54 replies to this topic

[MovinTarget]

As a guy that can safely say he's had his share of very good matches and supremely awful ones as well... I would like to point out that while people really *should* listen to the guys that can get good results from a given variant there are people that simply *can't* run those builds because of any number of reasons, all of which are valid and are good reasons to not be judgmental; one way or the other... We see our dmg/kdr but we don't see avg ping/fps for those matches. We don't know who can only afford to run a baked tater for a computer or have physical challenges that make it difficult to score like the good players.

I'm not apologizing for anyone that could take more effective builds, be more effective, and chooses not to... I'm just saying this b/c I skimmed through the comments and didn't really see anyone conceding that sometimes lurmers gotta lurm 'cause if they didn't they wouldn't be playing.

Yes, you could argue they need to address whatever impedes there performance or GTFO but that's not gonna help the game...

So just asking that y'all take a moment to recognize that there are people reading this thread and that maybe, just maybe could benefit from what you have to offer if the fighting could be dialed back a bit so as to not turn them off...

Edited by MovinTarget, 20 February 2017 - 05:55 PM.

[justcallme A S H]

Ping and FPS is a lame duck excuse IMO.

I play 250ms or more, and 40FPS, some maps more or less.

That said if you take a T3 attitude/build - you'll forever be T3

If you wanna be more then there are plenty of players out there that will gladly show you how and then it's up to you to make that happen.

[MovinTarget]

justcallme A S H, on 20 February 2017 - 06:14 PM, said:

Ping and FPS is a lame duck excuse IMO.

I play 250ms or more, and 40FPS, some maps more or less.

That said if you take a T3 attitude/build - you'll forever be T3

If you wanna be more then there are plenty of players out there that will gladly show you how and then it's up to you to make that happen.

I'm more inclined to side with you, Carl, & co. You know we've dropped many times both with and against each other and yes it's up to players to decide how good they want to be.

[Vxheous]

MovinTarget, on 20 February 2017 - 06:42 PM, said:

I'm more inclined to side with you, Carl, & co. You know we've dropped many times both with and against each other and yes it's up to players to decide how good they want to be.

I agree with you, and physical limitations can often dictate what type of build a person is capable of using. We used to have a guy that played with muscular dystrophy, he was able to minimally use his mouse, but used voice commands to target, walk etc. He would only be able to use lrm boats, and that's ok. At the same time, he understood that the builds were sub-par, which is a different story compared to some on the forums which tout their bad builds as being good builds.

[Zergling]

Dee Eight, on 19 February 2017 - 06:17 PM, said:

Apparently I have the skill needed then. Perhaps you should limit your evaluations to your own skills and not make assumptions about others anymore.

BATTLEMASTER BLR-2C 100 60 40 1.50 80 60 1.33 32,930 112,184 09:26:06

Lol, nice 0.80 Kills/Battle and 329 Damage/Battle.

Dee Eight, on 19 February 2017 - 06:17 PM, said:

WHICH IS LIKE 50% of the solo queue people who play QP matches lately. Are you actually PLAYING the same game as the rest of us ? It also works against the folks who bring streak builds. Or bring NARCs. I love how many folks who whine about putting tonnage to AMS are also the first ones who run to hide next to a mech that brought AMS. And before you say "radar dep module" in response... remember that requires breaking LOS to work. It doesn't do anything if the spotter is behind you, you're being tagged or narced, or if there's no cover available.

Its more that decent players don't need to waste tonnage to counter LRMs effectively.

Dee Eight, on 19 February 2017 - 06:46 PM, said:

I love how I'm so popular that all the Tiertards race to violate the CoC at every opportunity.

FYI, they haven't violated CoC, but by calling people 'Tiertards', you have.

Dee Eight, on 19 February 2017 - 08:11 PM, said:

Yes, I posted my stats to prove my counterpoint to a claim that no amount of skill could make a mixed BLR-2C build effective, as apparently I have the skill to do just that.

Your stats aren't showing anything 'effective'.

Dee Eight, on 19 February 2017 - 08:11 PM, said:

And just because I'm only in the 1+ W/L & K/D ratios on it as a solo vs what others can do with a group queue carrying them does not mean its not an effective way to play the mech.

Again you make the assumption that anyone scoring good (or just better than you) must be playing in the group queue.

Here's the thing: good players pull off better stats than you even in the solo queue!

Dee Eight, on 19 February 2017 - 08:11 PM, said:

Not every player has to bring out a total meta build to have fun and help his/her team win.

Another assumption, that players scoring good must be using meta builds.

Again, good players can and do score better than you without using meta builds.

Dee Eight, on 19 February 2017 - 08:11 PM, said:

But apparently rather than simply say "i disagree and this is what I'd use instead", a number of you would rather insult me while waging your T1 tails and deride my stats and my builds and champion submissions... in a thread that magically got a reply six weeks after the discussion (which was about as the title says, an awesome vs a battlemaster) had ended and suddenly the same usual suspects all arrived in to post insults and like each other's posts of those insults.

