180 replies to this topic

[JFlash49]

nope. no delay, bring it on, a year is enough to time to hone my skills and take on...whatever will be piloting them.

[Shadowrrr01]

I say let it happen as scheduled. We will just have to modify tatics

[Dustein]

Remember that most of the early Clan invasion is in the periphery so it will not affect players. And even when they do start to get close enough to be noticed there was allot of misinformation from ComStar (intentional or incidental?)
Once they do become "public" knowledge and start to reach the player affected worlds I am expecting some cool Dev tricks to keep the game really interesting and balanced. Also remember that in a "fair" fight Clanners do have a massive advantage, but they are not invincible..

I for one am expecting that once the Clan Invasion is public to the IS that they will be either AI or Dev controlled for a time. After all I do not expect power creep to be a big factor in MWO, a game that has a Role Warfare focus and as has been stated "Avoiding the arms race like in previous 'mech titles"

[Xune]

Lets hope Matchmaking is considering BattleValue before the clans come out.

[delkarr]

Terror Teddy, on 18 July 2012 - 05:49 AM, said:

Well, in the end when the clans have arrived and people wants to join them for the sweet sweet mechs (not me, Im an IS merc.) then all we need is a bidding system.

Bidding system would mean that two opposing clan teams get to vote on which one can bring the LEAST tonnage to the match and the one who brings the least gets to play.

This way the clans will always be unmatched.

How this will play out when IS players gets ahold on clan tech is another issue to look at as well.

Tonnage
Meta Level of gear
Tonnage VS C-bill worth of mechs

Im starting to lean on using a C-bill evaluation between teams instead of tonnage.

Clans should start a Batchall (the bidding system of the clans) by a binary star for the most available Honor and Honor should be the currency for Clanners.
Of course they also should gain Honor for keeping Zellbriggen (Fighting One on One) as long they can.

[Terror Teddy]

Dustein, on 18 July 2012 - 06:21 AM, said:

Remember that most of the early Clan invasion is in the periphery so it will not affect players.

Wouldnt there be a chance that us mercenaries might facing some of them - after all, we work on the fringe.

[Skylarr]

Terror Teddy, on 18 July 2012 - 06:38 AM, said:

Wouldnt there be a chance that us mercenaries might facing some of them - after all, we work on the fringe.

Yes, you are right. The ones that did were never heard from again. Except for Phelan.

[Whip]

Keep to the Cannon.
Keep to the time line.
Keep it as real as possible


After all.......It is a "SIMULATION GAME"

Simulation: Is the imitation of the operation of a real-world process, life or system over time.

[Terror Teddy]

Skylarr, on 18 July 2012 - 06:42 AM, said:

Yes, you are right. The ones that did were never heard from again. Except for Phelan.

1. Change pilot name to Phelan
2. Get periphery world contracts

I'll be the first to bag me a clanner.

[abetterpilot]

it will be interesting to see how many players go clan, what if the vast majority do?

[Dustein]

Aokarasu, on 18 July 2012 - 05:36 AM, said:

Except that was only from a "fluff" point of view. If melee combat is enabled, there's nothing to prevent a "Clan" player from using melee attacks, barring it being disabled for the Clans.

Honestly, I'd really rather the Clans not be allowed as a player option, because of the gross imbalance. There isn't a BV (Battle Value) system like there is in tabletop to assist in balancing the forces.

Off the top of my head, the "easiest" way to "balance" a Clan vs IS match is to make it a 12 (IS) vs 5 (Clan) set-up.

1 - Early Clans CANNOT use Melee weapons (it is against their code - this was amended latter to "backwards engineer+improve" some IS Tech but we not need to worry early)
2 - I do not expect Clans to be player options (how do you enforce the Clan code?)
3 - Two Lances of IS 'mechs is considered balanced to a Star of Clans 'mechs (2x4 Vs 5)

Things to keep in mind

• A Star is either 5 'Mechs, 10 tanks, 10 Aerospace Fighters, 25 Protomechs, 25 Elementals, or 125 infantry.
  
• it is rare to see more than a Binnary (two Stars) working together at one time on a single mission.
  
• Clanners live by a Code and they would rather die than break it.
  
• Small example of their code is they will only engage one 'mech at a time (e.g. an entire battalion of IS 'mechs can single out and destroy a Clan 'mech if they so desire. A Clan Cluster (4-5 Binaries) however will target ONE 'mech EACH, I say again Each Clanner will only target ONE Enemy EACH at any given time (Elementals/infantry exception).
  
• Clanners are as much in competition with each other as they are with their enemy.

[Xune]

abetterpilot, on 18 July 2012 - 06:51 AM, said:

it will be interesting to see how many players go clan, what if the vast majority do?

The question is not if it would happen. But how to prevent it

[Thorn Hallis]

abetterpilot, on 18 July 2012 - 06:51 AM, said:

it will be interesting to see how many players go clan, what if the vast majority does?

Just longer queue times for Clan-players in Clan vs IS engagements. What more should happen?

Dustein, on 18 July 2012 - 06:53 AM, said:

• Small example of their code is they will only engage one 'mech at a time (e.g. an entire battalion of IS 'mechs can single out and destroy a Clan 'mech if they so desire. A Clan Cluster (4-5 Binaries) however will target ONE 'mech EACH, I say again Each Clanner will only target ONE Enemy EACH at any given time (Elementals/infantry exception).

It's down the Clan Warrior in question if he honors his IS foes enough to grant them the right of Zellbriggen. If he think his opponent is not worth it he can and will fire at every target out there.

