182 replies to this topic

[Clownwarlord]

Deathlike, on 03 February 2017 - 09:50 PM, said:

I would argue skittles vs skittles are the worst.

"Close" games tend to be chaotic... because very little teamwork (let alone intelligence) is actually being applied.

Skittles groups teach you nothing, and allow bad habits to be exhibited there.

It's bad for the game as a whole.

So how about you try to come up with a solution that has all of the things I listed below because if you get rid of one (like big groups) you get people angry.

- Keep only one bucket
- Better balanced matches (closer games consistently)
- Rewarding
- All inclusive (solo to big groups)
- Faction Differences
- Loyalist, Merc, Freelancer differences
- Matches are found in a timely fashion

What do you come up with?

Currently in game we have only these being met:
- Keep only one bucket
- All inclusive

Debatable on time of day
- Matches are found in a timely fashion

Edited by Clownwarlord, 03 February 2017 - 10:00 PM.

[Deathlike]

I've already posted what I think should happen:
https://mwomercs.com...ration-problem/

I cannot guarantee better matches. It always depends on what you have at the time in the first place. So, you can't really accelerate the match issue either (it's a population problem).

I have no specific ideas for loyalist-merc-freelancer differences (I could spend time figuring that out, but that's not my current priority). I don't have any specific ideas for individual factions (outside of faction specific rewards like mechs that provide a C-bill/loyalty points bonus - different ones specific to each faction).

What would also have to happen are more fundamental changes to FP as well, but that's a discussion for another day.

Edited by Deathlike, 03 February 2017 - 10:14 PM.

[Starbomber109]

I actually kinda like the idea that FP would be the place for "Only 12 Man!" drops.

[justcallme A S H]

Clownwarlord, on 03 February 2017 - 08:43 PM, said:

1. The hubs are not adequately posted for people that are solo to get into. I have been pushing for years that a stickey thread get made with ALL TS that are open for people to drop into but no such luck. And when you do go into the hubs that are open they usually are empty actually outside of events I would say they are always empty.
2. Done that but activity levels always drop outside of events and after a patch so that there isn very rarely a consistent group to hang out with.
3. Done that and refer to 2 because it is the same thing (group / team, are same thing).

Furthermore on the TS subject using the MWO search function to find active team speaks is a pain in the *** because their search engine is always broke even when it does find results the results are never what you are looking for.

Example of what I am referring to is this thread, first search result https://mwomercs.com...mspeak-servers/

Over half the TS information is outdated and either doesn't work or you go into and there is no one in them willing to participate in FW because current system sucks and is broken. This is why i am trying to come up with solutions to possibly revive FW.

Your way is status quo which is causing a slow death of the game mode.

1. Rubbish. If you want to find them, you can. I have over 30 TS's for MWO.

2. Again, rubbish. I can TS hop and within 5mins find a 6man+ at basically any time of the day.

3. Try harder. You are just making up B/S. Where there is a will, there is a way.

[Clownwarlord]

justcallme A S H, on 03 February 2017 - 11:38 PM, said:

1. Rubbish. If you want to find them, you can. I have over 30 TS's for MWO.

2. Again, rubbish. I can TS hop and within 5mins find a 6man+ at basically any time of the day.

3. Try harder. You are just making up B/S. Where there is a will, there is a way.

You have 30 TS with active people in it playing FW all day around? Can I have your TS info then, please?

[Clownwarlord]

The worst thing I see is if FW does not get fixed to be fun for everyone then when MW5 and battletech come out MWO will die.

[justcallme A S H]

Deathlike, on 03 February 2017 - 09:50 PM, said:

I would argue skittles vs skittles are the worst.

"Close" games tend to be chaotic... because very little teamwork (let alone intelligence) is actually being applied.

Skittles groups teach you nothing, and allow bad habits to be exhibited there.

It's bad for the game as a whole.

I would absolutely agree. Why? Because of stuff like this... PUG vs PUG as a reasonable player (compared to LRM spuds), can totally smash stuff apart. And I don't even rate myself at the level of players like EmP etc. I'm miles off that without a doubt.

Clownwarlord, on 03 February 2017 - 11:42 PM, said:

You have 30 TS with active people in it playing FW all day around? Can I have your TS info then, please?

That is not what I said. I said I have 30TS's listed.

I hop around, find people. Form a team. Takes usually 5mins or so.

Edited by justcallme A S H, 04 February 2017 - 12:35 AM.

[naterist]

i like the idea of removing 12 mans, they are definitely the problem, though i think the problem is more them being stuck on this idea that faction warfare should exclusively be for them as their reward for 'gettin guuud' which is just rediculuous. you cant hide the only depth this game has as a toss in for when youve mastered everything else it has to offer. thats what comp is for. if you want comp go play comp, thats the only place you will consistently find 'good matches' against 'good teams.'

faction warfare, as the lore aspect of a game that is only relevant because it has an awesome IP that its tied to, hiding that IP's defining traits (factions fighting each other) behind any kind of wall is ridiculous. open up faction play and make the people who only want to meta and dont care about the lore their own place to meta in (which is as i said, competetive play) and start treating faction warfare as the other side of the quickplay coin, because if your here for the lore only, your probably going to get real sick of quickplay, whos only link to lore is the shape and name of the mech weapons, so why require you to complete and learn in that environment for potentially months (or for some people years), just so you can have a chance in the mode you wanted to play in the first place? makes no sense.

