83 replies to this topic

[invernomuto]

Snazzy Dragon, on 22 December 2016 - 01:58 PM, said:

Timber wolf drops to xl 350, drops ferro, forum explodes over double gauss timber wolf rampage bad idea

Why Timber should not have dual gauss like a Night Gyr?
They could always balance the unlocking of omnimech with some sort of penalities (e.g. light negative quirks, a C-Bills cost for unlocking, etc).

[El Bandito]

KodiakGW, on 22 December 2016 - 03:47 PM, said:

4 locked JJ on Night Gyr. Basically 4 tons of hover capability. Got myself a refund early.

Gyr is very good despite fixed JJs. Actually, in many cases, the Gyr is very good because it has JJs to poptart.

invernomuto, on 23 December 2016 - 01:10 AM, said:

Why Timber should not have dual gauss like a Night Gyr?
They could always balance the unlocking of omnimech with some sort of penalities (e.g. light negative quirks, a C-Bills cost for unlocking, etc).

To allow the two to have distinct flavor? One is a pack hunter fast enough to keep up with Mediums, while the other is a slower but bigger weapon platform.

Edited by El Bandito, 23 December 2016 - 01:32 AM.

[LordNothing]

i think i would open up the engine to upgrades to allow for a narrow band of engines that may be utilized in an omni. something like +/- 25 engine rating, and ability to run stds. id also do a half compliment rule for jump jets, only half the jets are fixed and additional jets are optional. id also make some of the heat sinks on select mechs optional.

of course i would also do a lot of things to make is have a chance. like an engine mount upgrade that moves 2 of the st crits to the ct, in exchange for not being able to equip std engines, loosing ct weapon mounts, and maybe a hit to engine heat sink performance or something like that. this would make is xl engines gain clan like destruction behavior. also perhaps an external armor upgrade that lets you stick an extra ton of armor per crit. also increase hitpoints on some things like the ac20 and gauss to make them a little more durable.

[Y E O N N E]

The forums also also exploded when they last added negative quirks to the Timberwolf, nevermind that the effects they had were negligible.

[invernomuto]

El Bandito, on 23 December 2016 - 01:28 AM, said:

Gyr is very good despite fixed JJs. Actually, in many cases, the Gyr is very good because it has JJs to poptart.

Agreed. With PPC + Gauss the JJs on NG are very, very useful.

[Alex Morgaine]

keep locked equip. allow ferro/endo swapping.

oh and shs/DHS cause wtf early IS omni tech

[Jay Leon Hart]

How about a compromise, so we don't end up changing from...

Clan BMs >> Clan OMs ~ IS BMS

to

Clan OMs >> Clan BMs >> IS BMs

Instead, limit the equipment unlocks on Omnis to those running STOCK PODS ONLY

You can't just make Omnis better than Battlemechs, or we just get the same problem from the other side. There has to be a compromise.

[Edit]

627, on 22 December 2016 - 03:32 PM, said:

how about that, if you unlock fixed equipment you are no longer able to change omnipods and have to take the stock hardpoints?

Missed this one [/Edit]

Edited by Jay Leon Hart, 23 December 2016 - 03:19 AM.

[Y E O N N E]

I mean, the TT rules for Omnis actually do let you change engines and such, your 'Mech just becomes a standard BattleMech after that point, with all the costs that go with it.

PGI could implement this rule by requiring you to run only stock hardpoints if you change the engine and such but, honestly? The only interesting thing that does is get us a TBR-S with Dual Gauss that runs faster than a Night Gyr by using an XL 350. It just makes the game more boring by stealing the wind from the sails of other already great 'Mechs.

[The Zohan]

This mess that we re experiencing in-game is what you get when you allow full (at least for battlemechs) customization - its a stupid idea from the beginning. Everyone that played TT knows that. Sadly, PGI is not willing nor able to fix that.

Edited by The Zohan, 23 December 2016 - 12:47 PM.

[KodiakGW]

El Bandito, on 23 December 2016 - 01:28 AM, said:

Gyr is very good despite fixed JJs. Actually, in many cases, the Gyr is very good because it has JJs to poptart.

Just saying, do they need to be locked? Would 4 tons being free make it OP, or open up the mech to more players because they can make it fit their play style better? Don't get me wrong, I may end up trying one out when they come out for Cbills. Poptarting is not my play style. It would have been a done deal for cash if they were removable.

[Y E O N N E]

KodiakGW, on 23 December 2016 - 01:35 PM, said:

Just saying, do they need to be locked? Would 4 tons being free make it OP, or open up the mech to more players because they can make it fit their play style better? Don't get me wrong, I may end up trying one out when they come out for Cbills. Poptarting is not my play style. It would have been a done deal for cash if they were removable.

KodiakGW, on 23 December 2016 - 01:35 PM, said:

Just saying, do they need to be locked? Would 4 tons being free make it OP, or open up the mech to more players because they can make it fit their play style better? Don't get me wrong, I may end up trying one out when they come out for Cbills. Poptarting is not my play style. It would have been a done deal for cash if they were removable.

What would you do with those 4 extra tons that you can't already do on it, though? That's kinda what makes it so good. It can do dakka, LRMs, and PPFLD extremely well (as much as LRMs can be good, I guess), the only thing it is mediocre at is laser vomit. It would be mediocre at laser vomit even without the JJs, because it only runs at 69.4 kph while even IS vomit 'Mechs run at least 75, and more usually 81.3 kph.

[Snazzy Dragon]

KodiakGW, on 23 December 2016 - 01:35 PM, said:

Just saying, do they need to be locked? Would 4 tons being free make it OP, or open up the mech to more players because they can make it fit their play style better? Don't get me wrong, I may end up trying one out when they come out for Cbills. Poptarting is not my play style. It would have been a done deal for cash if they were removable.

