86 replies to this topic

[SWANN]

PGI's glassdoor reviews are an interesting read.

https://www.glassdoo...ews-E144886.htm

need to make an account to read more than a few reviews though.

Edited by SWANN, 01 November 2016 - 09:51 AM.

[Hunka Junk]

Dee Eight, on 01 November 2016 - 04:57 AM, said:

I haven't paid much attention to the who which company is behind the "new" battletech, but mentioning shadowrun.... that I do know flopped... boy I'm glad I didn't partake in that kickstarter for BT now. And having industry vets doesn't ever guarantee great success if all they turn out is a lame product. Shadowrun returns for example launched onto steam for example with a peak twenty four thousand players in July 2013, and then bled out like a sucking chest wound in only a couple months. According to steamcharts the 24 hour peak was 65 players.

http://steamcharts.com/app/234650

Shadowrun : Hong Kong isn't doing much better...

http://steamcharts.com/app/346940

Shadowrun : dragon's fall...

http://steamcharts.com/app/300550

And finally shadowrun : chronicles...wow...launch month peak of a bit over 700... really kept the players interest by 2015 didn't they....

http://steamcharts.com/app/267750

This for a game harebrained kickstarted in 2012 and kept missing goals, dates, etc. People criticize PGI over MWO but at least we have a game, five years on, that THOUSANDS play every day. Not a game that gets a couple hundred people a day.

Dragonfall Director's Cut has an 87 on Metacritic. To be fair, XCOM;Enemy Within scored 92, and Enemy Unknown 89.

http://www.metacriti...--directors-cut

That's comparing HBS, a small outfit, to 2K games, maybe not the biggest but definitely up there.

The day PGI puts out a game that scores an 87 on Metacritic is the day I'll grab a bottle of ketchup and eat my laptop.

[Jetfire]

Rollercoaster? I liken it more to watching your grandpa putter around in the garage. Occasionally the grass gets cut... I guess.

I mean I love the game despite it's flaws. I just also see them and want them fixed.

[Davers]

razenWing, on 01 November 2016 - 04:32 AM, said:

I find myself in a rare agreement with Tristan winter. I also like to add that... how many games do you know created with exclusive online play NOT from big developers actually survive 5 years?

None? Oh, so this game is actually not as bad as it seems, eh?

Oh, you mean League of Legends, World of Tanks, Dota 2, Hawken, STO, etc?

[Dee Eight]

Hunka Junk, on 01 November 2016 - 10:22 AM, said:

Dragonfall Director's Cut has an 87 on Metacritic. To be fair, XCOM;Enemy Within scored 92, and Enemy Unknown 89.

http://www.metacriti...--directors-cut

That's comparing HBS, a small outfit, to 2K games, maybe not the biggest but definitely up there.

The day PGI puts out a game that scores an 87 on Metacritic is the day I'll grab a bottle of ketchup and eat my laptop.

Scoring high on a review (especially when many reviewers earn their income doing those reviews) doesn't really amount to anything when the overall game sucks and the players flee in the tens of thousands after the first month.

[razenWing]

Davers, on 01 November 2016 - 10:33 AM, said:

Oh, you mean League of Legends, World of Tanks, Dota 2, Hawken, STO, etc?

O come on, LoL and Dota 2 are MOBA. They caught the trend just as Blizzard came from no where to become a triple A developer in RTS games back in 1995. LoL and Dota were never niche games.

I dunno how long WoT have been out, but according to steam charts, it has LESS people than MWO, so what is the issue there?

Are you kidding me with Hawken? Again, according to Steam Chart... 150 players. So yea, nice argument there.

As for STO (I'm assuming Star Trek Online), again, comparable numbers to MWO. AND I believe there are more Trekkies in this world compare to BTech fanboys.

So of all the example you gave me, none of it disprove how MWO underperformed after 5 years. And again, you can't cite me titles that went main stream, or you might as well say Candy Crush. Or if you are implying MWO ever becoming main stream, then you need to re-evaluate what you are actually playing.

