289 replies to this topic

[ThermidorFallen]

Looks like my tag macro pissed off another player!

[FuDawg]

StaggerCheck, on 07 June 2016 - 08:13 AM, said:

My initial take on people using and defending the use of macros is that they have three hands, so cannot understand why people have an issue with an outside program performing multi-input functions for them. I mean, really, anything a macro can do can be done with that third hand, so what is the big deal?

I know I said my piece but that made my brain hurt...

[Ultimax]

Nyte Kitsune, on 06 June 2016 - 10:55 PM, said:

Please.. enough with the damn macros, I prefer that this be a skill based game not a game based on gimmics and hacks. Please ban the use of these so that matches are fair not aimed to those willing to cheat just because they don't like the game's mechanics. If you don't like the games mechanics, there's the door, let it hit you on the way out.

The problem is your inability to comprehend that if macros aren't banned or listed as being against the rules, then it isn't cheating.

[Aresye]

Nyte Kitsune, on 06 June 2016 - 10:55 PM, said:

Please.. enough with the damn macros, I prefer that this be a skill based game not a game based on gimmics and hacks. Please ban the use of these so that matches are fair not aimed to those willing to cheat just because they don't like the game's mechanics. If you don't like the games mechanics, there's the door, let it hit you on the way out.

I think you'll find the majority of comp teams don't use macros of any kind. They're sort of only useful for chain-firing dakka, making tag a toggle, and..........

.......I think that's pretty much it.

Sure, you could create a macro for a gauss/PPC boat that fires the PPCs as soon as you fire the gauss, but that's more of a quality of life thing more than an advantage, considering it isn't hard at all to do manually.

[Burning2nd]

NFL is better with steroids trust me.......

[Andi Nagasia]

Using a Macro is alot like the Color Blind Option,
does it help yes abit, but its not game breaking,

saying it needs to be banned because it helps alittle bit?
thats like Saying Color Blind People need to Deal with it, because their mode helps them and is cheating,

[Kaeb Odellas]

The best way to deal with macros is to make them not useful anymore.

-Getting rid of ghost heat makes ghost heat avoidance macros useless, so those go away. This is forthcoming

-Improving chainfire so that it can fire faster than once every half second eliiminates gimmicky ballistic suppression macros, since chainfire would then give everyone that functionality.

-Giving Gauss rifles a 2-click-to-fire option (that is, click once to start charging and click again to fire when charged) would eliminate Gauss macros.

[Troutmonkey]

1. PGI have explicitly stated macros are fine
2. Macro's are just keyboard input, and are basically impossible to detect
3. Macro's offer no real advantage over other players, and are usually for convenience (TAG) or for the lols (Earthquake sim AC2s)
4. Dakka macros would not be needed if chain fire for ACs and missiles actually worked

5. Is 7.1 surround sound headphones cheating? I can hear exactly when and where players / fire is coming from
6. Are triple monitors cheating? My field of view is way bigger than most other players. This setup has given me way more benefit than macros

[Nemesis Duck]

Troutmonkey, on 07 June 2016 - 04:00 PM, said:

1. PGI have explicitly stated macros are fine
2. Macro's are just keyboard input, and are basically impossible to detect
3. Macro's offer no real advantage over other players, and are usually for convenience (TAG) or for the lols (Earthquake sim AC2s)
4. Dakka macros would not be needed if chain fire for ACs and missiles actually worked

5. Is 7.1 surround sound headphones cheating? I can hear exactly when and where players / fire is coming from
6. Are triple monitors cheating? My field of view is way bigger than most other players. This setup has given me way more benefit than macros

Macros are not that hard to detect but it would take some work to set up and is that worth the effort, since the effect is 'legal'. Like other things that we cannot see directly we can look at the effect it has on it's surroundings, in the case of macros it could be the player would have consistent optimum timings with their actions that represent the most efficient values in a series of cases.

Second, your system makes me drool and I agree probably gives you a much greater advantage than potentially overheating with macros.

[Mystere]

Moldur, on 07 June 2016 - 03:09 PM, said:

So, what would this discussion look like if PGI banned macros from the start? Would I be sitting here saying "They are banned because PGI banned them, look at my circular logic."? Would I still be giving the same points that they confer an unfair advantage? What would you say to support macros? The 1 fulcrum of your current argument is that they are ok because they are allowed. Frankly, that is a piece of **** reason.

I will just quote someone else as it very much applies to you too:

Ultimax, on 07 June 2016 - 03:28 PM, said:

The problem is your inability to comprehend that if macros aren't banned or listed as being against the rules, then it isn't cheating.

Edited by Mystere, 07 June 2016 - 04:46 PM.

