323 replies to this topic

[AWOL 01]

Bishop Steiner, on 04 July 2016 - 02:36 PM, said:

You and me both.

I think it really does come down to I was holding out hope for ARMA and finally have just accepted all we will ever get is CoD.

Which is fine. CoD and such is much better for attempting Esports. It's just not the game they pitched to get me as a Founder. I'm not bitter about that, I don't feel lied to, as some dramatize on here. I just accept that PGI has taken MWO too far down the rabbit hole to return to anything remotely resembling a SimLite, or even Ultralite, and the direction they are going, I hope works for their E-sport aspirations.

I'll probably continue to log on for my 12 or so matches a month. If they release one of my beloved 40 toners, I might even buy it just because. But I know part of my "sadness" has come from the Classic Unseen. What I hoped would be the return and first real chance to drive cherished chassis hit the reality brick wall of Meta Play. How many PPC Packing Marauders do you see? Next to none. The Warhammers about are all Dakka-Nippled monstrosities. Want a functioning Archer? Well, don't hope to actually use LRMs, especially those LRM15-20 racks they made so famous. But you can make the Tempest into a passable poor man's Black Knight or Grasshoper, Laser Vomit boat.

I will give them credit where due on the Rifleman. It actually feels and plays about like a RFL should. Glass Cannon, all Offense, All Day... but don't get hit because you will break. But too little, too late.

I suppose when the Stock Queue opens, I'll play that. Who knows maybe if it's popular enough, we'll even see a Stock Queue Event happen someday. How crazy would that be?

This made me sad...

I feel basically the same as you guys. It's just not worth it for me to log on and play a few matches where I get stomped because my team honestly has no idea what's going on. And I can only play with a group every so often, because I don't regularly have hours to spend playing a game...

At this point, I kind of just want to get a few guys together and mess around in private matches. Experiment with TTK by having everyone reduce their armor/alpha by half. Try new gamemodes or even a lore-based campaign. Limit the number of Assaults and Heavies as it's supposed to be. Things we don't get from QP and FP that we've been waiting for. I don't need more mechs or C-bills anyway.

[EvilCow]

We got mechs, lots of them.

We lack a reason to get more, what is the point? the same game over and over with slightly different mechs? The game is in dire need of ways to use those mechs, right now there are none, I just need 4 at most.

Make the pathetic FP/CW something more similar to the leagues we had in MW4, there you had to GARRISON planets and fight with what you had there.

See where I am going? reasons to own mechs and use all of them. Right now planets are just markers for random games.

[wanderer]

Templar Dane, on 05 July 2016 - 02:22 AM, said:

Have a look at this beauty of a match.

Enemy team has 6x 100 ton mechs. Our heaviest mech was an orion at 75 tons.

If I remember right that's 905 tons vs 630.

It's group queue. If they tried to match by weight rather than simply give weight limits by group, you'd never see a game.

[topgun505]

It certainly seems like as of late, every time a pug game ends and I look at the stats, no less than 6 people on the losing team end up doing less than 200 damage, and frequently don't even rack up more than 100.

If I happen to die, I don't disconnect, I spectate. And some of the crap I see is unbelievable. A pair of UAC10 Kodiaks hiding behind a hill never poking up or moving like a frightened schoolgirl, or loadouts that are too hideous to mention. It definitely seems like the general populace doesn't know what it is doing.

My best guess is that a sizable % of the veteran players have taken a break and loads of newbs have filled in their place.

Edited by topgun505, 05 July 2016 - 06:17 AM.

[EvilCow]

Or, more likely, the tiers system is broken.

[SplashDown]

Bishop Steiner, on 04 July 2016 - 01:34 PM, said:

I've been here since late May, 2012.

For all it's bugs, enjoyed the heck out of Closed Beta.
Soldiered through the Hell of 2013.
Persevered through a year and a half of Poptardery.
The Clan Invasion.

Etc.

But about a year ago, an odd thing happened.... I stopped wanting to log on.

What I notice... is I play 4-5 matches... then log off in disgust. But I can't quite put my finger on the issue.