That's because your post demonstrated potato-level lack of understanding of the game, and to prevent less knowledgeable players from taking it at face value and going on to become potatoes themselves, it must be refuted.

Dee Eight, on 19 February 2017 - 09:33 PM, said:

As said to me when I post such screen caps... "cherry picked results aren't proof". I took my BLR-2C out tonight for a half dozen matches, The lowest was 305 damage, three of them were 800+ damage.

The difference is the battle results Vxheous Kerensky posted are consistent with that of a skilled player as indicated by his stats.

When you post battle results, the results are inconsistent with your stats, so they are cherry-picked.

Edited by Zergling, 21 February 2017 - 11:49 AM.

[f00lish1]

Vxheous Kerensky, on 19 February 2017 - 08:38 PM, said:

Damn, that is an old photo. I'm pretty sure that this is the game where Kodiak and myself learned that playing in 3rd person mode in Rifleman doesn't work, due to that damned spoiler.

Edited by f00lish1, 22 February 2017 - 10:15 AM.

[Vxheous]

f00lish1, on 22 February 2017 - 10:14 AM, said:

Damn, that is an old photo. I'm pretty sure that this is the game where Kodiak and myself learned that playing in 3rd person mode in Rifleman doesn't work, due to that damned spoiler.

Yeah, looks like Aug 2016. Contrary of popular belief, I don't actually take screenshots of every game I played, and that happened to be one where I had a battlemaster 2c.

[Tarogato]

MovinTarget, on 20 February 2017 - 05:54 PM, said:

As a guy that can safely say he's had his share of very good matches and supremely awful ones as well... I would like to point out that while people really *should* listen to the guys that can get good results from a given variant there are people that simply *can't* run those builds because of any number of reasons, all of which are valid and are good reasons to not be judgmental; one way or the other... We see our dmg/kdr but we don't see avg ping/fps for those matches. We don't know who can only afford to run a baked tater for a computer or have physical challenges that make it difficult to score like the good players.

Ooh, ooh! *raises hand* I apply to this comment!! =D


I still play on a business laptop that generally gets 20-30 fps. I play at 720p resolution, so anything further away than 600m is just a couple stretched pixels on my 15-inch display. I also play on a wireless connection, never ethernet. I get 250-300 ping to Oceanic, which I play roughly half of my games on. I also use a wireless two-button mouse.


I understand what you're trying to say. But... from my point of view, anybody who alleges that having a potato computer or potato connection influences what builds they are capable of playing effectively... is full of shіt. If you get less than 20 fps on average, or if you have physical handicap that prevents you from being able to use a mouse, then you shouldn't be playing this game. Or at most, you should stick to lurms and stay away from anything labeled "competitive."

But if you average 30fps or greater, have a ping 300ms or under, and are physically able to use a mouse, then you have zero excuses. You are just as capable as anybody else in this game - the only thing differentiating you is the time and effort you are willing to put in to be good at the game.

[MovinTarget]

Tarogato, on 23 February 2017 - 09:26 AM, said:

Ooh, ooh! *raises hand* I apply to this comment!! =D


I still play on a business laptop that generally gets 20-30 fps. I play at 720p resolution, so anything further away than 600m is just a couple stretched pixels on my 15-inch display. I also play on a wireless connection, never ethernet. I get 250-300 ping to Oceanic, which I play roughly half of my games on. I also use a wireless two-button mouse.


I understand what you're trying to say. But... from my point of view, anybody who alleges that having a potato computer or potato connection influences what builds they are capable of playing effectively... is full of shіt. If you get less than 20 fps on average, or if you have physical handicap that prevents you from being able to use a mouse, then you shouldn't be playing this game. Or at most, you should stick to lurms and stay away from anything labeled "competitive."

But if you average 30fps or greater, have a ping 300ms or under, and are physically able to use a mouse, then you have zero excuses. You are just as capable as anybody else in this game - the only thing differentiating you is the time and effort you are willing to put in to be good at the game.

I totally get what you're saying. I guess I was trying to be my peacemaker self (oh, when will I learn....) because we have so many different types of players and some *do not care* about meta or concern themselves with performing at a very high level. It is absolutely fair to have an opinion about what is best, and there may be people that will disagree... just trying to point out that people have different concepts of what is "best", "acceptable" or "successful".

I like to win, I try to win, but if I don't assemble/join a 12 man that all want to win, I can't truly impose my desire to win on my teammates, I can only hope they want to win as much as I do.

This is why I keep recommending people group up with likeminded individuals instead of pug dropping (especially in FP). If you can't find people that want to play the way you play, then you are either not trying hard enough to be social or have a rep.

Yes, some people say they can't group up for whatever reason, but one thing you have to all agree on is that this is a team game and if you can't grasp that, you'll probably not be popular, regardless of the mechs you bring...

