171 replies to this topic

[Bud Crue]

Navid A1, on 26 October 2016 - 06:03 AM, said:

Everything would be solved if Lurm lobbers could just understand this!

You wanna bring lurms? Fine... obtain your locks yourself (TAG/Narc), Try to use whatever target lock available at any time without begging for locks, and... stay within 400-500m of the enemy!

Also ffs please understand that Artemis cancels out NARC bonuses... and bringing LRM20 is a reportable action for helping the enemy

And remember kids, Artemis is a waste if you are hiding behind terrain (or teammates) to lob LRMs while relying on the locks your teammates are getting for you. Artemis needs line of sight to provide the improved spread concentration that it is coveted for.

[process]

The comparison to assaults doesn't work, since many literally cannot keep pace with lighter mechs doing the Nascar thing. With targeting, everyone wants locks, but as other people have mentioned, there are numerous factors for why that isn't possible.

You can also help yourself get locks by adjusting your play style. Move closer, and carry a BAP. The optimal LRM range is really more like 300-400 meters. Your Blackjack also has jumpjets, meaning you can actually pogo stick and LRM, although I think it works better for SRMs.

Edited by process, 26 October 2016 - 06:12 AM.

[El Bandito]

Just type on chat at the match preparation screen "LRM boat, locks appreciated". It is important to say them, even risking ridicule from your teammates, cause more one knows about the team's loadout the better, and also there are people who actually bring Narc in solo-q. Smart pugs will digest the info and then use it when the situation fits--I personally point out targets for my LRM teammates to prioritize--while dumb pugs will intentionally refuse lock for the boat and most likely lose the match.

In my 200+ matches with the ARC-5W, it is the teammates who had worked with my LRM boat that had shared my near 2:1 WLR in that chassis. Win-win. Especially considering the fact that Archer is the worst mech chassis for getting its own locks thanks to its stupidly low cockpit.

Edited by El Bandito, 26 October 2016 - 06:13 AM.

[MechWarrior5152251]

Most LURMers don't understand that every mech from Tier 3 to 1 has Radar Derp. We lose locks because they break line of sight. It is annoying when someone cycles through all the exposed targets after missiles are in the air.

[Voq]

El Bandito, on 26 October 2016 - 06:12 AM, said:

Just type on chat at the match preparation screen "LRM boat, locks appreciated". It is important to say them, even risking ridicule from your teammates, cause more one knows about the team's loadout the better, and also there are people who actually bring Narc in solo-q. Smart pugs will digest the info and then use it when the situation fits--I personally point out targets for my LRM teammates to prioritize--while dumb pugs will intentionally refuse lock for the boat and most likely lose the match.

In my 200+ matches with the ARC-5W, it is the teammates who had worked with my LRM boat that had shared my near 2:1 WLR in that chassis. Win-win.

You're not wrong in saying communication is good. I agree with you.
The problem is, begging for locks tends to mean: "I'm planning to stand back, maybe even out of LoS, firing from safety. But I need YOU to stand up front and face-tank the baddies for me to be able to do that!"
The best lurmers stand toe to toe with their brethren and share armour, and thus, likely don't need to ask for locks cause they can create them for themselves.

As others have pointed out (and I know you're aware), lurms function best around 400m, where your Artemis is working, your flight path is low, fast, and direct, your BAP is starting to kick in, and your backup weapons can come into play too.

It isn't that it's bad to talk - it's the playstyle that it often implies.

[The6thMessenger]

Voq, on 26 October 2016 - 06:16 AM, said:

You're not wrong in saying communication is good. I agree with you.
The problem is, begging for locks tends to mean: "I'm planning to stand back, maybe even out of LoS, firing from safety. But I need YOU to stand up front and face-tank the baddies for me to be able to do that!"
The best lurmers stand toe to toe with their brethren and share armour, and thus, likely don't need to ask for locks cause they can create them for themselves.

As others have pointed out (and I know you're aware), lurms function best around 400m, where your Artemis is working, your flight path is low, fast, and direct, your BAP is starting to kick in, and your backup weapons can come into play too.

It isn't that it's bad to talk - it's the playstyle that it often implies.

But i wasn't begging for locks, i am informing the team what i can do. Like you agreed, communication is good, it's advantageous for your team to know what you can do for them, and not ask what you cannot provide.

I have ER LL, i'll stay back since im a sniper, but i have to direct the laser too so i am exposing myself. The LRM5s are there so that i can still shoot, when i retreat behind cover. It's also LRM5s, the hell do you need Artemis with it?

[Rhialto]

process, on 26 October 2016 - 06:11 AM, said:

The optimal LRM range is really more like 300-400 meters.

Depends of so much factor... a quick solo target will move toward you and under 200m you're dead if you boat LRMs only. I equipped my 4J with extra distance module for LRM so I can still hit at 1100m and sometimes it serve all the team when a brillant fast ECM scout go spot for the team.

Quote

Your Blackjack also has jumpjets, meaning you can actually pogo stick and LRM, although I think it works better for SRMs.

Pogo stick would only work if you fire all LRM5 in a single volley and if you have the target delay module. BJ-2 usually chain fire for constant cabin shake.

[Rhialto]

Voq, on 26 October 2016 - 06:16 AM, said:

The problem is, begging for locks

The keyword in this topic title is begging.

there is nothing wrong letting your team know right from the start that you carry LRMs and that locks and hold would be appreciated.

Just as when I carry NARC, I shout "Any LRM boat? I can NARC".

[Yosharian]

radiv, on 26 October 2016 - 05:27 AM, said:

Why put erll as backupweapons on a mech with few heatsinks? Why not regular largelasers instead?
Those are the worst backupweapons you can get, except maybe ppc. Whole build says i dont wanna share my armor..
Lurms aint effective at 600m and if you supply ur own locks as you said you should be closer to battle.