Edited by Thorn Hallis, 18 July 2012 - 06:59 AM.

[Monsoon]

Well, if your FWL or CC I wouldn't worry about the Clans for a few years, since you're no where near them. Though I'd worry about troops returning from the front with any scavenged gear!

[Victor Kell]

I would definetely like to see them keep to the timeline. However, don't let the clans be a playable factions or their mechs playable initially as the clans are mostly in the Periphery. As the clans get closer, then you can have more salvage available if you have an engagement against the clanners. But I for one, don't want to see them playable (full access to all their weapons and mechs) until their advance is halted. By then, the game will have been around for a while and it will be a new cool thing to try. But like some people have mentioned, in the company on company battles, it would then be a company against a star of clanners. That should be a challenge for any clan players.

[Samuel Ryan Jennings]

The Clan Invasion is not done until 3052. The Battle of Tukayyid is what brings the temporary end of the Invasion. We have two full years before the end of the invasion.

So, if the Devs are intending the invasion to be entirely NPC's then we have plenty of time.

I hope that is what they intend, cause that would give us lots of time to get to know the game. Learn how the Clans are, and then eventually learn Clan tech and be able to use it.

But you have to figure. Clans are an eventuality. Whether 4 months, or 2 years or longer. It is going to happen. So may as well prepare for it.

Cause if the Devs didn't add Clans, imagine how many customers would leave. That would be a huge error on their part. So of course, expect Clans. Half the people are here just to play a Mad Cat or a Daishi. Or a Ryoken... or a Thor, or a Vulture... I mean jeez. So many good mechs.


Hehe

[Skylarr]

Monsoon, on 18 July 2012 - 06:57 AM, said:

Well, if your FWL or CC I wouldn't worry about the Clans for a few years, since you're no where near them. Though I'd worry about troops returning from the front with any scavenged gear!

Correct me if I am wrong. But, didn't the the CC believe the Clan Invasion was a story made up by the Davions? Meant to throw the CC off balance when the Davions attacked them.

[bpphantom]

Dustein, on 18 July 2012 - 06:53 AM, said:

• Small example of their code is they will only engage one 'mech at a time (e.g. an entire battalion of IS 'mechs can single out and destroy a Clan 'mech if they so desire. A Clan Cluster (4-5 Binaries) however will target ONE 'mech EACH, I say again Each Clanner will only target ONE Enemy EACH at any given time (Elementals/infantry exception).

Actually the reverse. An enemy is only targeted by one Clanner PER mech. You don't help your star-mate. He either succeeds or is defeated.

[D Vladistov]

I would love to see the devs play as the clans and sneak in a few battles at the forefront of the invasion, and if a partical IS mechwarrior fights very well against them he will have the option to be recruited by the clan as a bondsman thus slowly but surely increasing the clans and making more and more clan games.

For balancing purposes I think a BV system in general would be Very helpful even now I would not want two lance of scouts against two lances of assault mechs, sure the scouts can see the assaults but realistically they have no chance. Same is true with clans if it's 4 Urbanmech IIC against 4 atlases I am still putting my money on the Atlases. I trust the Dev to balance the game.

One thing I would very much like to see with the clan invasion though is asymmetric objectives. e.g. The IS side must hold a building for so long (to evacuate it) while the clans are just trying to kill the IS mechs without knowing the IS objective (could be hold, could be destroy clan building, count be escape map). This way we actually have the clans winning duels but the IS winning the battle/war.

Edited by D Vladistov, 18 July 2012 - 07:18 AM.

[Skylarr]

Quote

From the The Rules of Zellbrigen Thread posted on the Clan Forum.

At Honor Level 1, the Clan warrior upholds all the rules of dueling regardless of his opponent's actions.

At Honor Level 2, the Clan warrior follows the rules of dueling until the Inner Sphere side takes an action that violates the Clan honor code (a third party interfering, a unit involved in one duel firing on a 'Mech involved in another duel, and so on). If this happens, the duel immediately degenerates into a free-for-all.

At Honor Level 3, any infringement of Clan honor in the dueling rules renders the entire ritual of zellbrigen null and void, leaving the Clan 'Mechs free to attack any enemy unit without restraint for the remainder of the ehgagement.

At Honor Level 4, dueling rules do not apply.

Prior to the Clan Invasion, Clan Blood Spirit, Clan Coyote, Clan Ghost Bear, Clan Goliath Scorpion, Clan Jade Falcon, Clan Star Adder and Clan Steel Viper adhered strictly to the tenants of zellbrigen. Meanwhile Clan Cloud Cobra, Clan Hell's Horses, Clan Ice Hellion, Clan Nova Cat and Clan Snow Raven were more opportunistic in their interpretation. Only Clan Diamond Shark and Clan Wolf used a liberal interpretation of zellbrigen in their conflicts with the other Clans.

After their defeat at the Battle of Tukayyid, many of the Clans began to rethink their use of these honor rules, and a number of political, military and cultural changes took place. The Blood Spirits, Jade Falcons and Star Adders became more opportunistic, while the Ghost Bears became more liberal, in the use of zellbrigen. The schism within Clan Wolf resulted in its new Crusader-minded leadership to become slightly more conservative, while Clan Wolf-in-Exile maintain a flexible definition of zellbrigen.

Clan Fire Mandrill, by their fractious nature, defy any sort of labeling, with each Kindraa having their own individual understandings of zellbrigen.