[Tarogato]

MovinTarget, on 23 February 2017 - 11:58 AM, said:

I like to win, I try to win, but if I don't assemble/join a 12 man that all want to win, I can't truly impose my desire to win on my teammates, I can only hope they want to win as much as I do.

This is why I keep recommending people group up with likeminded individuals instead of pug dropping (especially in FP). If you can't find people that want to play the way you play, then you are either not trying hard enough to be social or have a rep.

Yes, some people say they can't group up for whatever reason, but one thing you have to all agree on is that this is a team game and if you can't grasp that, you'll probably not be popular, regardless of the mechs you bring...

Aye.

If I wanted to chill and just shoot mechs, I'd just play solo queue. And I do that. A lot. I'm antisocial as f***, rarely join groups, even with my own unit. But solo queue is all about me, I don't get too fussed over winning. I see it as me vs myself and me vs the world. If the other 11 dingleberries on my team wanna lose the match, it's only my fault for not carrying them hard enough. At least... this keeps me from getting pіssed at people most of the time.

But I assume if you play FP, you want to win. Which is why I get disappointed at people in FP who clearly aren't doing all they can to win. I just don't understand the mentality there.

[MovinTarget]

Tarogato, on 23 February 2017 - 12:36 PM, said:

Aye.

If I wanted to chill and just shoot mechs, I'd just play solo queue. And I do that. A lot. I'm antisocial as f***, rarely join groups, even with my own unit. But solo queue is all about me, I don't get too fussed over winning. I see it as me vs myself and me vs the world. If the other 11 dingleberries on my team wanna lose the match, it's only my fault for not carrying them hard enough. At least... this keeps me from getting pіssed at people most of the time.

But I assume if you play FP, you want to win. Which is why I get disappointed at people in FP who clearly aren't doing all they can to win. I just don't understand the mentality there.

The mentality is:
"Regardless of what I do or don't do, I will eventually get that free mech bay as a reward for all the subpar matches I've subjected on my team mates..."

Seriously, if you want the potatoes out of FP, just stop dangling the carrots... or gate LP/MP on some benchmarks so that they get *NOTHING* unless they actually contribute some measurable contribution over the course of the match.

[Brakkyn]

Meh.

If being "good" means only using certain 'Mechs with certain loadouts (namely boats) then I'll stay down here at the bottom of the barrel.

I try and loud out my machine with something I think will be effective not just for myself, but for my team, which is not something that throws out hundreds of damage in attempts to one shot people so I can boast about my epeen score at the end of a match the team collectively lost.

[MovinTarget]

Brakkyn, on 23 February 2017 - 02:15 PM, said:

Meh.

If being "good" means only using certain 'Mechs with certain loadouts (namely boats) then I'll stay down here at the bottom of the barrel.

I try and loud out my machine with something I think will be effective not just for myself, but for my team, which is not something that throws out hundreds of damage in attempts to one shot people so I can boast about my epeen score at the end of a match the team collectively lost.

I would not restrict "good" to pure meta users... but there is a huuuuuuuuuuge divide between what some do (bring a logically effective build that may or may not be meta) and bringing a mech that is thrown together and claiming its consistently viable when is only modestly so and only under the perfect conditions....

Honestly, if i play meta its b/c i stumble into and liked it before i knew it was meta...

Edited by MovinTarget, 23 February 2017 - 02:57 PM.

[Vxheous]

Brakkyn, on 23 February 2017 - 02:15 PM, said:

Meh.

If being "good" means only using certain 'Mechs with certain loadouts (namely boats) then I'll stay down here at the bottom of the barrel.

I try and loud out my machine with something I think will be effective not just for myself, but for my team, which is not something that throws out hundreds of damage in attempts to one shot people so I can boast about my epeen score at the end of a match the team collectively lost.

If you can 1-2 shot multiple mechs in a game, and still lost, it probably wasn't your fault. Also being able to kill enemy mechs fast and efficiently is helpful to your team because you are now creating a numbers mismatch in favor of your team

[Zergling]

Brakkyn, on 23 February 2017 - 02:15 PM, said:

Meh.

If being "good" means only using certain 'Mechs with certain loadouts (namely boats) then I'll stay down here at the bottom of the barrel.

Good players are good regardless of the mech they use.

Eg, I've been running my totally-not-meta Blackjack Arrow with a totally-not-meta 235XL + 3x ER Large Lasers build, and produced the following stats in 18 battles:
12 wins, 6 losses (2.00 W/L, 66.67% W/R), 29 kills, 10 deaths (2.90 K/D, 1.61 K/B ), 624 damage/battle

Meanwhile, potato players won't even manage 1.00 W/L, 1.50 K/D, 1.0 K/B and 300 damage/battle in a dakka KDK-3 build, one of the easiest to use and most powerful builds in the game.

Edited by Zergling, 23 February 2017 - 04:22 PM.