52 replies to this topic

[Bishop Steiner]

FupDup, on 01 October 2016 - 11:53 AM, said:

Fixed.

I've seen people accuse the Commando and Panther of having broken hitboxes, for crying out loud.

difference is PGI acknowledged the Spider and Raven (and FS9) were borked at various times.

Can't comment on the Cheetos since that would require giving enough of a damn to load the client. Can't really say "for science" is enough anymore. Especially since even with video evidence (in the past) plenty of tryhards fall back on the whole L2A schrtick anyhow.

So, in regards to the Cheetoh, I simply have no comment.

Just tired of people pretending that certain chassis didn't have legit hitreg/wonkyass hitboxes in the past.

But for all Lights being DoA since the rescale I do see enough people seeming to do just fine in em. *shrugs*

FupDup, on 01 October 2016 - 02:08 PM, said:

You're pulling the Clan card again. It's the MWO forum equivalent of pulling the race or gender card in political discussions.

Need I remind you that the creator of this thread picked a Clan forum logo?

Other defenders of lights in this thread include an FRR, Davion, and two neutrals.

Stop with the roleplaying. A player's faction forum tag is arbitrary; it means absolutely nothing about most of them. Players with IS tags can defend Clan mechs/guns and players with Clan tags can defend IS mechs/gun. All it takes to have a Clan logo is to click a button in the FP interface. All it takes to have an IS logo is to do the same.

I don't align myself with any "forum political party" here other than the Bittervets, which isn't biased toward or against any faction.



Tarogato also made a Reddit post about the Cheetah's hitboxes and found out that they perfectly aligned with the mech's visual 3D model.



Now you're accusing the SCR and TBR of having broken hitboxes, too? I don't think you understand the difference between a good hitbox and a broken hitbox. A broken hitbox means that you can shoot a mech's body part and that body part never registers any damage. A good hitbox just means that a mech can spread damage across its body parts uniformly.



Everyone who has any clue about this game doesn't blame hitboxes for their losses.

Everyone who has any clue about this game can kill or scare off any light mech quickly.

It's Ted? I'm rather shocked that anyone doesn't have his nonsense on ignore by now......

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 02 October 2016 - 05:23 PM.

[Zibmo]

Deathlike, on 02 October 2016 - 05:13 PM, said:

If you aimed for anything other than the leg, then yes, it's legitimate.

Firstly, my quote sounded every bit as stupid as the post I referenced. That was the point. Secondly, since lights have less armor than...everything else, and legs are the smallest, the fact that the "best" (read that "practically only") way to take out lights is to remove the one thing that is the most difficult to target on the mech I think speaks volumes.

Of course, everyone's aim is off. Hard for me to argue that when I see people practically shooting EVERYTHING but the target. But it is not always the case. And lights are way too hard to kill. And the "and don't tell me about shooting a motionless target because reasons" is beyond moronic. Lights have issues. The way the rest of the game has issues.

I don't play the ones I think are broken. So, I'm out there in my Adders, Kitfoxes and Ravens doing what I can. None of which are bad mechs. But they are nowhere near Cheetahs, and to a lesser extent (much) Firestarters. I think Firestarters are about right. Cheetahs are stupid.

Edited by Zibmo, 02 October 2016 - 05:36 PM.

[Deathlike]

Zibmo, on 02 October 2016 - 05:35 PM, said:

Firstly, my quote sounded every bit as stupid as the post I referenced. That was the point. Secondly, since lights have less armor than...everything else, and legs are the smallest, the fact that the "best" (read that "practically only") way to take out lights is to remove the one thing that is the most difficult to target on the mech I think speaks volumes.

Of course, everyone's aim is off. Hard for me to argue that when I see people practically shooting EVERYTHING but the target. But it is not always the case. And lights are way too hard to kill. And the "and don't tell me about shooting a motionless target because reasons" is beyond moronic. Lights have issues. The way the rest of the game has issues.