Is it only one, or a mix?

I PUG for the most part so can't really comment on Group or FW play. But in QP a few things I notice, that IDK..were probably there before...but seem more pronounced now.

1) Epic Player Stupidity. I can't prove it, but it feels like the average player IQ has dropped by at least 50 pts. MM has always served up streaks of bad matches. But every drop feels like I'm surrounded by morons, now. Simple concepts like "shoot the enemy UAV" just elude people.

2) TTK. This has been an on again/off again battle... even in Open Beta, people would complain about Medium Mechs getting instagibbed. Well, it is massively worse now than ever.

3) Stagnant boring game modes and mechanics. Zero immersion.

IDK.. I could go on and on... but I really don't want to. I want a reason to play this game. But... I can't. Just logged on for 5 matches.... and same stupidity when I ran 4 matches last week.

Becuz of all the carebears and whinners wanting everything nerfed...nerf allways leads to a games death....always

[SmoothCriminal]

It's immersion (or lack thereof) really. The reason that Destiny, WoW and other persistent games are able to sustain an audience is by punching out new content and reasons to play. New mechs is not content, sadly.

EDIT: also, while I'm here, the fact that this is a BS thread - the most fervent advocate of the franchise and a solid "Grey" knight - is worrying.

Edited by SmoothCriminal, 05 July 2016 - 06:28 AM.

[Elizander]

I've never really gone in hardcore into the game in terms of play time. When I think of something fun to do in MWO I go and do it and I go do other things after that's done. I'm pretty much alone here because none of my friends play anymore so nothing to really keep me here when my small little goals are achieved.

That said, I'm not really being hit hard with disappointment as much as some people here appear to be. I've spent my share of dollars and probably will again in the future if I like the shiny things they put out. The people who I see going in hard are often the ones that end up disappointed or upset the most from what I could see in all the time I spent here from the very beginning.

People look at other games and see features that would be cool here, but we all have our own different opinions and we can only band together for rare things like really poorly implemented features and Urbanmechs. It's been awhile since I was able to log in to play anything (thanks, 7 gig texture update and limited data plans!), but it's nice to see that Tier 3 is still the same when I took my HBK-4P out for a spin to melt some faces (which isn't too bad since I can just relax and have fun).

Doing more than 3-5 games in a row has always felt like a grind to me unless I have a ton of ideas for mech configurations to test out. After all these years though you already now what does what. The magic of discovery of what new mechs can do is pretty much gone for most veterans, I imagine and no new features have appeared for us to explore.

I can imagine tightly tuned and well-balanced co-op missions (PVE) might get things going for some people if done well or have some other path of progression other than simply learning all the head hit boxes of the different mechs and knowing which parts of the map to go to for cover and terrain advantage.

TL;DR

I think veterans need new things to do in the game (getting a new mech and playing it is not a new thing to do). :3

[Simbacca]

For me 3 things:

1) Match Maker - especially since it relies on tiers/match score. It is beyond the point where it expects me to carry. I am average player. Not a great player.

2) Map and Game Mode Voting. Under the old old system (Beta) these were randomly chosen. This prevents the same map and guh same mode played over and over again. Yes, there are times were one can get the same several times in a row - but it is not predictable.

3) Community Warfare - Or its lack thereof...

Edited by Simbacca, 05 July 2016 - 06:57 AM.

[topgun505]

Robotech and Rifts. Ahhhh I remember those. Fun times. Actually, I think I STILL have the Robotech RPG books somewhere.

Bishop Steiner, on 04 July 2016 - 07:59 PM, said:

That's the key. Some people live Star Wars, Star Trek, D&D.

For me, it was the Battletech /Mechwarrior franchise. (Robotech and Rifts are distant runner ups)

I've been playing it in every way imaginable since 1987. Love the pulp fiction, the basic game, etc. Warts, flaws and all. The first edition source books are absolute gems for fluff.

So yeah, that had kept me invested. Hoping HBS can re-invest me. Though I'll be honest, their Dev casts haven't really done anything for me. How the game does more.

