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Highlander Iic Still Bad?


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#21 PhoenixFire55

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Posted 05 July 2016 - 02:40 PM

View PostJables McBarty, on 05 July 2016 - 11:16 AM, said:

First of all, I want to humbly thank you on behalf of all other posters in this thread for gracing it with your Tier 1, consistent 1K-damage scoring, eminently recognizable name.

Perhaps I should have prefaced my screens by stating I regularly rate about 500-600 damage in my HGN-IICs, and that an 800+ damage score was a euphoric outlier. With the agility quirks and structure buffs, I am now regularly hitting 700-1000 damage per game. So it's a significant bump of about 200 damage per match.

And I humbly beg your forgiveness for posting such paltry scores on the Forums, O GREAT ONE, but please understand that about 15% of my meager 3000 matches have been in a HGN-IIC, and the quirk love felt so good that I just had to share them.


Your sarcasm doesn't change facts. Highlander-IIC is a bad mech for too many reasons, most important one being the flawed hardpoint distribution compared to IS Highlanders. The only reason you even see mechs like Victor, Highlander or Executioner still having some mild success on the field is because they can be made into high-alpha one-sided energy/ballistic boats, unlike the IIC. Apart from the bad placement of those hardpoints on IIC, they also lack in number. Add to that the obvious too big and too damn slow and you get the idea. There isn't a thing that HGL-IIC does better than other mechs.

Nobody can argue that added quirks made IICs better, but better doesn't mean good, it just went from utter trash category into simply trash category, is all.

Think whatever you want tho, really. As I said, I got all Highlanders including three IICs, I like Highlanders, always did, but it doesn't affect my opinion which remains same ... Highlander IIC is a piece of trash compared to most assaults.

#22 smokytehbear

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Posted 05 July 2016 - 02:50 PM

View PostPhoenixFire55, on 05 July 2016 - 02:40 PM, said:


Your sarcasm doesn't change facts. Highlander-IIC is a bad mech for too many reasons, most important one being the flawed hardpoint distribution compared to IS Highlanders. The only reason you even see mechs like Victor, Highlander or Executioner still having some mild success on the field is because they can be made into high-alpha one-sided energy/ballistic boats, unlike the IIC. Apart from the bad placement of those hardpoints on IIC, they also lack in number. Add to that the obvious too big and too damn slow and you get the idea. There isn't a thing that HGL-IIC does better than other mechs.

Nobody can argue that added quirks made IICs better, but better doesn't mean good, it just went from utter trash category into simply trash category, is all.

Think whatever you want tho, really. As I said, I got all Highlanders including three IICs, I like Highlanders, always did, but it doesn't affect my opinion which remains same ... Highlander IIC is a piece of trash compared to most assaults.


I also have owned both versions, clan and IS, and I have no idea what you're talking about with the IS having better hardpoint locations. Almost everyone shoehorned the IS HGN into a LRM boat because it just couldn't do much else well at all.

The Clan version conversely can easily fit endo, sometimes fits FF, and always run a Clan XL, the IS counterpart on a regular Highlander being total suicide. Just to side by side compare builds, my HGN-733P carried 3 LPL and 2 SRM6a, while my HGN IIC-C still carries 3 LPL but instead of 2 measly SRMs has 2 UAC 10s, reaching out to ~600m optimal and even better heat management.

I agree in both cases the HGN and HGN IIC have too few of hardpoints. When you have very few hardpoints, its essential to have heavier weapons filling them. The Clan version can do this, the IS version cannot. As for locations, I really don't see a huge difference being honest. The gun hangs low in both versions, the left arm missile hardpoint is beyond awkward, and the chest lasers are still quite low relative to the cockpit. That makes it pretty situational and not well suited for peeking and hilltopping, but going from that conclusion to "trash" is quite a stretch I think.

#23 Jables McBarty

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Posted 05 July 2016 - 04:33 PM

View PostPhoenixFire55, on 05 July 2016 - 02:40 PM, said:


Your sarcasm doesn't change facts. Highlander-IIC is a bad mech for too many reasons, most important one being the flawed hardpoint distribution compared to IS Highlanders. The only reason you even see mechs like Victor, Highlander or Executioner still having some mild success on the field is because they can be made into high-alpha one-sided energy/ballistic boats, unlike the IIC. Apart from the bad placement of those hardpoints on IIC, they also lack in number. Add to that the obvious too big and too damn slow and you get the idea. There isn't a thing that HGL-IIC does better than other mechs.

