195 replies to this topic

[xeromynd]

Stuffer, on 17 June 2016 - 06:06 AM, said:

You misunderstand our concerns. I think many of us here can agree that the model is fantastic! I personally think they did an incredible job translating this classic design to the MWO aesthetic. However, our concerns lie in how the current arm hardpoints are being utilized.

For those that aren't aware, the PHX has a maximum of 3 energy hardpoints in each arm (depending upon the variant). The way it currently works (according to Russ and Daeron on Twitter) is that the first two weapons you place in the right arm go into the pistol first (single/double barrel) then the third will go into the forearm/vambrace. To me and many others, this is nonsensical. Not only does it not match their own concept, it also looks sloppy because, unlike other mechs, the vambrace hardpoint mount is still visible whether it has a weapon in it or not.

This problem is exacerbated when you look at variants which only have 2 hardpoints in the right arm. On these variants, both weapons end up in the pistol and you have no way to use the vambrace. Again, this looks sloppy in my opinion and tarnishes what is otherwise an incredible model.

Many of us would like to see them simply alter the order of weapon placement into the existing hardpoints on the arms. Instead of the first two energy weapons populating the pistol first, we propose an alternative. Either have the first weapon go into the vambrace followed by the remaining hardpoints going into the pistol OR have it go pistol, vambrace, double pistol. Either way, you end up with far greater control of the aesthetic and it maintains its classic look. With its weapons in the arms, the PHX already has lower mounts and in my opinion, the height difference between the arm and pistol is pretty negligible. Of course, I could understand that other people may feel differently about it.

For those that agree with me and others, get on twitter and tweet Russ. I created a twitter account solely for that purpose. He won't know it's an issue unless we make him aware. I kindly asked him to take a peak at our discussion here.

Thanks for explaining it, much appreciated. That being said, unless you (the concerned) cause enough of an uproar, I don't think it'll get changed. So keep on complainin' Because that's the only way stuff ever gets done

[Stuffer]

xeromynd, on 17 June 2016 - 07:02 AM, said:

Thanks for explaining it, much appreciated. That being said, unless you (the concerned) cause enough of an uproar, I don't think it'll get changed. So keep on complainin' Because that's the only way stuff ever gets done

No problemo! And I hear ya on that, as they say, "squeaky wheel gets the grease."

Edited by Stuffer, 17 June 2016 - 07:11 AM.

[Malleus011]

Stuffer, on 17 June 2016 - 06:06 AM, said:

You misunderstand our concerns. I think many of us here can agree that the model is fantastic! I personally think they did an incredible job translating this classic design to the MWO aesthetic. However, our concerns lie in how the current arm hardpoints are being utilized.

For those that aren't aware, the PHX has a maximum of 3 energy hardpoints in each arm (depending upon the variant). The way it currently works (according to Russ and Daeron on Twitter) is that the first two weapons you place in the right arm go into the pistol first (single/double barrel) then the third will go into the forearm/vambrace. To me and many others, this is nonsensical. Not only does it not match their own concept, it also looks sloppy because, unlike other mechs, the vambrace hardpoint mount is still visible whether it has a weapon in it or not.

This problem is exacerbated when you look at variants which only have 2 hardpoints in the right arm. On these variants, both weapons end up in the pistol and you have no way to use the vambrace. Again, this looks sloppy in my opinion and tarnishes what is otherwise an incredible model.

Many of us would like to see them simply alter the order of weapon placement into the existing hardpoints on the arms. Instead of the first two energy weapons populating the pistol first, we propose an alternative. Either have the first weapon go into the vambrace followed by the remaining hardpoints going into the pistol OR have it go pistol, vambrace, double pistol. Either way, you end up with far greater control of the aesthetic and it maintains its classic look. With its weapons in the arms, the PHX already has lower mounts and in my opinion, the height difference between the arm and pistol is pretty negligible. Of course, I could understand that other people may feel differently about it.

For those that agree with me and others, get on twitter and tweet Russ. I created a twitter account solely for that purpose. He won't know it's an issue unless we make him aware. I kindly asked him to take a peak at our discussion here.

This expresses the issue really nicely. Thanks for tweeting Russ! Your post is all he needs to read to understand the concern.

[Dee Eight]

First world problems...

[D V Devnull]

Dee Eight, on 17 June 2016 - 07:26 AM, said:

First world problems...

Indeed... Never as bad as Second World or Third World problems are...

~D. V. "Smart people know it can always be worse..." Devnull

[Desintegrator]

Oh man, look at these quirks !
+60% turn rate !

Fast and furious !