[MeiSooHaityu]

I barely play anymore as well. It just isn't the same, and like Bishop pointed out, I also can't really put a finger on it.

As an example, I am still leveling up my 3 Phoenix Hawks. All 3 are basic'd, but only 1 mechs has 1 Elite skill unlocked (Speed Tweak for the 1K). If this was a year ago or so, I would have had these mechs fully elites by now (possibly in one weekend). I basically play till I earn the 2x bonus per mech per day and then log off.

Now, I know the Phoenix Hawk has been a chore to begin with, but I have knocked out other poor mechs in rather short order. Now I just barely put in the effort.

After the Phoenix Hawk, I'll probably go back to playing a few of my favorites from time to time, but at most, I'll probably play about 3 hours a week maybe with weeks going by without playing at all.

I guess I'm just finally getting burned out. I'm not sure the exact cause, but it took long enough I suppose lol.

[Mawai]

Johnny Z, on 04 July 2016 - 08:11 PM, said:

Well contrary to the lies told on this forum, you don't go up in PSR unless you perform well. So PSR is not an EXP bar in that way. It does gauge players performance.

Its as good as it gets at this moment and going forward. Its the best match making system possible.

The group queue and match fixing can make a mockery of any match maker so that's neither here nor there.

Sorry to burst your bubble but PSR has an upward bias.

If you win with a match score over 100(?) then it goes up.
If you win with a match score under 100(?) then it doesn't change.
If you lose with a match score over 450(?) then it goes up
If you lose with a match score over 250(?) then it stays the same
If you lose with a match score less than 250(?) then it drops

It is true that a truly bad player will have a PSR that will go down over time. However, an average or mediocre player (like me ) that gets a match score between 100 and 300 typically will have a PSR that rises over time.

Also, one of the largest components to match score is damage done. Farming damage can be accomplished using LRMs and other less efficient weapon choices that don't contribute as much to directly eliminating opposing mechs as focused PPFLD damage or similar. LRMs will soften opponents and net an occasional kill (especially against folks that ignore them) but they are not the most efficient or effective weapon for winning ... they are, however, one of the most effective for long term damage farming. I'd probably be surprised at the number of tier 1 pilots that regularly use LRM assault mechs ... scary thought ... but it does tend to show that the main factor for SOME folks in tier 1 is not skill but efficient use of the PSR and match score system.

There is a reason for the current laser meta ... the weapons are aimed, they are hitscan and if you are good you can put all of that damage on the one component needed to eliminate an opponent. However, if your aim is good then you don't need to do as much damage to eliminate opponents and your match score is not as high. Some of the best, most coordinated games I have played in, the entire team had match scores between 200 and 300. They worked together, focus fired down opponents, and efficiently finished them off. This resulted in the total damage done being both smaller and well distributed across the team. (and these were PUG matches so relatively rare).

Also, anecdotally, the high scores on the losing team after a match can be due to someone farming damage after the match is over. I spectated a timby once on a loss after I died. When I died we had about 8 left to the opponents 11 ... we were stuck on the ramp on canyon (bad place to get stuck since the side with the heights typically has the advantage and cover in the peek and poke game). Anyway, this timberwolf was about 500m away sniping with CERLL etc (racked up quite a bit of damage spread over at least 6 or more opponents). The rest of the team fought it out on the ramp and left several opponents with open CT and red internals. After the ramp was done, the remaining 8 or so started hunting the Timberwolf ... he had no chance of winning at this point though I was rooting for him anyway. He sniped a bit more. Retreated, did some peeking and poking, the opponents did the dumb race to finish the last guy thing and the timberwolf was able to get several in 1:1 long enough to kill them off (but they were pretty badly beat up already). The last 4 came around together, the timberwolf killed one, overheated and died, game over. He had something like 1000 damage and 5 kills. Looking at the end of match screen you might have said he was good (actually wasn't) ... his PSR went up as a result of that match ... but it wasn't skill ... it was luck and choice of one of the most effective mechs in the game. I realize that it is only one story, but I have seen similar things repeated over and over. There are some truly amazing players out there with spectacular aim and real awareness of the battlefield and what is going on ... these folks are in tier 1 ... but so are all the rest who play enough

Edited by Mawai, 05 July 2016 - 07:05 AM.

