62 replies to this topic

[H I A S]

Stormie, on 21 December 2016 - 06:32 PM, said:

If you are getting shot in the back you did something wrong. the regularity of being killed by a backshot is far lower than the regularity of having that extra armour on the front saving you.

Its common to get shots in your back if you go straight for Omega

[Darth Futuza]

Lol at first I thought this post was a quickplay post and I was really sad I wasn't averaging at least 1000+ dmg a match. But yes, try to avoid getting microwaved like a potato.

[Jiffy]

Uh, getting over 1000 damage in the majority of matches is pretty unrealistic. I break 1000 fairly often but probably not even 1/3 of my games break 1000. But I still know I'm an above average player. So I don't really know what to make of this.

[Clownwarlord]

Stormie, on 21 December 2016 - 06:32 PM, said:

Best Post ever KineticX


If you are getting shot in the back you did something wrong. the regularity of being killed by a backshot is far lower than the regularity of having that extra armour on the front saving you.

Actually I am pretty sure you are doing something wrong then. Ever hear of friendly fire, yeah team mates are **** bags.

[H I A S]

Clownwarlord, on 21 December 2016 - 11:48 PM, said:

Actually I am pretty sure you are doing something wrong then. Ever hear of friendly fire, yeah team mates are **** bags.

Maybe u should stop running in front of a friendly fireingline and stop facehugging?

[Shalune]

arivio, on 22 December 2016 - 12:46 AM, said:

Maybe u should stop running in front of a friendly fireingline and stop facehugging?

As a solo queuer this more often happens because people stack up behind you while you're trying to work a corner.

[Red Shrike]

Shalune, on 22 December 2016 - 01:06 AM, said:

As a solo queuer this more often happens because people stack up behind you while you're trying to work a corner.

What better cover than a teammate? I see the same kind of stacking happen in World of Tanks. (not saying that it's a good thing)
I mean, teammates give the enemy something other than you to shoot at.

[Appogee]

Sir Poodlington, on 21 December 2016 - 10:03 PM, said:

So I am routinely NOT doing 1,000 damage a match. I don't think I have ever done 1,000 damage a match...

I'm going to go back to quickplay and farm up until I have a recommended drop deck, but you should at least give us noobs a trial layout if you want us to stick to it!

In the Heavies:
Warhammer 6D and 6R
Thunderbolts are still good and cheap, just out of fashion.
Black Knight 6 or 7

In the Mediums:
Griffins are good, but require skill in positioning to do well
Crabs are tanky and probably a better choice for new players
A Centurion AL with 3LP will pull its weight without requiring you to facetank

In Lights:
Hero Jenner is best, but costs $
Wolfhounds or Firestarters are probably your best free Mech
Maybe a Spider 5D

My IS deck is usually some combination of BLR-2C, BLK-6, WHM-6D, JR7-O, GRF-2N, WHM-BW, LCT-1E or LCT-PB

Jiffy, on 21 December 2016 - 11:36 PM, said:

Uh, getting over 1000 damage in the majority of matches is pretty unrealistic. I break 1000 fairly often but probably not even 1/3 of my games break 1000. But I still know I'm an above average player. So I don't really know what to make of this.

It's not unrealistic at all. I've played 16 FP 4.1 matches, got beaten in12 of them (mostly due to PUGs vs teams) but only achieved less than 1000 damage once.

I'm sorry, but there's no way an above-average player isn't consistently doing more than 1000 damage in a FP match. I recommend you rethink either your drop deck or your tactics.

Edited by Appogee, 22 December 2016 - 01:54 AM.

[meteorol]

Kin3ticX, on 21 December 2016 - 03:33 PM, said:

They are tier 5 and they do 60 damage in quickplay

CW puggels, especially IS loyalist puggels make T5s look like godtier players in comparison on a pretty regular basis. The sole reason they are T5 is because there is no tier below 5.

[TWIAFU]

Appogee, on 21 December 2016 - 03:35 PM, said:

But I went to Faction Play because it's "hardcore mode" and to escape PUGtatoes!

Cannot get away from PUGtatoes/PUGtards when you are campaigning FOR a PUGtatoe/PUGtard only CW queue.

[Starbomber109]

Kin3ticX, on 21 December 2016 - 10:35 PM, said:

If you did an experiment where after each time you die you increase your armor in the direction you died from by 1 point, you would eventually have 0 rear armor.

I'm just curious, why 4? Is it arbitrary or is there some reason to it? For example, I know that people run at least 12 head armor because that is the minimum so you don't get killed in one hit by dual gauss builds (and there are people out there skilled enough to headshot you. Just throwing that out there.) What's the point of 4 rear armor though? Even with 5, i've never been hit by any combination of weapons in the back that has killed me in one hit from full health. Is there something 'magical' about 4 back armor or is it just arbitrary. I'm sorry if this is off topic but it's bugged me for a while. (What's to stop me from using only 1-3 back armor?)

