Next Quirk Pass Should Buff Weak Mechs
#1
Posted 29 July 2016 - 07:17 AM
More to the point, there are quite a few chassis that flat out never see play, whether its Faction War or PGI's tournament (which, while using May patch, few if any mechs saw a positive quirk buff, so the point remains). Mechs like the Centurion, Vindicator, Viper, Phoenix Hawk, Ice Ferret, and Kintaro, just to name a few medium mechs, see very little play. If quirks, and quirk adjustments are meant to level the playing field, then I think it's time for the underdogs to get a little love.
And yeah, cynicism "PGI this, promise this, do that, blah blah". I think there's enough of that on the boards as is. What I'm curious to see is how many people agree with this statement.
So yeah, who thinks that bottom mechs need to start pushing their way up now? What mechs come to mind?
#2
Posted 29 July 2016 - 07:23 AM
The Blackjack should never have been given the quirks that made it as tough as heavy to low assault mech in the first place, that was just silly on PGI's part. Just like when they gave the Thunderbolt the mind boggling 50% heat reduction to ERPPCs as well as giving them 50%+ speed to PPC's, that mech was never known in lore as a PPC boat, it was known to be tough as nails, and should've been quriked to be tough as nails.
I've always been a firm believer that quirks need to support the stock load out, stock load out needs to support the lore, and lore needs to support the stock load out and the quirks. The first mech where I feel PGI got it right for how quirks should be used in the Cyclops with the ability to boost your teams fighting ability passively.
#3
Posted 29 July 2016 - 07:28 AM
Aerei, on 29 July 2016 - 07:17 AM, said:
More to the point, there are quite a few chassis that flat out never see play, whether its Faction War or PGI's tournament (which, while using May patch, few if any mechs saw a positive quirk buff, so the point remains). Mechs like the Centurion, Vindicator, Viper, Phoenix Hawk, Ice Ferret, and Kintaro, just to name a few medium mechs, see very little play. If quirks, and quirk adjustments are meant to level the playing field, then I think it's time for the underdogs to get a little love.
And yeah, cynicism "PGI this, promise this, do that, blah blah". I think there's enough of that on the boards as is. What I'm curious to see is how many people agree with this statement.
So yeah, who thinks that bottom mechs need to start pushing their way up now? What mechs come to mind?
wait sec, you want to buff Cents....yes pls ;P
#5
Posted 29 July 2016 - 07:31 AM
Metus regem, on 29 July 2016 - 07:30 AM, said:
When Im in them they are top shelf ...Sadly they are too map dependent.
#6
Posted 29 July 2016 - 07:35 AM
mogs01gt, on 29 July 2016 - 07:31 AM, said:
Very true, if one is good in a Centurion they are good in most mechs, but that being said things like the Storm Crow, Hunchback (IIC & IS) and Griffin are all seen as 'better' than the Centurion... still I like my Centurions, good solid mechs that are really a force multiplier, jack of all trades, master of none.
#7
Posted 29 July 2016 - 07:41 AM
Metus regem, on 29 July 2016 - 07:23 AM, said:
I'm pretty sure you are putting words in his mouth, while the Blackjack got structure nerfs, it got no buffs in return supportive of stock or otherwise, which is the problem.
That said, quirks that support stock are silly in quite a few cases, like the DGN-5N's UAC5 quirks when it can only mount one or the Battlemasters that all have relatively the same quirks because the stock configs are so similar.
#8
Posted 29 July 2016 - 08:42 AM
Metus regem, on 29 July 2016 - 07:23 AM, said:
I fully agree, the first nerf was needed; having more structure points than a Grasshopper was just stupid. Hell, the second nerf along with the rescale was good, and I thought they had finally balanced the Blackjack as a good, viable mech, but not stupid OP. Then it was nerfed again, to where mechs with ballistic loadouts have better energy quirks. This brings me to a concern I have with any mech that gets good, or perhaps with today's quirks, are chosen by default. PGI doesn't wait to see how their latest quirk adjustments play out.