I don't play the ones I think are broken. So, I'm out there in my Adders, Kitfoxes and Ravens doing what I can. None of which are bad mechs. But they are nowhere near Cheetahs, and to a lesser extent (much) Firestarters. I think Firestarters are about right. Cheetahs are stupid.

It's more about all the other Light mechs and variants being bad... not so much the Arctic Cheetah being good.

Firestarters got screwed in the rescaling efforts, and that's a problem on PGI's end.

[Gaden Phoenix]

Thanks to lag, it is really hard to know where to shoot when targeting lights.

It is not so bad when a 50ms ping heavy and 50ms light fight.

But when you pit a 250ms ping heavy vs a 5ms light... The hit registration goes bonkers.

Problem is that fixing the sync-desync issue is crazy hard. For one, which client side is the real "version". Both are real and thus how to reconcile the differences. PGI could take the server version, then that favors the light. Then you have issues of cheating, if you only use the client side "version".

Edited by Gaden Phoenix, 02 October 2016 - 05:49 PM.

[Zibmo]

Deathlike, on 02 October 2016 - 05:38 PM, said:

It's more about all the other Light mechs and variants being bad... not so much the Arctic Cheetah being good.

Firestarters got screwed in the rescaling efforts, and that's a problem on PGI's end.

How you could read what I said and get that is crazy. If all lights were that powerful, the game would be beyond hopelessly broken, instead of the shitfest it currently is.

[FalconerGray]

Zibmo, on 02 October 2016 - 05:35 PM, said:

Firstly, my quote sounded every bit as stupid as the post I referenced. That was the point. Secondly, since lights have less armor than...everything else, and legs are the smallest, the fact that the "best" (read that "practically only") way to take out lights is to remove the one thing that is the most difficult to target on the mech I think speaks volumes.

This is where I think you're wrong.

If you look at the hitbox diagram posted on the previous page, you'll see that the legs aren't really as small as you're making them out to be. But the most important detail of all - is that you can hit them from any angle, any position. Unlike the torso hitboxes which spread damage extremely well, due to how small they are and how quickly the ACH can torso twist / turn on the spot. If I know where it's coming from, I can spread CERML fire across all of the upper hitboxes over the course of a burn. Can't do that with the legs.

Same goes for if I'm running away or simply relocating. I'm shaking my mouse around every which way, and people are still thinking they can keep a steady beam on a tiny component in that situation? Always go for the legs.

If I end up in a 1v1 Cheetah duel, if he shoots my torsos I know that I've won.

Trollfeed, on 02 October 2016 - 04:51 AM, said:

You go shooting cheetah with lazors in the upper torso and he will do a dandy pirouette distibuting damage between 7 different hit locations. Just shoot at the crotch and you won't miss damage due to leg movement and all components you can hit there are pretty much instant death.

Cheetah isn't really that tanky, it's just above average for light mechs. The reason they do so well is because they are above average in firepower, stealth and mobility too.

All of this. Especially the last line.

I've recently (last 2 weeks) gone back to the Cheetahs for the first time since before their CBill launch and I've been having a great time with them. I've been running the ERML build rather than the SPL build, specifically because I feel that the mech is too fragile to risk getting as close as is required to properly be effective with the SPLs. The catch here is that (at the risk of sounding like a "gitgud" guy) it only feels fragile when people know how to defend against them - which is, to only shoot the legs.

There are times that I can run through a formation and have damage evenly spread across all upper components and be absolutely fine, but in other matchs I'll make the exact same move, receive the exact same amount of return fire, but lost a leg in the process. It all comes down to the way the enemy players respond, but I'm not prepared to take that risk. So I've gone for extra range and more cover options instead.

[CJ Daxion]

W A R K H A N, on 01 October 2016 - 12:23 PM, said:

Nothing seems to be wrong with the hitboxes anytime I get into one.

Lol ya know kidding.. I have a hard time doing well in that mech.. My IS ravens on the other hand i do tons better..