Honestly, you would run out of slots before you can make use of the 4 tons, or would end up with too much ammo for your guns anyway.

[-Rasalom-]

Snowbluff, on 22 December 2016 - 03:39 PM, said:

Pfft, ou don't even know what a TBR is, do you? It s a mediocre crutches up by superior clan tech.

It's far more likely people will up engine their night gets, which are much better suited for ballastics use.

As for the TBR-S side torsos, maybe unlocking the JJs wouldn't be so bad. People shoudlnamwk up their mind as to whether JJs are OP or not.

Is this even a language? "it s a mediocre crutches up by superior clan tech." What "up by" mean? "up engine their night gets" WTF does that even mean?

[Y E O N N E]

Sal Roma, on 23 December 2016 - 02:39 PM, said:

Is this even a language? "it s a mediocre crutches up by superior clan tech." What "up by" mean? "up engine their night gets" WTF does that even mean?

He's probably typing from a phone.

It means the TBR is a 'Mech with mediocre geometry that is only viable because of cXL mechanics and other Clan equipment, aka "crutched up by Clan Tech."

Also, "up-engine their Night Gyr," since it has superior geometry to the TBR, it would be a much better 'Mech than the TBR full-stop if it could run as fast.

[Chuck Jager]

I got to watch the last of the Columbus 500 races when they were in downtown Columbus Ohio.

All of the categories except classic were versions of the same cars with small differences. The Formula did race differently than the stock, but this is more like our weight classes. The cars in the same category did pretty much the same thing on the course.

The classic category was a pure joy to watch. You had heavier cars gaining lengths in every straight away. You had cars that could weave in the banks. You even had cars that were just gorgeous and could still be competitive. They had strengths and weaknesses. I like this feeling when working with mechs. I would love to remove a couple of JJ from most of my Omnis or drop the engine by 1-2 sizes, but being able to move high mount torso lasers on every build is usually worth the price. Also being able to change between ballistic and laser omnis after a nerf/buff cycle is also better than having to buy another chassis and master it.

I have a feeling omnis will have a bit more shine after the skill tree of one is implemented.

[El Bandito]

KodiakGW, on 23 December 2016 - 01:35 PM, said:

Just saying, do they need to be locked? Would 4 tons being free make it OP, or open up the mech to more players because they can make it fit their play style better? Don't get me wrong, I may end up trying one out when they come out for Cbills. Poptarting is not my play style. It would have been a done deal for cash if they were removable.

One really can't make effective use of the extra 4 tons in many cases. Gyr needs space more than weight in most builds.

[Evil Goof]

Garfuncle, on 22 December 2016 - 01:49 PM, said:

Clan battlemechs should not be better performing than Clan omnimechs. I know I know "muh lore" but omnimechs are supposed to be the cutting edge state of the art front line Clan mechs and Clan IICs should be second line reserve mechs pressed into action when omnimechs are in short supply. PGI should look at at least be able to remove fixed heat sinks/probes/jump jets on omnimechs while keeping locked engines and upgrades. That, plus pods and quirks should bring most omnimechs on par with the IICs/Battlemechs.

Then buff inner sphere equipment/weapons to keep them in line with omnimechs. As is most Clan Battlemechs are simply the best mechs in the game and that shouldn't be the case.

So while everyone is screaming clan mechs are OP...you think that omni mechs should be opened up so that they can perform even better?????

[Andi Nagasia]

Evil Goof, on 23 December 2016 - 06:31 PM, said:

So while everyone is screaming clan mechs are OP...you think that omni mechs should be opened up so that they can perform even better?????

all BattleMechs are Better then OmniMechs, its just their are no IS OmniMechs for this to be seen,
not all OmniMechs are OP, unless you can Explain to me how MLXs KFXs ADRs SMNs GARs and others are,
and im not talking about 1 ok build that another Mech can do way way better,

[Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood]

I'd agree with unlocking omnimechs. Currently unlocking omnimechs would really mostly improve the underperforming ones. Timber Wolves would be able to lower their engines for a bit more firepower or dual gauss, but it would still be worse than night gyr due to low mounts and bad geometry.

Night Gyr would be the one to worry about, as it gets the option to increase its engine to get a bit better speed, and keep the jump jets for some dual gauss poptarting with good ammo. This would end up basically just being like the dual gauss Hunchback IIC but with more ammo and armor.

The moment IS omnimechs get added is when I think people will finally change omni rules since lots of IS omnis start with single heatsinks and lack upgrades and have awkward engines so that the worst set of these would be much worse off than the worst of the clan omnis. They also would have IS tech so the forums wouldn't just shout clans OP until the idea dies. There's not much foresight here.

[MacClearly]

Andi Nagasia, on 23 December 2016 - 08:17 PM, said:

all BattleMechs are Better then OmniMechs, its just their are no IS OmniMechs for this to be seen,
not all OmniMechs are OP, unless you can Explain to me how MLXs KFXs ADRs SMNs GARs and others are,
and im not talking about 1 ok build that another Mech can do way way better,

I guess I am going to have to tread careful since you are a mod....

So, what I can explain is that on an omni if you find one or two good builds you can do it on the rest when you are mastering them or three of them to FW.

So while you bring up some mechs that are not great...you can at least do one good build on them all.

Then there are all the mechs that are fantastic. Timby's, Ebon's, etc... to remove the fixed equipment on these? Direwhale and Warhawk would be insanely over the top OP if you didn't have at least some restrictions....

EDIT.... Evil Goof is the Clan account I started and on this device I was signed in under main account.

Edited by MacClearly, 23 December 2016 - 08:56 PM.