Also (more on-topic) you don't have to sit in the back to do 1k damage, I saw a streamer playing FW with a silly deck of 4 griffons. Do you wanna know how much damage he did? 2k+ It was beautiful, and inspirational. I realize not everyone has 4 Griffon 2n (and that's actually a really bad dropdeck because it's light on armor, very light) but what I am trying to highlight is even with hella short range builds you can easily do tons of damage.

Edited by Starbomber109, 22 December 2016 - 08:29 AM.

[Nephologist]

soooooooo pretty much tl;dr version is "bad players, stop acting like bad players and start acting like good players."

amirite?

[Pat Kell]

Starbomber109, on 22 December 2016 - 08:28 AM, said:

I'm just curious, why 4? Is it arbitrary or is there some reason to it? For example, I know that people run at least 12 head armor because that is the minimum so you don't get killed in one hit by dual gauss builds (and there are people out there skilled enough to headshot you. Just throwing that out there.) What's the point of 4 rear armor though? Even with 5, i've never been hit by any combination of weapons in the back that has killed me in one hit from full health. Is there something 'magical' about 4 back armor or is it just arbitrary. I'm sorry if this is off topic but it's bugged me for a while. (What's to stop me from using only 1-3 back armor?)

Also (more on-topic) you don't have to sit in the back to do 1k damage, I saw a streamer playing FW with a silly deck of 4 griffons. Do you wanna know how much damage he did? 2k+ It was beautiful, and inspirational. I realize not everyone has 4 Griffon 2n (and that's actually a really bad dropdeck because it's light on armor, very light) but what I am trying to highlight is even with hella short range builds you can easily do tons of damage.

He said you should use 4 or less....there is nothing wrong with 1-3 armor. I use 4 most of the time because I am OCD and I tend to push a lot so get hit in the back more than probably most people. Basically 4 armor can help with those random stray laser shots from either friendlies trying to help or enemies not trying to help but in the end if you are getting focused in the back, short of putting 20+ armor in your rear and charging them in reverse, you are just wasting that armor. Also, 4 armor is a good amount of armor to protect yourself from taking too much internal damage from an arty strike (which happens more often than people realize). You will still take a little but usually not much.

In all fairness, going with 1 armor would probably increase your survivability in the long run if you look at a lot of matches. Just give it a shot and see how many times you get cored out from the back vs dying from the front. The more armor you can put in the front tends to work out better for you. Usually...most of the time....well, more than half the time

Nephologist, on 22 December 2016 - 08:49 AM, said:

soooooooo pretty much tl;dr version is "bad players, stop acting like bad players and start acting like good players."

amirite?

No, he actually gave some good advice that doesn't require joining a team...find a good player, follow them around, see what builds they have, where they position themselves, how they move, when they move on and on and on. Take it personal if you like but those who are willing to listen to Kinetix will find some positive results from listening to his advice.

[Lyons De Flamand]

Starbomber109, on 22 December 2016 - 08:28 AM, said:

I'm just curious, why 4? Is it arbitrary or is there some reason to it? For example, I know that people run at least 12 head armor because that is the minimum so you don't get killed in one hit by dual gauss builds (and there are people out there skilled enough to headshot you. Just throwing that out there.) What's the point of 4 rear armor though? Even with 5, i've never been hit by any combination of weapons in the back that has killed me in one hit from full health. Is there something 'magical' about 4 back armor or is it just arbitrary. I'm sorry if this is off topic but it's bugged me for a while. (What's to stop me from using only 1-3 back armor?)

Also (more on-topic) you don't have to sit in the back to do 1k damage, I saw a streamer playing FW with a silly deck of 4 griffons. Do you wanna know how much damage he did? 2k+ It was beautiful, and inspirational. I realize not everyone has 4 Griffon 2n (and that's actually a really bad dropdeck because it's light on armor, very light) but what I am trying to highlight is even with hella short range builds you can easily do tons of damage.

That was Panzermagier, correct? He is a skilled pilot. Three outside factors to that match though.

1. Griffin 2N is a solid Mech, especially if you can get behind the enemy.
2. The locust that was with him distracting almost every single kill was the real hero
3. The rest of the team was on coms, holding the line and not dying off foolishly.

[Nephologist]

Pat Kell, on 22 December 2016 - 08:55 AM, said:

No, he actually gave some good advice that doesn't require joining a team...find a good player, follow them around, see what builds they have, where they position themselves, how they move, when they move on and on and on. Take it personal if you like but those who are willing to listen to Kinetix will find some positive results from listening to his advice.

Everything you just listed falls under "Acting like a good player." I never said it wasn't good advice, just that you can sum it up (tl;dr) with the phrase "Acting like a good player."

Also, how the heck do you take something like this personally?