[Revis Volek]

Deathlike, on 01 October 2016 - 02:26 PM, said:

So, on Day 1 of this "casual" event, I got 5 kills with 4 KMDDs in a Cheetah.

Either I'm OP or other people were bad.

The answer is somewhere in between, but the latter is more likely the cause.



Mech in the clear view distance on HPG? Screw Doritos, you have super-haxxor vision!

and standing completely still like an ACH cutout at the target range.

Zibmo, on 02 October 2016 - 06:12 PM, said:

How you could read what I said and get that is crazy. If all lights were that powerful, the game would be beyond hopelessly broken, instead of the shitfest it currently is.

I completely disagree. If lights like the Commando and Mist lynx were any good, even just close to the ACH this game would be amazing.

Could you imagine if all the mechs in the game were viable? What a world....

No, the butt hurt has you now. I pray this sickness leaves you soon.

Edited by Revis Volek, 03 October 2016 - 01:43 AM.

[Thunder Child]

The ACH hitboxes are DEFINITELY broken. My one seems to be much to large. I swear, I can be behind a hill, on the opposite side of the map, and an arm will just fall off by itself. Enemy PPCs and Gauss slugs seem to be magnetised to my left and right torsos (It cannot be because I am a BAD light pilot, and only win 1v1 in a "fair fight" against Dire Whales >.> )

Seriously though, my Jester has had absolutely no trouble cutting ACH's in half during this event. Jester OP (that rescale has made her sooo slim and sexy).

Try large sweeping motions with lasers, and remember to hit the back of your teammate too. Firing AC 20s randomly while the target is moving across your field of vision is also good.

For a less Trolly option, controlled laser bursts into the legs works wonders, and timing your AC 20 rounds for when they turn can take a leg clean off.

Edited by Thunder Child, 03 October 2016 - 02:28 AM.

[TVMA Doc]

Juodas Varnas, on 01 October 2016 - 11:41 AM, said:

Arctic Cheater*

Nothing wrong with the hitboxes though, it's probably more of an issue of it being so spindly with a lot of space between the limbs and the body, that combined with fast movement speed and ****** hit registration can make it a pain to deal with.
It's no more broken than any other humanoid light, apart from being able to survive a side-torso loss, because of the totally balanced cXLs

I'ld have to second this. The AC is difficult to hit because the hit boxes are relatively slim and the thing is moving around not only quickly but erratically if piloted correctly.

I had a domination game yesterday in which I was left as the last surviving mech in a somewhat dinged up stalker against an almost fresh artic Cheetah. Even though I kept tagging the thing with three ERLLs, I could only manage to get enough hits registered to get his legs down to crit, but no further. The game ended up timing out after I had to spend almost 8.5 minutes protecting a stripped rear CT.

I got called "noob stalker" by a dead teammate in chat. Strange, as I had the highest damage in the game, killed three mechs and managed to hold off for the win...

Arctic Cheetah can definitely be a challenge to kill.

[Ultimax]

Jazzbandit1313, on 01 October 2016 - 11:29 AM, said:

Anyone else finding it a little more hard to kill these mechs than you remember?.

No, please aim better and stop blaming things other than yourself when you fail to kill something.

[Mole]

Bro, I have been playing my Spider a lot recently. The thing is only armed with 3 Medium Pulse Lasers. I make a point to hunt down enemy Arctic Cheetahs. They go down easy enough to my Spider. If you're fighting a light 'mech and not aiming for the legs then you're doing it wrong. You crush their mobility then they are only one alpha strike away from instant death.

[Y E O N N E]

Mole, on 03 October 2016 - 11:55 AM, said:

Bro, I have been playing my Spider a lot recently. The thing is only armed with 3 Medium Pulse Lasers. I make a point to hunt down enemy Arctic Cheetahs. They go down easy enough to my Spider. If you're fighting a light 'mech and not aiming for the legs then you're doing it wrong. You crush their mobility then they are only one alpha strike away from instant death.

Other Lights aiming for my legs usually find their STs popped or their weapons missing. ;D