Nobody can argue that added quirks made IICs better, but better doesn't mean good, it just went from utter trash category into simply trash category, is all.

Think whatever you want tho, really. As I said, I got all Highlanders including three IICs, I like Highlanders, always did, but it doesn't affect my opinion which remains same ... Highlander IIC is a piece of trash compared to most assaults.


I'm interested in what your trash tiers are, because I'd say that it jumped from the trashy end of the bell curve into the mediocre bulge, making it "not bad."

#24 Requiemking

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Posted 20 July 2016 - 09:45 AM

After reading the people on this thread, now I want a Highlander IIC even more. I'm thinking the Highlander IIC with 2XSSRM 6 with two tons of ammo, 3XMPL, LRM 20 with three tons of ammo, and an LB20X AC with five tons of ammo.

#25 W Ventilator

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Posted 25 July 2016 - 09:30 AM

When I do find the time to play these days, which is rare, I use the Highlander IIC as a missile boat.

4 x LRM 15's, 2 in RT, 2 in LA
2 x ER MED Laser's, I think one in each side torso
1 x UAC 10

I don't quite remember the ammo right now; as far as a missile boat, it seems fun, when I don't get the thing stuck into terrain pieces on that damn girders everywhere map. As it is, it isn't great; to me, the HGN IIC is a solid, no frills, basic performance machine that can actually do a little decent fire support, or, whatever one wants out of a mech.

I can Smurf something up if there's interest; the thing I'd change on the HGN IIC is the allowable hardpoints on the LA to be up to 3 SRM 4's. Other than that, I think the basic standard mech is pretty solid.

#26 Kimberm1911

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Posted 26 July 2016 - 07:41 PM

I skipped reading all the replies. Yes, it's still bad. I think more because it's only bad pilots running the thing now. Anyone that could make a marginally useful build for it, or could make those stupid(ish) LRM 60 builds that people run work have fled to better mechs.

Peace, and have fun

#27 process

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Posted 01 August 2016 - 03:27 PM

I finally had a breakthrough with my Highlander IIC builds. I started with builds that mirrored my IS Highlanders (Gauss+lasers, AC20+SRMs), but unfortunately the IS version does those builds better for a number of reasons.

The biggest problem it seems is that the IIC isn't well suited for fighting face to face. It doesn't have enough ballistics to suppress other assaults, it's not fast enough to run and gun, and it doesn't have enough hardpoints to boat anything effectively. People resort to LRMs because it keeps it out of the way, but unfortunately that's sort of a waste of an assault mech.

My most successful build now is a 3 ER PPC + 3 SRM/SSRM. The PPCs are fired in groups of 2 and 1, and it's great how they're grouped extremely close together and fairly high up. The 22 heatsinks make the heat very manageable. The SSRM/SRM do well for either anti-light protection or brawling if you have to. Basically the idea is to launch a constant stream of PPC fire until you need to move in. It's still fire support, but less passive than LRMs.

HGN-IIC

HGN-IIC

#28 Brizna

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Posted 16 August 2016 - 03:20 PM

Seriously guys it's not nearly as bad as most people make it to be. I would actually say it's a very effective mid range fire projector. Basically boat UAC10s + ERPPC/LPL + auxiliary LRMs. It's soft due to barn door syndrome but it has nearly the punch of a Kodiak. And let's not talk about Kodiak hit boxes, should we?

#29 gamejunky

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Posted 16 August 2016 - 09:32 PM

I do think they are quite fun now and can take a beating sometimes. Always be mobile and stay with ur lance and try not to brawl much and keep some distance. The build i use is that HGN IIc-c with three Large Lasers, 2 ac/5`s and a TC 7...max armor and heatsinks. Xl -310..average bout 400 -700 damage in some games.

#30 Garfuncle

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Posted 18 August 2016 - 06:15 AM

Best clan mech for quad PPCs on the A.

#31 VitriolicViolet

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Posted 02 September 2016 - 10:41 PM

i have all the IS Highlanders and 3 of the IICs and they are hands down my favourite mechs. they arent necessarily my highest scoring mechs but i tend to have the most fun in them.
The Heavy Metal and 733C are my best for the IS ones, and the IIC-C is great fun too.
they certainly arent meta mechs but it really depends on if you choose mechs for how good they are or what you like the look of.

edited: i tend to score quite well in the Heavy Metal and the IIC-C

Edited by VitriolicViolet, 02 September 2016 - 10:41 PM.