BTech is a niche genre. Plain and simple. Niche genre with less resources survive 5 years. I await your "examples."

[RestosIII]

Dee Eight, on 01 November 2016 - 10:54 AM, said:

Scoring high on a review (especially when many reviewers earn their income doing those reviews) doesn't really amount to anything when the overall game sucks and the players flee in the tens of thousands after the first month.

Are you saying that the majority of their reviews mean nothing because it's a reviewer's job to review games? Seriously? And did you not read the explanation as to WHY player numbers drop for a game like that at all?

razenWing, on 01 November 2016 - 10:57 AM, said:

WoT

razenWing, on 01 November 2016 - 10:57 AM, said:

steam charts

You do realize that World of Tanks: Blitz isn't World of Tanks, right? They're separate games. Normal WoT isn't on Steam.

Edited by RestosIII, 01 November 2016 - 11:02 AM.

[Davers]

razenWing, on 01 November 2016 - 10:57 AM, said:

O come on, LoL and Dota 2 are MOBA. They caught the trend just as Blizzard came from no where to become a triple A developer in RTS games back in 1995. LoL and Dota were never niche games.

I dunno how long WoT have been out, but according to steam charts, it has LESS people than MWO, so what is the issue there?

Are you kidding me with Hawken? Again, according to Steam Chart... 150 players. So yea, nice argument there.

As for STO (I'm assuming Star Trek Online), again, comparable numbers to MWO. AND I believe there are more Trekkies in this world compare to BTech fanboys.

So of all the example you gave me, none of it disprove how MWO underperformed after 5 years. And again, you can't cite me titles that went main stream, or you might as well say Candy Crush. Or if you are implying MWO ever becoming main stream, then you need to re-evaluate what you are actually playing.

BTech is a niche genre. Plain and simple. Niche genre with less resources survive 5 years. I await your "examples."

WoT is a HUGE game, Steam notwithstanding. Can I take you seriously after you say things like this?

Dota and LoL CREATED the MOBA- they weren't riding on the coattails of some popular trend.

Blizzard didn't start out big. But they became big because of the excellence of their work. They revolutionized the genre, several times.

As for Hawken, you statement was " how many games do you know created with exclusive online play NOT from big developers actually survive 5 years?" so Hawken still counts. It's still here.

Claiming that MWO is the only game to last 5 years that wasn't made by a big developer is wrong.

[kuma8877]

90% of over 7000 reviews on steam for Shadowrun are positive. I'm wondering if some people don't understand most single player games and their general lifecycle... dropping player numbers since release of a single player story driven game are the norm. Always has been, always will be. Unless of course you think there is value in thinking the number of people currently playing commander keen, has any bearing on whether or not that was a good game...

[razenWing]

Davers, on 01 November 2016 - 11:14 AM, said:

WoT is a HUGE game, Steam notwithstanding. Can I take you seriously after you say things like this?

Dota and LoL CREATED the MOBA- they weren't riding on the coattails of some popular trend.

Blizzard didn't start out big. But they became big because of the excellence of their work. They revolutionized the genre, several times.

As for Hawken, you statement was " how many games do you know created with exclusive online play NOT from big developers actually survive 5 years?" so Hawken still counts. It's still here.

Claiming that MWO is the only game to last 5 years that wasn't made by a big developer is wrong.

I don't play WoT, so I go by what's on the Steam Chart. 900 concurrent is not HUGE by any stretch of the imagination. I could it wrong, maybe it's tracked somewhere else. Post the stats then, prove me wrong.

As for Hawken, if a game has only 150 players, technically it's not dead, but MWO is not played by just 150 players, correct? So PGI is doing 10x better than Hawken, again I ask, what's the issue here?

(O and, maybe you need to read up on history of MOBA. I was there when nobody played regular WC3 games and started playing the Custom Map. THAT'S where it got started. Now, I am not going to say that the developers didn't take a risk to go from WC3 Custom Games to independent title, but they HAD a huge fanbase ready to go main stream. It's not like there wasn't any indication and came out of no where.)

Edited by razenWing, 01 November 2016 - 11:21 AM.