[DAYLEET]

Wintersdark, on 05 July 2016 - 04:24 AM, said:

We don't have respawn in FW. Allow me to explain.

If you read WHY I don't like respawn in my posts above, it boils down to moving the cost of death, the burden of death, from the player dying to the team. You consume team resources in respawning; you cause the teams offensive to slow. But theres no real cost to the player, the cost is to the team.

In FW, you have 4 mechs instead of 1. But it's still just YOUR mechs. You dying costs YOU. It costs your team, too, but it costs you directly.

It's the allocation of responsibility that matters, much more than the fluff. And it does so both ways -

I'd hate FW if we just had 36 respawns per team, because then if I where playing carefully but billybob next to me didn't GAF, he could Rambo and just burn team (and thus my portion thereof) respawns.

From a game design standpoint, that's a good thing -if FW worked that way, it may even work better, as you'd avoid situations where you could have players permadead early - teams would basically remain at 100% until the last.

However, I just outright despise playing PvP games of any sort that way. I need that fear of death to get past the "This is stupid and gamey feeling" that I always get with respawn PvP games.

See:

Id also hate FW(well i already do) if spawn were a shared limited 36 respawn pool. The reasons respawn pool works in other games like Battlefield is because the number of "tickets" is so large that it is inconsequential when someone die and use one, you have to cap, it's the only way. I dont think ive ever played a game of battlefield where ive ever thought "damn we died too much" because of tickets. Technically they could remove the ticket for respawning. The side effect is you are more free to try things, play as a team with defenders and attackers and snipers etc. YES i said that, having respawn freeing you from permanent death actually put emphasis on winning the match with objectives, have a reason to fight. It opens more tactical options.

The single drop we have not does not in anyways remove ramboing, people disco after their death(why do you think?) and are in another match 2 minutes later. I spectate every match.

You assume if there was "respawn" it would be the standard instant fps respawn. Maybe because we have the standard TDM or because this is your first multiplayer fps or maybe someone wanted it that way in this thread?. It dont have to be, it can be worked. The respawn we get in CW isnt more engaging or fun or less rambo-enabling than to have factories on huge maps being able to pump out mech every 10 minutes. Lets say when captured, theres a cooldown to get it started to either repair/rearm or get battlemech ready for battle or it has the com to call a dropship. (disregard all numbers for now). Timer/cooldown and set of rule to be met to get mech in battleorder would effectively kill the "ramboing" because ramboes dont like to wait. Maybe you pay a fee for any of these things and you can only use the cbills you earn in THAT match, play better get more options, maybe even be the 1 Commander than calls Sat Scan or arty.

It creates en environment that can be worked with to get new people into the match and i mean people joining the current match. Forget your dropdeck, you now have a huge map for each planet, you have a long timer if any, maybe no timers, push them back, remove all their ressources and kil lthem all. You queue the spawn point on a planet and join the war rather than a small skirmish on a small map like CW. Forget any stats on this game mode, because in wars Statistics are those who dont come back so fk that.

im sure we can find problem with this system and we sure as hell can find solutions other than "nope i dont wana ><!". A timer pretty much takes care of alot of problem, a big map takes care of another part, sets of "rules" to be met to allow for the readying of battlemech or capturing of a base, satellite, comstar, cut resources from the OpFor. ultimately capture of a planet. This game could be deep and rewarding rather than just shallow quickplay/CW. 1 Life is great for quick small match with lots of restrictions like small number of mech, small map and low waiting time for instant action. I love it like that. It's however nothing more than an arena, a sport match, its not a battle and certainly not war with any consequences. You die and 2 minutes later you are in another map fighting another rigid 12 man.

I wouldnt remove the basic TDM 1life we have now but i certainly would have other game modes with depth and consequences that is engaging and requires teamplay.