But perhaps I should qualify my concern in this regard a little more. When there is a mech that's really good, PGI eventually nerfs it, and so they should! However, in the next patch or two, they'll nerf that same mech again, and then again, each month. In my mind, thirty days is not usually enough time for a metagame to settle down and actually demonstrate the consequences of a buff or nerf, unless the buff or nerf involved a sledgehammer.
To put it shortly: If you make too many changes in a short period of time, you can't identify which changes achieved the desired result in the first place.
Edited by Aerei, 29 July 2016 - 08:55 AM.
#9
Posted 29 July 2016 - 09:32 AM
#10
Posted 29 July 2016 - 10:05 AM
hahahaha, get it? Because it won't. It'll make a stupid ******* side-grade change with a zero-net-gain of people that like and dislike the new balance as opposed to the balance at some other point in the game's lifetime. Way to go PGI, putting time and effort into appeasing these idiots.
#11
Posted 29 July 2016 - 10:24 AM
Moldur, on 29 July 2016 - 10:05 AM, said:
hahahaha, get it? Because it won't. It'll make a stupid ******* side-grade change with a zero-net-gain of people that like and dislike the new balance as opposed to the balance at some other point in the game's lifetime. Way to go PGI, putting time and effort into appeasing these idiots.
Your eloquent and constructive argument truly hits home the points you wish to make. Good job.
#12
Posted 29 July 2016 - 01:48 PM
#13
Posted 29 July 2016 - 01:52 PM
#14
Posted 29 July 2016 - 02:01 PM
Davers, on 29 July 2016 - 09:32 AM, said:
Nerfing structure and agility does not increase TTK. It has the opposite effect, really.
#15
Posted 29 July 2016 - 02:15 PM
Look, if your favorite Mech got nerfed, and it was your favorite because you found it to be performing very, very well... then... well... there's a distinct chance that it wasn't just your skill that kept you on top of the charts. If it was skill, then you should have been topping charts with other mechs, too.
Edited by Prosperity Park, 29 July 2016 - 02:16 PM.
#16
Posted 29 July 2016 - 02:36 PM
This thread title reads differently...
What Our Balance Overlord Actually Read said:
#17
Posted 29 July 2016 - 08:03 PM
@Prosperity - I don't think most people have a problem with real balancing (incl. nerfing excelling mechs), it's the ugly haphazard way it's done. You have many many high performing mechs left entirely alone, while random mediocre ones get hit...
Centurion is perfectly adequate, but is it really outperforming EBJs, Crows, Griffin's, etc? (Chosen randomly as understood decent mechs). If it isn't, why was it chosen for nerfing?
It ends up feeling non-sensical, targeted, or something of the kind.
But really the problem is always the same: no communication. Many MMOs have outlined rationale behind balance changes. We really don't seem to get that here.
#18
Posted 29 July 2016 - 08:21 PM
Prosperity Park, on 29 July 2016 - 02:15 PM, said:
Look, if your favorite Mech got nerfed, and it was your favorite because you found it to be performing very, very well... then... well... there's a distinct chance that it wasn't just your skill that kept you on top of the charts. If it was skill, then you should have been topping charts with other mechs, too.
As a matter of fact, my favorite mech has been untouched by recent quirk passes. I swear some people aren't reading into this enough. There's a difference between nerfing a mech that's making a splash on the metagame, and nerfing a mech that, quite frankly, isn't seeing play at the time.
Voq nailed my concern. Sometimes it feels like PGI is using a dartboard. I could fully understand the reasoning for nerfs in May and June patches, regardless of whether I liked them or not. However, the ones in this month's patch had almost no logic to them. I mean how many people complained about the Marauder being too nimble?
Edited by Aerei, 29 July 2016 - 08:21 PM.
#19
Posted 29 July 2016 - 09:45 PM
I can take a 4erll Hbringer into pugs and still be the first into combat on the front line
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