#32 Nerd Incognito

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Posted 06 September 2016 - 11:54 AM

I'm poor, have focused on heavies, and I'm trying to save up for some Timberwolves, so the only assault mech I own is the HGN IIC-A, which I got out of a supply cache (I was all smiles, even if the IIC isn't exactly a Kodiak).
This is my build. I've managed a 1.23 w/l with it, 1.59 k/d, and between 400-1100 damage per match (avg is closer to that 400-500 mark, though).

I use the LRMs while I'm taking my painfully slow walk to wherever the action is, and then keep just out of brawling range, if I can (say 400m), using primarily the LPL, but also the LRMs whenever I can. When my team needs me to push, I push. Sadly, I'm not as tanky as an Atlas, nor as damaging as a Kodiak, but you can make it work if you want to.

All that said (and some major grains of salt served up with it), I can't say the HGN IIC would be my first choice, or even my second, third, or fourth, for an assault. However, if can serve a purpose, particularly if you aren't just being an idiot, sitting back and lobbing LRMs from 1000m away, with no sight lines.

EDIT: I lied; that's not quite my build. I moved one of the LRMs to the left arm, so that I didn't lose both when I lost the RT.

Edited by Vulcan500rider, 06 September 2016 - 11:56 AM.


#33 InspectorG

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Posted 12 September 2016 - 01:51 PM

View PostVulcan500rider, on 06 September 2016 - 11:54 AM, said:

I'm poor, have focused on heavies, and I'm trying to save up for some Timberwolves, so the only assault mech I own is the HGN IIC-A, which I got out of a supply cache (I was all smiles, even if the IIC isn't exactly a Kodiak).
This is my build. I've managed a 1.23 w/l with it, 1.59 k/d, and between 400-1100 damage per match (avg is closer to that 400-500 mark, though).

I use the LRMs while I'm taking my painfully slow walk to wherever the action is, and then keep just out of brawling range, if I can (say 400m), using primarily the LPL, but also the LRMs whenever I can. When my team needs me to push, I push. Sadly, I'm not as tanky as an Atlas, nor as damaging as a Kodiak, but you can make it work if you want to.

All that said (and some major grains of salt served up with it), I can't say the HGN IIC would be my first choice, or even my second, third, or fourth, for an assault. However, if can serve a purpose, particularly if you aren't just being an idiot, sitting back and lobbing LRMs from 1000m away, with no sight lines.

EDIT: I lied; that's not quite my build. I moved one of the LRMs to the left arm, so that I didn't lose both when I lost the RT.


I would say use this build instead:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...efa07c4c69136bf

Max engine for agility(needs it), 3 hoverjets for agility. 3LRM5s because they cooldown faster and they intimidate Pugs for some reason.
Artemis is a waste on only 3LRM5 which already have decent spread.

Use LRMs on the way to the action, the 4LPL are the main workhorse.

View PostGarfuncle, on 18 August 2016 - 06:15 AM, said:

Best clan mech for quad PPCs on the A.


MMMMmmmm.....

Better than the Warhawk with its quirks?

#34 Nerd Incognito

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Posted 12 September 2016 - 05:06 PM

View PostInspectorG, on 12 September 2016 - 01:51 PM, said:


I would say use this build instead:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...efa07c4c69136bf

Max engine for agility(needs it), 3 hoverjets for agility. 3LRM5s because they cooldown faster and they intimidate Pugs for some reason.
Artemis is a waste on only 3LRM5 which already have decent spread.

Use LRMs on the way to the action, the 4LPL are the main workhorse.



MMMMmmmm.....

Better than the Warhawk with its quirks?



I don't disagree with you, but I already had the 315, and there was no way I was spending millions on a 325, for a 2 kph boost. I'll give the LRM5s some thought; I already play it the way you suggest, with LRMs mainly for while I'm waiting with a team that's picking its nose, or on the way to the action.

#35 Havyek

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Posted 12 September 2016 - 06:40 PM

View Postsmokytehbear, on 05 July 2016 - 10:01 AM, said:

The DWF gets about 4 more tons. 56 to ~52. Only. That's also with max engine in the HGN-IIC which will be almost twice as mobile in. DWF's can't carry squat because they have neither endo nor FF, despite their tonnage being higher and holding them back maneuverability and speed wise. I'll give you the Highlander's hardpoints are worse, but the C variant has more than enough hardpoints to make use of that full weight, in various ways even.