[Starbomber109]

Lyons De Flamand, on 22 December 2016 - 09:03 AM, said:

That was Panzermagier, correct? He is a skilled pilot. Three outside factors to that match though.

1. Griffin 2N is a solid Mech, especially if you can get behind the enemy.
2. The locust that was with him distracting almost every single kill was the real hero
3. The rest of the team was on coms, holding the line and not dying off foolishly.

It was, and yes those are good points as well. It just kinda reminded me of a similar scenario when Sean Lang was playing 4x Cicadas in FW 2.0 (I think?). In contrast, those 4 cicadas hid behind their teammates the whole time. That's more the scenario people are thinking of when they see 3000 dmg games. They're thinking of the Guass/PPC Shadow Cat sitting on that stupid ledge on grim portico sniping for the entire game. I was trying to point out that there's other ways to 'farm damage'

My most damaging QP match was in an atlas, and I did roughly 1012 damage. If I could do that in FP, that would mean my other 3 mechs are fine! (As a side note I've only done that once, and I would never bring an Atlas RS into FP unless we needed a 12 Atlas rush or something)

Edited by Starbomber109, 22 December 2016 - 09:44 AM.

[meteorol]

Jiffy, on 21 December 2016 - 11:36 PM, said:

Uh, getting over 1000 damage in the majority of matches is pretty unrealistic. I break 1000 fairly often but probably not even 1/3 of my games break 1000. But I still know I'm an above average player. So I don't really know what to make of this.

Did you see this was a FW related post?
If you can't manage above 1k average damage in CW you are probably not an above average player.
I failed to get 1k damage in CW a grand total of 5 times since CW was released. Which was... 2 years ago. And i played hundreds of CW matches.

[Jeff on a Buffalo]

While I agree that new players would have a difficult time in FW, a blank statement that one should get 1K in most matches does not really help any. If the player doing less than 1K is actually trying, following the lead of the DC, learning the game, making changes to his play style and mechs to improve and is having fun, then I have no issue with them playing FW. Guys on the team doing over 2K damage that disregards all direction from the drop caller and cajoles the other people on the team and wines, those are the ones that are in the wrong game mode and should go back to quick play since FW is the area where players should be expected to play as a team.
Cheers

[Jman5]

Jeff on a Buffalo, on 22 December 2016 - 10:19 AM, said:

While I agree that new players would have a difficult time in FW, a blank statement that one should get 1K in most matches does not really help any. If the player doing less than 1K is actually trying, following the lead of the DC, learning the game, making changes to his play style and mechs to improve and is having fun, then I have no issue with them playing FW. Guys on the team doing over 2K damage that disregards all direction from the drop caller and cajoles the other people on the team and wines, those are the ones that are in the wrong game mode and should go back to quick play since FW is the area where players should be expected to play as a team.
Cheers

I don't think anyone is going after people who are trying to improve. This is more geared toward people who seem satisfied with sub-1000 damage games in FP.

I feel there is often an over-emphasis on "teamplay" and "organization" and "drop calling". Yes of course they are valuable. But, killing the other team's mechs is king. Unless you do nothing but objective rush, there is a minimum amount of hitpoints your team needs to punch through in order to win. If your team can't put those numbers up collectively, then it doesn't matter how organized you are or how well you drop called.

You have to address the fundamentals, or else all this teamwork stuff is just trying to polish a ****. I think giving struggling players a concrete damage number to aim for is helpful. It cuts through a lot of the BS that people throw around here.

Edited by Jman5, 22 December 2016 - 10:52 AM.

[RaptorCWS]

Jiffy, on 21 December 2016 - 11:36 PM, said:

Uh, getting over 1000 damage in the majority of matches is pretty unrealistic. I break 1000 fairly often but probably not even 1/3 of my games break 1000. But I still know I'm an above average player. So I don't really know what to make of this.

I break 1500 regularly solo or with my unit and if i had a really bad game and we get drop ship camped im still around 900. occasionally i break 2k. but 250 damage a mech is not a lot nor is it really difficult to do. and you dont really have to break 250 on each mech. on a good game where im breaking 2k half of it is on my first mech

Jman5, on 22 December 2016 - 10:44 AM, said:

I don't think anyone is going after people who are trying to improve. This is more geared toward people who seem satisfied with sub-1000 damage games in FP.

Exactly if you are consistently making scores that are = to or lower than one mech in quick play across 4 mechs you are doing something wrong (and lets throw out dropship stompings from the equation ). if you are in a match and you have a teammate at the end of the game who has done extremely well compared to you ask them about what mechs they brought or their builds. most people will be willing to tell you and teach you how to get better.

anyone want to create a thread showing good builds and drop decks for factionplay for new players? this might help a lot of people out.

Edited by RaptorCWS, 22 December 2016 - 11:02 AM.