45 replies to this topic

[Requiemking]

So, with the new loyalty mechs on the way I've seen lots of people talking about the Stalker and the Summoners, but no one has mentioned the other heavies in the room. Both have their potential, but each is separate in possible uses.

The Cataphract 3L, Liao's answer to the Cataphract 3D, is fairly similar to the Davion 'phract, yet different. It swaps the Ultra AC for an ERPPC and upgrades the MLs to MPLs. But the most drastic difference between the two is the mobility enhancements. The 3D uses JJs, which the 3L swaps out for MASC. I think the 3L has potential as a fast skirmisher, using a max size engine (Probably XL) in conjunction with MASC to perform hit and run attacks with it's weapons. I'd probably swap the MPLs for MLs, drop the ERPPC for another ML, and use the newly-freed weight to upgrade the engine and probably add more ammo for the LBX AC. Endo could work if you have the podspace. As always, double heatsinks is a must, which this 'phract comes with.

The Hellbringer F, at first glance, seems pretty much the same as the HBR-A. However, more energy hardpoints (One in each arm, one in the right torso) allow for more sustainability in protracted battles. It's stock loadout (which isn't too bad this time around) is a brawler, but being an omnimech allows it to do as it pleases hardpoint-wise.

[Kuaron]

People are looking forward for the HBR to be able to zombie without arms entirely with this important one torso energy slot.
I posses no HBR and haven’t decided yet if I need this one. Would have to preorder the MAD IIC to get it.
Does this F variant also have it’s own fluff?

I’m looking forward for the CTF though, even if I know that I will hate the low weapon position. Tested another CTF on the PTS being curious on the coming present, and… ugh…
People aren’t talking much of it, I assume, because it is quite similar to the standard variants, just with MASC. Any idea how heavy the MASC could be.

[jss78]

Kuaron, on 20 August 2016 - 02:54 PM, said:

People are looking forward for the HBR to be able to zombie without arms entirely with this important one torso energy slot.
I posses no HBR and haven’t decided yet if I need this one. Would have to preorder the MAD IIC to get it.
Does this F variant also have it’s own fluff?

I’m looking forward for the CTF though, even if I know that I will hate the low weapon position. Tested another CTF on the PTS being curious on the coming present, and… ugh…
People aren’t talking much of it, I assume, because it is quite similar to the standard variants, just with MASC. Any idea how heavy the MASC could be.

It seems to be 4 tons and 4 slots (looking at the CTF-3L in MegaMekLab).

Not sure what to make of the CTF-3L yet. Maybe make it a speedy skirmisher Cataphract, 2xLPL in those high LT/RT mounts, keep the LBX, ML's in arms, XL300+MASC.

[Requiemking]

Kuaron, on 20 August 2016 - 02:54 PM, said:

People are looking forward for the HBR to be able to zombie without arms entirely with this important one torso energy slot.
I posses no HBR and haven’t decided yet if I need this one. Would have to preorder the MAD IIC to get it.
Does this F variant also have it’s own fluff?

I’m looking forward for the CTF though, even if I know that I will hate the low weapon position. Tested another CTF on the PTS being curious on the coming present, and… ugh…
People aren’t talking much of it, I assume, because it is quite similar to the standard variants, just with MASC. Any idea how heavy the MASC could be.

Hardpoint wise the 3L is identical to the 1X. The only difference is MASC. My standard build for mechs like this is "Old-style brawler".

The Hellbringer is pretty much only mentioned in passing because of it's new energy slot. This one I'll probably run with whatever I can fit. The Stock loadout isn't too bad, it could probably use some more ammo.

[Mad Dog Morgan]

jss78, on 20 August 2016 - 03:10 PM, said:

It seems to be 4 tons and 4 slots (looking at the CTF-3L in MegaMekLab).

Not sure what to make of the CTF-3L yet. Maybe make it a speedy skirmisher Cataphract, 2xLPL in those high LT/RT mounts, keep the LBX, ML's in arms, XL300+MASC.

Isn't MASC Mk. III supposed to be 3 tons, 3 slots?

[jss78]

Vaskadar, on 22 August 2016 - 06:21 AM, said:

Isn't MASC Mk. III supposed to be 3 tons, 3 slots?

It looks to use Mk. IV. I'm not too familiar with post-3025 tech, but I guess this is correct. Here's the thing in MegaMek:

Spoiler

[invernomuto]

I remember that I read somewhere CTF-3L will use a MASC III but I cannot find it at the moment...

[Mad Dog Morgan]

Deffo going to use the 3L like a madman.

