413 replies to this topic

[Kirkland Langue]

I'm looking for all the Light Mech pilots to cry because that commando was blown away with one alpha strike.

[Koniving]

Edit: Inserted dodge clarification.

MeiSooHaityu, on 04 August 2016 - 04:56 AM, said:

I have both Front Mission 3 and Front Mission 4. Those games are so underappreciated, it's criminal.

P.S. I could have mentioned MechWarrior Tactics in the comparison too but I completely forgot that was a thing that existed.

I have:
FM1 English, FM3, FM4, FM5 (Eng patch), and FM-E.

And I will tell you right now, FM-E is akin to MWO, in that the translation was horrific by ignoring weapon rates. The Rifles and Bazookas do too little damage for their difficulty curve, the MGs do too much damage for their speed, the shotguns are meh and the melee, while intense, is meh. Also missiles fire too fast, too frequently, and individual missiles seem to do less damage than a second of MG fire.

Something I noticed though, while the story telling and graphics get better as you go up (1, 2, etc.) , the dynamics of combat get better as you go down with FM2 being the 'best' in this sense. Though apparent loading times made it very foreboding to use this method. This is to say mechanics attempting to take 'real time' combat to their RNG results.

For example:
FM5. We slide toward each other. I shoot, you shoot, we alternate. (Whoop dee-doo.)

(Edit: Dodge is an RNG roll that either happens or is never attempted).

FM4. We run toward each other. I shoot, you shoot, we alternate.

(Edit: Dodge is an RNG roll that either happens or is never attempted).

FM3. Sliding is only done in straight lines, walking/running is done for anything else. I raise gun, you brace, I shoot, you attempt to dodge or sometimes you can see an attempt to block. You raise gun during my shoot, I might get to brace, you shoot, maybe I could dodge but probably not; just depends on what weapon you had versus my weapon whether I would be done in time to try to dodge.

(Edit: Thus, characters will almost always attempt to dodge, and sometimes can be shot mid-dodge! It is less RNG and more "can I make my move before they finish their move? No longer is it "I'll just stand here and let you shoot me.")

FM2: We slide or walk/run. Combat Intiates! Queue weapons. (Loading screen). We are moving around in a 3D space, affected by light poles, buildings, dumpsters, and local cars. You go to shoot. Shots are partially absorbed by the car as I dart (kinda poorly but hey, pre-1997 3D game on Playstation 1, what do you expect) toward the wall of a building. I then whirl out of cover, shoot at you as you try to close in. You take some hits, skate to a stop, whirl to your right and shoot at me. I fail to get away from the wall in time and take some hits. Time to relo cate. (This plays on until all the weapons are used).

(Dodging is not at all RNG during the combat animations and is instead a factor of actually moving. Unit 1's attack queues the other unit to attempt to move or relocate and shots are fired in that direction, hits may or may not happen as a result. For example what could have been a highly successful dodge fails because you dodged right into that car and were forced to a halt to change direction. You can 'summarize' the battles in which the dodges are instead RNG.)

It's primitive and yet amazing.

Edited by Koniving, 04 August 2016 - 05:57 AM.

[Alistair Winter]

Looks gorgeous. What blows my mind every time I hear HBS devs talk is that they sound like... people on the MWO forums. I know, I know, we're a vocal minority and we don't know how to make games and nobody cares about the stuff we care about. But when you listen to HBS devs talk, it's like they're actually making a game based off of... feedback from the MWO / Battletech community. Isn't that crazy?

• Different skill trees with different abilities
  
• Different classes of pilots
  
• "We wanted to make scouting important"
  
• Interesting missions with realistic objectives (take and hold this position while the dropship loads salvage)

It's been the same with previous videos from these guys, where they talk about lore and role warfare and many other grievances. For example, they want to build this game so that while you can take 4 atlases to battle, it's not generally a good idea, because you won't have the synergy of different classes working together. Whereas in MWO, this kind of synergy is nowhere to be seen and you regularly see waves of 12 heavy mechs attacking together in Invasion mode for maximum cheese power.


Now, PGI is finally planning to get back to work with Information Warfare and Role Warfare (2 of the 4 pillars, if you remember the 2012 Devlogs). That's good. But it's nice to see that HBS is treating those things as actual pillars. The foundation of the game. Not expansion content you add after 3 years.

Edited by Alistair Winter, 04 August 2016 - 09:20 AM.

[Yosharian]

If only sensors worked that way in MWO...

[RedDragon]

Alistair Winter, on 04 August 2016 - 05:31 AM, said:

Looks gorgeous. What blows my mind every time I hear HBS devs talk is that they sound like... people on the MWO forums. I know, I know, we're a vocal minority and we don't know how to make games and nobody cares about the stuff we care about. But when you listen to HBS devs talk, it's like they're actually making a game based off of... feedback from the MWO / Battletech community. Isn't that crazy?

• Different skill trees with different abilities
  
• Different classes of pilots
  
• "We wanted to make scouting important"
  
• Interesting missions with realistic objectives (take and hold this position while the dropship loads salvage)

It's been the same with previous videos from these guys, where they talk about lore and role warfare and many other grievances. For example, they want to build this game so that while you can talk 4 atlases to battle, it's not generally a good idea, because you won't have the synergy of different classes working together. Whereas in MWO, this kind of synergy is nowhere to be seen and you regularly see waves of 12 heavy mechs attacking together in Invasion mode for maximum cheese power.