Kubernetes, on 04 July 2016 - 11:19 PM, said:

I fear premature death way more in an FW match than in QP. If you die in QP, no biggie, spectate or go to the next match. If you die too quickly in FW, it can have consequences that cascade further down the line.

I agree. It applies to unlimited life game mode too when there's objective that matters. You die and have to regroup and get back to the front while you "let" the OpFor take hold of precious land can be desastrous, losing ressources, factories, base is far worse than losing your only life. You are not special, we all work for a common goal, your life should not take precedence over an objective in your mind. You should be afraid to find yourself in a losing battle and lose the match not your life.

Fade Akira, on 05 July 2016 - 04:29 AM, said:

Dont get me wrong i used to love battlefield, and had more fun on BFBC2

It was the last fun and well crafted Battlefield game. At the time i didnt even consider it a BF game but i got as much if not more hours in it than bf3 and 4 combined.

wanderer, on 04 July 2016 - 07:50 PM, said:

Please, tell me the people I'm seeing with AC/2 King Crabs, TAG and MG Locusts, and other quality builds running around in my T2-tier games I keep seeing are experienced, legit top players.

Your post has inspired me to create an Executioner with 12 11different weapon system unchained. Gota push to finish scouting first and then, this could be my reason to log and quickplay.

Kael Posavatz, on 05 July 2016 - 08:25 AM, said:

On the other hand, I'm starting to see a lot of...strange things creeping into QP.

I can't speak for anyone else but me here but doing strange and stupid things in quickplay is the only fun things left to do in MWO. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesnt. It's more like an excuse to log into the game, like those events im doing. No i dont need that mechbay or the trinkets but i feel like it's a good excuse to play, "maybe that game mode is better now so ill try it again"... I dont really enjoy the game anymore but i want to play it none the less for some reasons i cant explain and i have to find excuses. I don't think it's a good relationship, which explains why i have to take so many breaks now.

Edited by DAYLEET, 05 July 2016 - 08:45 AM.

[Roughneck45]

My biggest gripe has always been that the game has no substance. The world feels hollow.

We were supposed to own planets. Have bases. Fight wars. Have a stake in the BT universe. There is just a gold mine of lore and opportunity there.

But, we get the minimally viable mech shooting grindfest with mech packs once a month costing the same as a full retail AAA title.

I've accepted this fact, and I'll always enjoy mechwarrior combat, but I can't help but wonder what could have been had they actually followed through on any of their promises in the PC gamer article way back when.

[Zolaz]

What can you say ... PGI is mostly run by surats and surats are going to surat.

[dervishx5]

In regards to PGI & MWO:

[TheLuc]

Guys, the title of the game is quite misleading. The title should have been Mechwarrior Solaris VII Online, because that`s what we play since 2011.

If it would have been clear from the start I am very sure the game would be in a better situation, unless it was the plan all along to lure the BT fans and rip them off as long as the hope is there.

[TLBFestus]

Hit the Deck, on 04 July 2016 - 08:12 PM, said:

I also don't have such a vibrant imagination and critical like I used to be so I can just enjoy the game for what it is

I've been reading comments like this since 2013. The thing is, I've rarely read that comment from someone who's been playing for more than 2 years. In other words, people play it "for what it is", eventually get bored and move on, only to be replaced by someone else who says the same thing for another year before moving on.

Once someone gets "into" the game they tend to stick around for for an extended period in comparison to other FTP games, which is a good thing. On the other hand, new player retention is sucky at best, so the game just keeps treading water.

Lack of original content is slowly going to kill this game.

[DaZur]

Devils advocate... Absolutely, PGI is culpable for the state MWO is in.

That said, some aspect of this spiral into mediocrity is the fault of this playerbase, or more specifically a segment of it.

What I find more damning is that a good portion of this demographic has long moved on or been banned.

So I have to ask... Who's left to drive the direction MWO is heading besides Russ?

[dervishx5]

DaZur, on 05 July 2016 - 07:47 AM, said:

So I have to ask... Who's left to drive the direction MWO is heading besides Russ?

This man.