[Lyoto Machida]

FuDawg, on 07 June 2016 - 12:30 AM, said:

If you can't aim I suppose it might hurt but if you can, it'd make firing a Guass Rifle a TEENY bit easier since you don't have to hold and release. It would also be consistent... a macro never accidentally holds too long etc. Aside from that, it's simply not doing it yourself. Much like you don't let MLB players go into the batters box with a radar guided automatic pneumatic bat that swings itself. One way is playing baseball while the other is standing there letting your equipment play for you. However, some of us understand that lesser players will always need something they feel fills that gap. Sad, but very true.

So with your baseball analogy...is there a macro that allows you to check your swing once the trigger is pulled?

Using a macro, a lot of players (pilots) will be automatically swinging on pitches (firing gauss) they changed their minds on and taking strikes (missed shots) instead of checking their swing and talking a ball (releasing the gauss charge before it charges or letting the charge lapse and saving the ammo). I could be wrong as I've never used a macro but I don't know of any that allow you to cancel the shot once the decision has been made.

[Mystere]

Kaeb Odellas, on 07 June 2016 - 03:53 PM, said:

The best way to deal with macros is to make them not useful anymore.

They will always be useful, especially for people who prefer to use devices beyond keyboards and mice and/or who know how to aggregate basic keyboard presses and mouse actions into higher-level constructs.

[Mystere]

Sigh! Is this the start of another loud whinefest explicitly designed to wear down PGI until they get weak-kneed and succumb to the pressure. <smh>

[Aetes Nakatomi]

Everytime I see these macros are evil threads I can't help but wonder who actually gets killed by AC2 scrub robots so bad that they lose their mind and feel the need to get them banned.

I use Macros for QoL, 1 button press to chain/unchain groups, tag toggle (if for some deranged reason I am using LRMs) and such. I also use voice activation software so I can turn on/off vision modes, masc and such.

But I don't use them for fire groups... because the macro fire groups only have any benefits for shoddy/subpar weapons. I do not want to stand in the open trying to use 'machine gun' AC2s hoping my enemy is dumb enough to face tank me.

[LT. HARDCASE]

The macros available for MWO don't even provide a competitive advantage. Unless you consider not having to hold down the tag button to ever be the difference between loss and victory.

[El Bandito]

Helene de Montfort, on 07 June 2016 - 03:12 PM, said:

But i must admit that seeing so many high tier players defending macros made me laugh. If they want to keep macros, i suggest they remove all kind of ladderboards. Either FP ladderboards, or PSR.

High skilled players are that good due to their skill and dedication, not macros. Even if PGI decides that macros are illegal and implement a ban, those players will still be on top. People should get that through their thick skulls by now, after reading this thread.

Nyte Kitsune, on 07 June 2016 - 08:07 AM, said:

This is the problem I have. That and AC 5's and 2's shouldn't be firing as fast as my MG's. It's crap like this that killed PvP in Champions Online (Though those were genuine hacks called a "Speed Hack" which allowed people to kill you with a basic attack that would hit you hundreds if not thousands of times in 2-3 seconds). You can only hit a button so fast in reality.. Stop defending the macro's that allow you to hit the button faster than you can humanly do so then say "It's all right because PGI said so."

So OP thinks macro chain-fired ACs are game-killing? Then he is clearly not fit for this discussion. Even my wife knows group-fired ACs are way more effective. There is simply no way for a macro chain-fired ACs to have higher DPS or FLD than group-fired option.

And here I thought people would actually present a decent argument against macro usage.

Edited by El Bandito, 07 June 2016 - 06:16 PM.

[MechWarrior319348]

Rabble rabble rabble rabble!!!!

I support the main point of the OP!!

[Mystere]

El Bandito, on 07 June 2016 - 05:26 PM, said:

High skilled players are that good due to their skill and dedication, not macros. Even if PGI decides that macros are illegal and implement a ban, those players will still be on top. People should get that through their thick skulls by now, after reading this thread.

No! No! No!

There must be another reason why these Mechwarrior Gods bred since childbirth are being killed by these so-called "high skilled players". The latter must be cheating and macros are indeed cheating, in spite of PGI saying they are allowed! PGI is wrong in this matter!

Edited by Mystere, 07 June 2016 - 05:34 PM.

[Aleksandr Sergeyevich Kerensky]

Pgi doesnt have to ban Macross, harmony gold will sue anyone into oblivion using Macross (or anything else robotech) outside of japan! Dont believe me? Just ask Fasa!

Edited by Aleksandr Sergeyevich Kerensky, 07 June 2016 - 05:41 PM.

[Scout Derek]

Mystere, on 07 June 2016 - 05:03 PM, said:

Sigh! Is this the start of another loud whinefest explicitly designed to wear down PGI until they get weak-kneed and succumb to the pressure. &lt;smh&gt;

I doubt they'll listen, especially when it was established here in a similar topic awhile ago that Marcos are fine.