Please show me the HGN IIC loadout that can carry 2 GR+6 tons ammo, 2 LPL and 3 MLs. That's 45 tons of weapons/ammo, then there's the 10 tons of DHS and a T.Comp for a grand total of 56 tons of weapons and equipment (5 tons fixed in DHS).
With 592 points of armor.

I will absolutely give you the fact that the HGN is more mobile and agile than a DWF, but as a weapons platform it doesn't even compare.

#36 InspectorG

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Posted 13 September 2016 - 08:33 AM

View PostVulcan500rider, on 12 September 2016 - 05:06 PM, said:



I don't disagree with you, but I already had the 315, and there was no way I was spending millions on a 325, for a 2 kph boost. I'll give the LRM5s some thought; I already play it the way you suggest, with LRMs mainly for while I'm waiting with a team that's picking its nose, or on the way to the action.


I hear you on the engine, I upgraded my pack, got 3 hoverlandrs, and sold 2 engines.
The speed isn't as important as the added twist speed/agility.

Btw, if you have the Hoverlander B, try 4asrm6, lbx20, Lpl+erml.
I tried it as a lurm boat but that was horrid.

#37 Mole

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Posted 13 September 2016 - 10:03 AM

I've only ever theory crafted a Highlander IIC but I'll show you the build that I really wanna try.

HGN-IIC-B

Now before you say "Ew, LRM boat assault", it's not an LRM boat. I've had pretty rock solid success in many heavies and assaults and even one medium with putting a few smaller LRM launchers on it with light ammunition and then backing the rest up with brawling weapons. This works best on Clan 'mechs I've found. The Highlander IIC that I've theorycrafted would be played the same way I play my other 'mechs that bring LRMs but are not dedicated LRM boats. The LRMs would be used to inflict damage upon the enemy before I got in range of my heavier hitting weapons, basically as a closing weapon on the enemy or, in a worst case scenario, something to do while your team is camping. The LRMs have pretty minimal ammo so using them extensively will run you dry pretty fast, you're real objective while piloting this 'mech should be to close to bring your LPLs and that UAC/20 to bear at the same time on your target.

As you'll note, the heat efficiency is pretty low. You could replace those LRMs with SRMs but in my experience I have trouble with fire discipline when I get in range with a mix of SRMs, lasers, and ACs at brawling distance and I overheat myself pretty bad. With LRMs in the mix instead of SRMs though, I will be firing the LRMs at their optimal distance and holding fire with my brawling weapons, so no overheating there, and when brawling I will be firing my brawling weapons and holding fire on my LRMs, so no overheating there either.

Edited by Mole, 13 September 2016 - 10:07 AM.


#38 PAQUERA

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Posted 13 September 2016 - 10:06 AM

I use mines HGN IIC as a suport fire mechs. Using in C and B version PPCs and large lasers with LRM, firing from long distance and launching LRM when i have targets. I usually folow the charging mech giving suport fire. A version, if remember, is 2 large laser and 2 larpe pulse laser, always following the braves

I must say that is the worst assault mech in my stable. I prefer my kodiak every minute and every game that i try to play with HGN IIC, and sometimes i think that playing with HGN IIC is a matter of faith

#39 Requiemking

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Posted 13 September 2016 - 10:24 AM

View PostPAQUERA, on 13 September 2016 - 10:06 AM, said:

I use mines HGN IIC as a suport fire mechs. Using in C and B version PPCs and large lasers with LRM, firing from long distance and launching LRM when i have targets. I usually folow the charging mech giving suport fire. A version, if remember, is 2 large laser and 2 larpe pulse laser, always following the braves

I must say that is the worst assault mech in my stable. I prefer my kodiak every minute and every game that i try to play with HGN IIC, and sometimes i think that playing with HGN IIC is a matter of faith

If your using the IIC-C for Lurming with energy weapons, your doing it wrong. ALWAYS use your ballistic hardpoints when using IIC Highlanders. Not doing so is gimping your capabilities tremendously.

#40 Mole

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Posted 13 September 2016 - 10:55 AM

I'd actually be interested to know what some experienced pilots of Highlander IICs think about my theorycraft that I posted above. Take note of the way I stated it's supposed to be played though. The build really depends on being played right.





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