[naterist]

Clownwarlord, on 03 February 2017 - 11:48 PM, said:

The worst thing I see is if FW does not get fixed to be fun for everyone then when MW5 and battletech come out MWO will die.

pretty much hit it on the nose there. but lets be honost, if they cant make fw good for all involved, what are the odds im going to even bother buying mw5? they need to prove themselves here before i can trust them with that game. otherwise, im fine only playing battletech. thatll fill my lore love more than pgi can. i doubt most of pgi has even read the novels, or any of the lore related stuff beyond a quick sarna search. if fw is the best lore they can do, what makes you think mw5 will be any better for a battletech fanboy?

Edited by naterist, 04 February 2017 - 02:58 AM.

[Sjorpha]

Of course the best matches a solo pug will see is pug vs pug. As a unit player my best matches is unit vs unit.

Everyone's "best matches" is going to be when their way of playing is the majority.

I wouldn't play FP if I couldn't play as a unit and/or as groups organized within my faction. For me this is what faction play is all about, limiting group size is incompatible with this.

This mode is advertised and designed to be primary mode for units and large scale player organization, and that is what it should be built around going forward. Solo dropping is something that was added as a bonus feature because some people asked for that possibility, but it should not be normative for the mode.

I think it would make much more sense ti limit the amount of solo pugs in a team to 6 or so, so that a team cannot be formed without at least one group in it which can take command of the match.

I would be ok with limiting group size in the quickplay group queue though, to make qp group queue more friendly to small groups and to funnel more large grouos into FP where they belong.

Edited by Sjorpha, 04 February 2017 - 03:19 AM.

[naterist]

considering quickplays lack of links to the lore, why not let the big units and meta guys keep comp to themselves, and let fw be lore focused, and not unit focused. units already have comp as their personla playspace.

you also forget that its marketed as the lore and deep section of the game. your telling me a casual battletech fan shouldnt be expected to like and enjoy the only gameplay aspect that acknowledges the universe that this game is based off of? or that battletech fans playing the battletech part of the game shouldnt be the focus of the battletech related section?

thats just rediculous. yes pgi messed up marketing it as only for the best, but by constantly repeating it, the community is just further sealing in this initial mistake.

also, keep in mind it was the vast majority of units who rejected fw as a 'bad' mode (note that people were shocked emp showed up tonight in fw, this is pretty common amongst units many units, the 12 man premades being much rarer than a pick up 12 man in comstar or the star league TS's. i know many solos who cant get their units into fw, are they cut off because they joined the wrong type of unit and no one there will play and coordinate with them?), and the only guy really doing any for of large scale player driven coordination is mech the dane. one guy cant do the massive player driven coordination it takes to make this work the way pgi intended.

so clearly, their marketing is not hitting who it should be, so why not rework it to work with what we got, and right now the only real survivors of 1.0-3.0 are the guys who loved lore, and find just enough of it in fw to keep them interested. just so happens thats part of the main objective. the problem was they expected those guys to be the top 10 percent of players, which they really arent, and therefore they cant model the game to cater to only the best.

Edited by naterist, 04 February 2017 - 03:46 AM.

[TWIAFU]

Clownwarlord, on 03 February 2017 - 06:23 PM, said:

You are missing something though, with smaller groups and solo players only it allows for a more fluid match maker to balance matches in a timely fashion. With big groups you are unable to do this if at all in a timely fashion because you would have to have timed valves released otherwise you run into an issue of those bigger groups waiting forever for the right opponent.

And your missing something.

CW is made PRIMARILY for Unit/Group play, not solo/4man.

[naterist]

units and groups already have comp, go back to that if you want to fight each other.

[Carl Vickers]

naterist, on 04 February 2017 - 03:57 AM, said:

units and groups already have comp, go back to that if you want to fight each other.

Much like you can go back to QP if you feel you cant cut the mustard in FP, what TWIAFU said is what FP is.

[TWIAFU]

MischiefSC, on 03 February 2017 - 07:33 PM, said:

Why does the whole game, every bit and corner, need to be designed around the lowest common denominator? Why should every level of award be available to the lowest level of effort and performance?

Because mediocrity is the standard now. If you set the bar so low, everyone achieves. Set the bar so low, everyone gets a participation trophy. Set he bar so low everyone can be a special snowflake. Set the bar so low even minimal effort appears to be effort.
[Redacted]

naterist, on 04 February 2017 - 03:57 AM, said:

units and groups already have comp, go back to that if you want to fight each other.

Sorry that groups and units play in the queues that were designed for them to play in. Thankfully, there is a queue available for those that do not like group and/or unit play. See, all playstyles covered each with queues designed for specific styles of play.