[RestosIII]

razenWing, on 01 November 2016 - 11:18 AM, said:

I don't play WoT, so I go by what's on the Steam Chart. 900 concurrent is not HUGE by any stretch of the imagination. I could it wrong, maybe it's tracked somewhere else. Post the stats then, prove me wrong.

As for Hawken, if a game has only 150 players, technically it's not dead, but MWO is not played by just 150 players, correct? So PGI is doing 10x better than Hawken, again I ask, what's the issue here?

(O and, maybe you need to read up on history of MOBA. I was there when nobody played regular WC3 games and started playing the Custom Map. THAT'S where it got started. Now, I am not going to say that the developers didn't take a risk to go from WC3 Custom Games to independent title, but they HAD a huge fanbase ready to go main stream. It's not like there wasn't any indication and came out of no where.)

Just loaded up WoT, and that's how many people are online RIGHT NOW for the US East server. And as I said earlier, WoT Blitz is an entirely different game from WoT. Oh, and the right side is the US server put together, both east and west. And that's the player pop at 3:24 PM EST on a Tuesday.

Edited by RestosIII, 01 November 2016 - 11:24 AM.

[jss78]

razenWing, on 01 November 2016 - 11:18 AM, said:

I don't play WoT, so I go by what's on the Steam Chart. 900 concurrent is not HUGE by any stretch of the imagination. I could it wrong, maybe it's tracked somewhere else. Post the stats then, prove me wrong.

I've never played World of Tanks, but right this moment World of Warships -- which I think is a much smaller game -- has about 30,000 people on the EU server alone. There are three other servers I think. Now those are numbers reported by the game client, and just maybe they cheat there, but WoWS does seem to have a lot of players. Using PGI terminology WoWS has a sh*t-ton of "buckets" (10 ship tiers, plus separate sets of tiers for ranked and co-op play), and I rarely see the same players.

So MWO is pretty tiny compared to these games.

I have no issue though with the general statement that PGI has business-wise done well. And yeah, I think it's a wonderful game.

[RestosIII]

jss78, on 01 November 2016 - 11:38 AM, said:

I've never played World of Tanks, but right this moment World of Warships -- which I think is a much smaller game -- has about 30,000 people on the EU server alone. There are three other servers I think. Now those are numbers reported by the game client, and just maybe they cheat there, but WoWS does seem to have a lot of players. Using PGI terminology WoWS has a sh*t-ton of "buckets" (10 ship tiers, plus separate sets of tiers for ranked and co-op play), and I rarely see the same players.

So MWO is pretty tiny compared to these games.

I have no issue though with the general statement that PGI has business-wise done well. And yeah, I think it's a wonderful game.

'points to my post right above yours showing the current WoT numbers on the US server'

[C E Dwyer]

Dee Eight, on 01 November 2016 - 04:57 AM, said:

I haven't paid much attention to the who which company is behind the "new" battletech, but mentioning shadowrun.... that I do know flopped... boy I'm glad I didn't partake in that kickstarter for BT now. And having industry vets doesn't ever guarantee great success if all they turn out is a lame product. Shadowrun returns for example launched onto steam for example with a peak twenty four thousand players in July 2013, and then bled out like a sucking chest wound in only a couple months. According to steamcharts the 24 hour peak was 65 players.

http://steamcharts.com/app/234650

Shadowrun : Hong Kong isn't doing much better...

http://steamcharts.com/app/346940

Shadowrun : dragon's fall...

http://steamcharts.com/app/300550

And finally shadowrun : chronicles...wow...launch month peak of a bit over 700... really kept the players interest by 2015 didn't they....

http://steamcharts.com/app/267750

This for a game harebrained kickstarted in 2012 and kept missing goals, dates, etc. People criticize PGI over MWO but at least we have a game, five years on, that THOUSANDS play every day. Not a game that gets a couple hundred people a day.