340XL, AC-10 or LB-10 with 5mpl. Running 100+kph in short bursts

[Felix von Buelow]

invernomuto, on 22 August 2016 - 07:46 AM, said:

I remember that I read somewhere CTF-3L will use a MASC III but I cannot find it at the moment...

If you try to reproduce the loadout from the announcement on the CTF-1X, there are 4 tons left without accounting the MASC. Therefore my guess is that it will use MASC IV, being 4 tons and 4 slots.

Derived from my, respective the "meta", loadout of the CTF-1X I will probably run the 3L like that. Freeing up those 4 tons and slots by dropping 2 DHSs and downsizing the engine from STD295 to STD280.

Edited by GhostNemesys, 27 August 2016 - 11:51 PM.

[Black Lanner]

Now that we have the Hellbringer F, as several posters have already mentioned, it is all about that torso for the armless laserboating... if they threw in a quirk or 5 it would be a win, but unless that happens, the torso is the only piece really worth looking at...

[Requiemking]

Black Lanner, on 05 September 2016 - 07:15 PM, said:

Now that we have the Hellbringer F, as several posters have already mentioned, it is all about that torso for the armless laserboating... if they threw in a quirk or 5 it would be a win, but unless that happens, the torso is the only piece really worth looking at...

The arms also combine energy and ballistic hardpoints.

[Black Lanner]

Requiemking, on 05 September 2016 - 10:14 PM, said:

The arms also combine energy and ballistic hardpoints.

fair point...

[The Lost Boy]

Im just looking forward to the cbill bonus. Ima run my hellbringer with 2uac 10, 4 small laser, ecm and 4 tons of ammo

[Kuaron]

So, after we know the hardpoints and quirks, where is your theorycrafting going?

Especially concerning the Cataphract. Ballistic quirks but only 1 slot, rest energy. Ideas?

[Bud Crue]

Kuaron, on 16 October 2016 - 02:56 PM, said:

Especially concerning the Cataphract. Ballistic quirks but only 1 slot, rest energy. Ideas?

The L appears to have the same hard points as an 0xp. So builds will have the same potential but minus ECM and three (or is it four?) tons toward the MASC. There is your starting point. I'm seriously thinking 4LPLs and the biggest engine I can cram into it and masc. I already have 3 0xps (I used to run em in CW constantly) and need to do something other than the usual 4MP/ML and an AC20 build. I've also tried 4LL with a std engine, and an XL build with 2 LPLs, an AC10 and 2ML. So that leaves something like 4LPLs as something different, for its own sake.

[Kuaron]

You mean 1X, not 0XP. 1X with half the quirks but MASC instead.

Yes, AC20 + 5 MPL is a kind of obvious choice for the first try.
I was also thinking about an energy-only build with LPLs, but this would mean constructing an almost unquirked Mech known for it's bad weapon positioning and easy-to-hit silhouette.
Not sure about a lonely AC10 either. And an LBX pairs well with missiles, but lasers?
The last option would be an UAC solution with LPLs for mid range. Either with XL and third LPL in an arm (low mounted and vulnerable), or STD and zombie, though slightly underarmed.

[WrathOfDeadguy]

My ideas for the CTF-3L... using Gauss ammo to stand in for the MASC:

XL version. 80kph after tweak, good but not terribly impressive burst damage... eh. It's as good as I could come up with, considering the CTF is not blessed by the high mount gods.

STD version. I'm not sold on it, but since the MASC is the only thing that distinguishes this variant, it's hard to part with. I think I'll wind up trying the XL version first, then if it doesn't work out swap to this; I have all the parts on hand so it's not an issue.

The HBR-F will initially just run my hybrid brawler config. I just got these things during the heavy sale, but I like what it does to people who expect the HBR to be a stick after losing its left side.

[Kuaron]

WrathOfDeadguy, on 16 October 2016 - 09:00 PM, said:

The HBR-F will initially just run my hybrid brawler config. I just got these things during the heavy sale, but I like what it does to people who expect the HBR to be a stick after losing its left side.

I like what you did there.

Will try something similar, I guess, when the thing arrives.

[Requiemking]

Kuaron, on 16 October 2016 - 02:56 PM, said:

So, after we know the hardpoints and quirks, where is your theorycrafting going?

Especially concerning the Cataphract. Ballistic quirks but only 1 slot, rest energy. Ideas?

Well, considering the quirks on the 'phract, I'd say that the two most effective builds are going to be centered around either LPL skirmishing or MPL Brawling. The Hellbringer F, well, I'd probably run it pretty close to stock, just drop the Missile launcher for more ammo on the LB10s.

[S 0 L E N Y A]

Yay for HBR RT!
Not yay for Catacrap in whacky colors.