it into a state that was more acceptable. The whole Steam launch put the concept under too much pressure. And all the diaper fillers pretty much drowned the idea.

[Cabusha]

TheCaptainJZ, on 27 April 2016 - 09:49 PM, said:

I didn't test it but it was pulled because it was too complicated a mechanic and it was too hard to convey to players not familiar. I mean, it got the name "ghost damage" after all.

Because pressing "R" to get a lock was too hard.

[Mystere]

MechaBattler, on 28 April 2016 - 08:28 AM, said:

"It's too complicated" Gimme a break. If you don't lock on, you lose range on your lasers. Is that complicated to you? No, it's not. People just didn't want their favorite thing to get nerfed. For as much as people want things to get better. They don't want things to change.

They also should have given the idea more tries and evolved it into a state that was more acceptable. The whole Steam launch put the concept under too much pressure. And all the diaper fillers pretty much drowned the idea.

Cabusha, on 28 April 2016 - 08:31 AM, said:

Because pressing "R" to get a lock was too hard.

Yes, based on the thousands of drops I have made, many people do find pressing "R" too complicated. They just cannot handle it.