All the Shadow run stories are just that a story a beginning and an end, also low budget, so once the story is told, there really isn't a lot of point in going over old ground, which many don't, which is why the numbers fall away

Graphically it's not amazing, It's not even close to Xcom 2 but it's not poor, it reminded me of the first neverwinter, and I wanted one of the characters to yell got for the Eyes boo, which if course they couldn't have in. It's far from ground breaking but it's a damn sight better than that pile of crap smedley is bringing out, after sony gave them the boot and they dropped Everquest next

Edited by Cathy, 01 November 2016 - 11:59 AM.

[DaZur]

TLBFestus, on 01 November 2016 - 09:22 AM, said:

Honestly?

I don't see a lot of that kind of "hate for the game" that you refer to anymore. Go back a few years and, yes, it was alive and well and rampant. Nowadays? Not nearly so much. Nowadays it's more of a resigned antipathy.

Oh, no I agree... The general consensus right now is definately resignation. My point is/was there are a "handful" of members who are clearly past the point of no return who, on a routine basis come here with no grander intention than to cause derision, froth at the mouth and to denigrate anyone who dares to continue to find any redemption in this game.

These are the people that just need to get over it and move on... There is no restitution save for the ruination of PGI and MWO in these folks minds and it's poisonous and counter-productive.

[Deathlike]

DaZur, on 01 November 2016 - 12:14 PM, said:

Oh, no I agree... The general consensus right now is definately resignation. My point is/was there are a "handful" of members who are clearly past the point of no return who, on a routine basis come here with no grander intention than to cause derision, froth at the mouth and to denigrate anyone who dares to continue to find any redemption in this game.

These are the people that just need to get over it and move on... There is no restitution save for the ruination of PGI and MWO in these folks minds and it's poisonous and counter-productive.

PGI is allowed to redeem itself.

They are simply doing a terrible job of it.

Everything gets an equal opportunity to be reevaluated.

Edited by Deathlike, 01 November 2016 - 12:30 PM.

[DaZur]

Deathlike, on 01 November 2016 - 12:29 PM, said:

PGI is allowed to redeem itself.

They are simply doing a terrible job of it.

Everything gets an equal opportunity to be reevaluated.

Honestly... You I believe this to be true. Others... Not so much.

[TLBFestus]

DaZur, on 01 November 2016 - 12:14 PM, said:

Oh, no I agree... The general consensus right now is definately resignation. My point is/was there are a "handful" of members who are clearly past the point of no return who, on a routine basis come here with no grander intention than to cause derision, froth at the mouth and to denigrate anyone who dares to continue to find any redemption in this game.

These are the people that just need to get over it and move on... There is no restitution save for the ruination of PGI and MWO in these folks minds and it's poisonous and counter-productive.

Those of us still here serve a purpose though. At the very least we bittervets are here to keep the "history" alive and warn new players not to fall for the same PGI lines.

Even if it doesn't work we get to eventually say "TOLD YA SO!". It's sort of like seeing this young athlete come along with all this potential and having to sit there and watch them waste it. Damn that's frustrating.....

[Accused]

DaZur, on 01 November 2016 - 12:14 PM, said:

My point is/was there are a "handful" of members who are clearly past the point of no return who, on a routine basis come here with no grander intention than to cause derision, froth at the mouth and to denigrate anyone who dares to continue to find any redemption in this game.

But that's the fun part of the game.

[MW222]

Karl Streiger, on 31 October 2016 - 10:52 PM, said:

Well considering the other games of the FPS era - planetside, titanfall and others.
Mwo is persistent - but only because of customers that behave like masochists - please can you hurt us a little bit more. Look there there it doesn't hurt.
It also shows the tradegy of MWO it would have been a Class A game if the game only meet half the expectations of its customers.
But well as most addicts I think I'm cured - April was my cure.

They might announce MWO 2 on the Mechcon but with the same guys there is no future

Na - I play and play, well I did stop when the mini map started making me gag a bit. 8-)

I would like to make note of the fact that I do not, have not and WILL NOT PAY AND PAY.

So I will keep playing as long as it is fun but my wallet stays closed.

Edited by MW222, 01 November 2016 - 03:13 PM.