[naterist]

TWIAFU, on 04 February 2017 - 04:05 AM, said:

Sorry that groups and units play in the queues that were designed for them to play in. Thankfully, there is a queue available for those that do not like group and/or unit play. See, all playstyles covered each with queues designed for specific styles of play.

point my *** at the que that incorporates lore fans. you units have 3 ques to a casuals 1. seems kinda ****** to be complaining im in "your" que and i should go back to quickplay. if your gonna make a lore mode, make it for lore fans. dont make a lore mode and expect lore fans to jump through hoops to play it.

also, the whole game has a population problem, not just fw. notice when comps going fw ques are slower? thats because people in comp use fw as theyre inbetween comp games location, and HALF OF THOSE GUYS wont even touch it. the world champs dont even play regularly.

clearly this FW is for units thing isnt working. there arent enough units playing continuously, so you need to either refocus it or nix it, because its intended playerbase is spread between this, comp, and group que, while lore fans with jobs or college are just aching for a fair shot at this mode, so why not give it to them when no one its intended for seems to really care anyways?

your way has been tried since fw came out, didnt work. now try and open it up and see what happens.

tl:dr- give fw to the lore fans instead of the units, because the units clearly dont want to play it at a rate that would allow pgi to justify having the que open 24 hours.

[Vxheous]

naterist, on 04 February 2017 - 04:31 AM, said:

point my *** at the que that incorporates lore fans. you units have 3 ques to a casuals 1. seems kinda ****** to be complaining im in "your" que and i should go back to quickplay. if your gonna make a lore mode, make it for lore fans. dont make a lore mode and expect lore fans to jump through hoops to play it.

also, the whole game has a population problem, not just fw. notice when comps going fw ques are slower? thats because people in comp use fw as theyre inbetween comp games location, and HALF OF THOSE GUYS wont even touch it. the world champs dont even play regularly.

clearly this FW is for units thing isnt working. there arent enough units playing continuously, so you need to either refocus it or nix it, because its intended playerbase is spread between this, comp, and group que, while lore fans with jobs or college are just aching for a fair shot at this mode, so why not give it to them when no one its intended for seems to really care anyways?

your way has been tried since fw came out, didnt work. now try and open it up and see what happens.

tl:dr- give fw to the lore fans instead of the units, because the units clearly dont want to play it at a rate that would allow pgi to justify having the que open 24 hours.

You can make it lore builds, potato builds, whatever, good players will still farm you. If you're bad, you're bad. See Ash's post above for pug on pug play where a good player or two can just destroy the other team.

[naterist]

face it carl, you dont have the men. you might not like it, but your special snowflake paradise cant survive off the backs of units alone. you need the pugs. or maybe pgi can limit fw to only 12 mans for a week, preferably on the week i go to vegas. let me know how the hours long que times will be. should be fun to hear you complain about. fact is everything people suggest you just say no, no, no too, but if we did it your way, there wouldnt even be a fw in the first place, because thered be no one playing it anymore. itd make 3.0 look like an overcrowded paradise.

the majority of units dont give a ****, so why do we reserve it for them? lets design it around the people actually playing it.

btws, no wonder every company that had it dropped mechwarrior. the community is filled with shitheads. i understand that niko snow guy pretty well right about now.

Edited by naterist, 04 February 2017 - 04:42 AM.

[naterist]

TWIAFU, on 04 February 2017 - 04:05 AM, said:

Because mediocrity is the standard now. If you set the bar so low, everyone achieves. Set the bar so low, everyone gets a participation trophy. Set he bar so low everyone can be a special snowflake. Set the bar so low even minimal effort appears to be effort.

For example;

[color=#444444]House Republicans have voted 235-180 to overturn an Obama administration that blocked Social Security disability recipients with mental disorders from buying guns. Less than two weeks into Trump's presidency and Republicans have given the mentally ill easier access to guns.[/color]


Do not have the mental facilities to cash a check, don't worry, you can now buy an automatic rifle!

We have mentally ill giving access to guns to the mentally ill.





Sorry that groups and units play in the queues that were designed for them to play in. Thankfully, there is a queue available for those that do not like group and/or unit play. See, all playstyles covered each with queues designed for specific styles of play.

this isnt about republicans handing guns out to idiots, thats what republicans do.

this is about the game. and if your trying to insinuate im not good enough for fw look at my w/l ratio, its almost 2.0
im not saying this for myself. im saying this for the lore fans. if i wanna bust *** for 5 months to get good, my reward should be comp, not a chance to finally get into the only reason i even downloaded the game.

in addition to that, you style of keeping it unit only has been proven not to work. trying to subtly discredit me by implying im unskilled is a ******** way to try and deflect an arguement, and im sick of you dfoing it to everyone who tries to suggest ways to improve. how often do you play carl? i havent seen you butt in fw.... ever really, and i play every night. so why do you even get to talk here. go play some games first, then tell me what you think of fw and the suggestions people make.

[Carl Vickers]

Lets, see, 305 games for you and 362 for me, yup, I dont play at all. Have you ever thought there may be a TZ difference, Ive seen you in a couple of FP matches, didnt see you get above 1k damage, but that was a while ago and you have have gotten better since then.

Getting a little cranky there, you got some sand in your undies?

BTW, we arent the ones on here whining like little babies that we cant play and are getting rekt all the time, that's you buddy which makes you the special snowflake