I agree, OP should switch to standard LLs

[Steve Pryde]

Bring at least TAG and advanced target decay module for lurming. For both of them u need your own line of sight to the target. If u can't, don't lurm.

[GotShotALot]

Only player you have control over in the game is you. If you want locks, get them and hold them. That's the only way you know they'll be there.

Too many LRM players think standing 700m back and launching LRMs at locks people up front are getting is useful. Or launching LRMs at lights that half the time aren't going to hit anyway. Or, while spectating yesterday, watching a guy with 4 LRM10s launching flight after flight at a locked mech that was behind a pillar of rock.

If you can at least see the mech (meaning you have your own lock, using TAG, Narc, BAP whatever) then your LRMs are likely 5x as effective.

That being said, on the rare times I use LRMs, I normally toss out a "I got LRMs if you got locks" or even just "LRM10-x3 here" so people who are smart enough to make use of that info can do so.

[The6thMessenger]

Yosharian, on 26 October 2016 - 06:50 AM, said:

I agree, OP should switch to standard LLs

Heat of Large laser is 7, ER is 8. That's just 14.285% extra heat, i can take that by simply adjusting my approach.

Rhialto, on 26 October 2016 - 06:44 AM, said:

The keyword in this topic title is begging.

there is nothing wrong letting your team know right from the start that you carry LRMs and that locks and hold would be appreciated.

Just as when I carry NARC, I shout "Any LRM boat? I can NARC".

Do you know the use of quotation marks in that context? I could've simply said Lock Begging, but i added quotation marks in it. As i explained, my brother says that it's begging, i say it's just me trying to be a team-player by informing my team.

GotShotALot, on 26 October 2016 - 06:57 AM, said:

That being said, on the rare times I use LRMs, I normally toss out a "I got LRMs if you got locks" or even just "LRM10-x3 here" so people who are smart enough to make use of that info can do so.

Yeah well, that build is the only thing i can work with by BJ, and it has +30% CBill bonus, cause I'm saving up.

Of course, in a sense, that's what i am doing too, I'm giving them info of what and how can i contribute, but sadly I get frowned upon. I got ER-LLs too, if i intend to just shoot Lurms all match, i'd just put SLs or MLs there and have more weight for more powerful lurms.

Edited by The6thMessenger, 26 October 2016 - 07:02 AM.

[process]

Rhialto, on 26 October 2016 - 06:36 AM, said:

Depends of so much factor... a quick solo target will move toward you and under 200m you're dead if you boat LRMs only. I equipped my 4J with extra distance module for LRM so I can still hit at 1100m and sometimes it serve all the team when a brillant fast ECM scout go spot for the team.

Pogo stick would only work if you fire all LRM5 in a single volley and if you have the target delay module. BJ-2 usually chain fire for constant cabin shake.

Yeah, it definitely depends on play style. If I'm LRMing at close range, I want to make sure I'm not alone, and hopefully at the front of the pack. It helps having the lock as you jump, to minimize your time in the air. I've actually gotten into the habit of firing my LRMs as I'm jumping before I get a lock, to the same end. Works great in my Highlander IIC.

The6thMessenger, on 26 October 2016 - 06:59 AM, said:

Heat of Large laser is 7, ER is 8. That's just 14.285% extra heat, i can take that by simply adjusting my approach.

The heat isn't a huge difference, but the extra .25 seconds of beam duration means much less focused damage.

Also RIP Clan ER large lasers.

Edited by process, 26 October 2016 - 07:09 AM.

[The6thMessenger]

process, on 26 October 2016 - 07:06 AM, said:

The heat isn't a huge difference, but the extra .25 seconds of beam duration means much less focused damage.

Yeah, but isn't that range is important for sniping?

[process]

The6thMessenger, on 26 October 2016 - 07:08 AM, said:

Yeah, but isn't that range is important for sniping?

Depends on your perspective and play style. The way I see it, most fighting happens well within the optimal range of the ER large laser, so that extra range over the standard large laser isn't terribly useful. And on top of the longer duration = spread damage, it also forces you to expose yourself longer.

[The6thMessenger]

process, on 26 October 2016 - 07:21 AM, said:

Depends on your perspective and play style. The way I see it, most fighting happens well within the optimal range of the ER large laser, so that extra range over the standard large laser isn't terribly useful. And on top of the longer duration = spread damage, it also forces you to expose yourself longer.

I guess i can always try and see what works.

[Mole]

Generally if I'm playing a 'mech that has LRMs I say something along the lines of "LRMs here. I get my own locks but if you have a target you need rained on call it and lock it." I don't usually catch any flak for that.

[S 0 L E N Y A]

Any player worth their salt is going to lock targets, whether you ask or not.

The issue is you are asking somebody to HOLD a lock.

That essentially means you are asking a team mate to expose themselves to the enemy and stare them down for YOU.

[Dee Eight]

MechWarrior5152251, on 26 October 2016 - 06:15 AM, said:

Most LURMers don't understand that every mech from Tier 3 to 1 has Radar Derp.

That depends on the mech of course... stormcrows and others with only 3 total slots... probably won't have the derp if something else suits the build better. With my streak crow I'd rather use the seismic wall hacker module than a radar flicker, and use the dedicated weapon and the master weapon/mech slots for S-SRM cooldown and range modules.

[Novakaine]

Man don't even listen to the easy click hater's
Cause hater gonna hate - regardless.
However I have seen many a times a steady stream of lurmz.
Change the course of a battle.
The team that lacks them is normally the losing team.
Trust me I'm the boss.