[Stuffer]

Malleus011, on 17 June 2016 - 07:12 AM, said:

This expresses the issue really nicely. Thanks for tweeting Russ! Your post is all he needs to read to understand the concern.

Thanks! I linked him directly to it so hopefully he'll check it out.

[Chroma-Matic]

Upon looking at the quirks the weapons do look a little lackluster, however, with the acceleration, deceleration, and turn rate quirks as high as they are, this tells me that this mech is intended to be a lightening fast fighter specializing in guerrilla warfare and being able to get in and out of situations quickly. I think the key is to engage enemy mechs using hit and run tactics or engaging a preoccupied enemy quickly while staying on the outskirts of a brawl.

[Dawnstealer]

Just at a glance, this thing might be a poptart nightmare. Hmmmm...

[Malleus011]

Really lovely faction patterns all round.

And double pistol on every variant pictured ... (upon closer inspection, those are all 3S'?)

Will ANY variant have a single pistol like your concept artwork, PGI?

Edited by Malleus011, 17 June 2016 - 06:00 PM.

[jper4]

ha ha mariks got the gundam variant

[Ronin13m]

Malleus011, on 17 June 2016 - 04:26 PM, said:

Really lovely faction patterns all round.

And double pistol on every variant pictured ... (upon closer inspection, those are all 3S'?)

Will ANY variant have a single pistol like your concept artwork, PGI?

Looks like they all will show that empty hard point even mechs that can never fill it. Really wish they would change there minds but by every picture showing off the double barrel I am doubting any thing we say will sway them.

[Vashramire]

By far not the first time art didn't match up to the model (Black Knight anyone?) and yet people still lose their **** even though the way it's doing hardpoint selection is far smarter than other mech since it fills top down. I'll give it to you that the forearm hump looks a bit goofy unoccupied, but seriously it should be function over fashion. I pilot some mechs I think are ugly but I love them because of how the play. Stick 3 barrels on the gun for all I care, it's going to need all the help it can get compete with the BJ for 45 tonners.

[Gwennifer]

Vashramire, on 17 June 2016 - 08:17 PM, said:

By far not the first time art didn't match up to the model (Black Knight anyone?) and yet people still lose their **** even though the way it's doing hardpoint selection is far smarter than other mech since it fills top down. I'll give it to you that the forearm hump looks a bit goofy unoccupied, but seriously it should be function over fashion. I pilot some mechs I think are ugly but I love them because of how the play. Stick 3 barrels on the gun for all I care, it's going to need all the help it can get compete with the BJ for 45 tonners.

I preordered the Phoenix Hawk exclusively because I thought it looked cool. I personally think that, due to its size and shape, the Crab will always be a superior medium. The arm stubs get in the way of looking cool and take away a large part of the reason why I preordered the mech :U

[Juodas Varnas]

Malleus011, on 17 June 2016 - 04:26 PM, said:

Really lovely faction patterns all round.

And double pistol on every variant pictured ... (upon closer inspection, those are all 3S'?)

Will ANY variant have a single pistol like your concept artwork, PGI?

I'm just so f*cking sick of PGI making these great looking mechs and then f*cking them up with their absolutely sh*tty "dynamic hardpoint" bullcrap.
It's embarrassing.

[Sparks Murphey]

Dawnstealer, on 15 June 2016 - 10:33 AM, said:

I still think, provided it's not Centurion-sized, it'll be just fine. It'll be able to jump through the sky and be relatively quick. I figure it'll play something like an oversized Spider.

And then in today's early patch notes we find...

... it's the same height as a Centurion.

[Scanz]

so sexy fraction camo

[Aethermech]

Sparks Murphey, on 17 June 2016 - 10:13 PM, said:

And then in today's early patch notes we find...

... it's the same height as a Centurion.

Yeah kinda. It's tall and spindly looking where as the cent is kind of fatty/wall like. I imagine the stance it's in will make a difference. And remember guys it's an over grown light mech. Not an assualt medium like the BJ or the crab.

[Malleus011]

Ronin13m, on 17 June 2016 - 07:12 PM, said:

Looks like they all will show that empty hard point even mechs that can never fill it. Really wish they would change there minds but by every picture showing off the double barrel I am doubting any thing we say will sway them.

Getting PGI to make changes usually isn't that hard, it's getting their attention that's difficult.

[Ronin13m]

Malleus011, on 18 June 2016 - 06:25 AM, said:

Getting PGI to make changes usually isn't that hard, it's getting their attention that's difficult.

True still hoping they see reason and go back to the concept art. I love the look other wise. Of course one of the ones I want to run this whole discussion wont matter as it will have 3 weapons in each arm.