Now, PGI is finally planning to get back to work with Information Warfare and Role Warfare (2 of the 4 pillars, if you remember the 2012 Devlogs). That's good. But it's nice to see that HBS is treating those things as actuall pillars. The foundation of the game. Not expansion content you add after 3 years.

I know, I am leaning myself far out the window here, but "maybe" that's because they actually know how to make (working) games

That super-pre-Alpha already looks more polished and more fun than MWO, even at that early stage. Mechs shuddering under the impact of missiles, mechs falling down, actual info warfare ...I wish I could gift them the money I wasted on PGI.

Really looking forward to playing this game!

[Undercover Brother]

The clouds have cleared, the birds are chirping merrily, every crying baby in the world is cooing, and the angels are singing in heaven above...

FINALLY, we're going to have an actual Battletech title, instead of Call of Duty, Hardcore mode, with mechs.

[kesmai]

Now we need quads for this.

*waves @ juodas*

[Novakaine]

Sweeeter!

[davoodoo]

MeiSooHaityu, on 04 August 2016 - 04:56 AM, said:

I have both Front Mission 3 and Front Mission 4. Those games are so underappreciated, it's criminal.

P.S. I could have mentioned MechWarrior Tactics in the comparison too but I completely forgot that was a thing that existed.

3 was kinda meh, good story but oh god progression sux.
Now 4, i dig, good game, decent mechanics.

Now for battletech, if they include mech customization and open ended campaign will be more than just few optional missions(shadowrun returns had 1 from what i remember) so i can build my personal mercenary army of fatlases and ill greatly dig that.

Still what worries me is heat scale.
Stock marauder got 16 shs, each ppc does 10 ac5 does 1 and it filled 1/3rd of the gauge. and it vents something around 1/6th per turn...
But then also moving doesnt produce heat.

Also i hope for clan invasion expansion.

Edited by davoodoo, 04 August 2016 - 06:52 AM.

[Juodas Varnas]

kesmai, on 04 August 2016 - 05:57 AM, said:

Now we need quads for this.

[Kasumi Sumika]

Looks great even it's still Pre-Alpha.

I hope it's Awesome and Good when it's released on Full Version! Can't wait to play it!

[darkchylde]

So glad I backed this.

[Tatula]

Sorry. I'm not a TT player so I'm not that excited about this. What I would love to see, though, would be a pilot POV. Especially during a battle. Seeing the mechs move around is cute, but seeing the mechs move around from the pilot's POV (like in the cockpit in MWO) would be awesome! It'll be kinda like combining MWO and TT, with no twitch shooting skill required.

Edited by Aloha, 04 August 2016 - 06:50 AM.

[Darian DelFord]

Narcissistic Martyr, on 04 August 2016 - 04:27 AM, said:

Sorry MWO but I'm leaving you (when this comes out).

I am sure you nor I will be the only ones

Bud Crue, on 04 August 2016 - 04:36 AM, said:

Just watched it again...

Like what I see even more. But something else sticks out to me. Compare the attitude of these guys with what Russ exhibits when he does a town hall or even the last round table.

Ayup...... Give me Jordan any day of the week.

Kirkland Langue, on 04 August 2016 - 05:22 AM, said:

I'm looking for all the Light Mech pilots to cry because that commando was blown away with one alpha strike.

Light mechs are blown away now with a well placed alpha strike... nothing new there.

[Bishop Steiner]

Bud Crue, on 04 August 2016 - 04:36 AM, said:

Just watched it again...

Like what I see even more. But something else sticks out to me. Compare the attitude of these guys with what Russ exhibits when he does a town hall or even the last round table.

I wish those guys could share some of their honesty (melee is coming but still buggy, there is a bug that gets your percentage over a hundred, etc.) and enthusiasm (those guys were clearly proud of what they had created and were having FUN with it) with PGI. Watching them have that much fun with what they created, made me want to write them a check so I could have fun with what they created. Give us something to be excited about in MWO please.

This. This is essentially what finally broke my support of MWO and PGI.

[MeiSooHaityu]

Narcissistic Martyr, on 04 August 2016 - 04:27 AM, said:

Sorry MWO but I'm leaving you (when this comes out).

I can make room for MWO after Battletech releases (MechWarrior's FPS style has always been my favorite game type), but it definitely won't be visited nearly as often (and that's saying something now that I only play a handful of hours a week as is).

[MeiSooHaityu]

Bishop Steiner, on 04 August 2016 - 07:02 AM, said:

This. This is essentially what finally broke my support of MWO and PGI.

It just reinforces my opinion that PGI has essentially been modding an existing basic MechWarrior game more than they were programming it for the past 4 years.

Edited by MeiSooHaityu, 04 August 2016 - 07:14 AM.

[Davers]

I liked it. Reminded me of all the TT games I've played.

Badass assault mech taken out in round 2 of the combat with a lucky shot? Check.

Light mechs getting behind everyone and coring out their backs? Check.

But it did seem that they were more accurate than usual, but that could be to pilot trees/experienced pilots.

[Marauder3D]

Great Vid!

Things shaping up nicely.

I can definitely see the TT roots in the video.

Unlucky head shot on Fatlas was hilarious. PPC's are dangerous in 3025!

Thought that Shad was hella lucky not to have its lunch fed to it by that Hunchie. One does not close range with a Hunchback in TT. Bad, bad idea!

Can't wait to see more. Glad they are working on the melee combat code. Can't wait to see someone kicked or punched or even better, charged.

Very exciting time to be a BattleTech fan!

[LORD ORION]

Game should be pretty solid when released, they are as enthusiastic as us to play the final product.