69 replies to this topic

[Kin3ticX]

Also, the videoclip which circulated from the podcast through the community that cut Russ off out of context after "cheapskate" is one example of how fake news works.

Edited by Kin3ticX, 11 March 2017 - 08:09 PM.

[Deathlike]

I'm pretty sure the refund will double my C-bill increase (probably reach 200m under 1 billion C-bills).

Yet, I feel spacepoor. Thanks Paulconomy.

[Kin3ticX]

Deathlike, on 11 March 2017 - 08:18 PM, said:

I'm pretty sure the refund will double my C-bill increase (probably reach 200m under 1 billion C-bills).

Yet, I feel spacepoor. Thanks Paulconomy.

I am going to spend a week smashing tile buttons. I wont rest until all my pokemechs are evolved and at least level 91. Every time I run out of XP I am going to tweet PGI my entire payload of Sodium Chloride

Edited by Kin3ticX, 11 March 2017 - 08:27 PM.

[Bandilly]

FupDup, on 11 March 2017 - 03:28 PM, said:

The skill tree layout is nowhere near perfect yet. It's still an overly complicated spiderweb mess with a large number of "forced" skills you have to take to unlock the skills you actually want.

You get a heck of a lot more unlocks than there are useful nodes to unlock, gotta spend them on something. Try the system before complaining about it. PTR should have weeded out the biggest issues, now it's about fine tuning it if it needs it.

[B L O O D W I T C H]

OldOrgandonor, on 11 March 2017 - 03:34 PM, said:

You take a new player (yeah, right, like there are any), he's goes to buy his first mech, he's got to buy the mech, then he has to upgrade the chassis, engine, double heat sinks, change out weapons, buy ammo, add armor, and NOW he has to pay Cbills for his skill grinding. And that's per mech he (or she) buys. How many mechs do you think that new player is going to buy? And at what rate of purchase do you think that will happen in?

That's where i disagree. The new system will be a lot more newbe friendly. At least newbs don't have to clog up 2 addition mechbays just to unlock skills.
They're not forced to have 3 mechs of the same chassi anymore and can have 4 independent mechs skilled out.

The old system where you had to either stick with mechs just to skill others, or worse, buy mechs just to level them and then sell them for a heavy loss sucked balls especially for new players who only have 4 bays.

[Marius Evander]

Hey kin3ticx, so your going to have XP blockages like me,

Have you calculated Cbills gained after taking away SP tree expenses ?

Edited by Cadoazreal, 12 March 2017 - 02:41 AM.

[Unnatural Growth]

Toha Heavy Industries, on 12 March 2017 - 12:54 AM, said:

That's where i disagree. The new system will be a lot more newbe friendly. At least newbs don't have to clog up 2 addition mechbays just to unlock skills.
They're not forced to have 3 mechs of the same chassi anymore and can have 4 independent mechs skilled out.

The old system where you had to either stick with mechs just to skill others, or worse, buy mechs just to level them and then sell them for a heavy loss sucked balls especially for new players who only have 4 bays.

I agree that the "Rule of 3" was a horrible idea from day 1.

But there's no logical way in hell you can tell me with a straight face that the only options available to the developer of this game or us the players was either:

1. Rule of 3

2. New skill tree with cbill taxes.

It's not "One or the Other" here.

The first system was awful. Why does the replacement system have to be awful too?

[Tier5 Kerensky]

I think I get only 400 million, estimated from total earned reducted by mechs bought. Inventory doesn't list used modules, only free ones.

[Kin3ticX]

Cadoazreal, on 12 March 2017 - 02:41 AM, said:

Hey kin3ticx, so your going to have XP blockages like me,

Have you calculated Cbills gained after taking away SP tree expenses ?

I dunno man I have some mechs with over a million XP. Worst case scenario I will use them as a Salt Apocalypse oasis while everyone else goes full trigger. It all goes to legacy XP but I wasnt to clear if that goes to any mech I want or just the same kind of mech. Im not too worried.

[FupDup]

Bandilly, on 11 March 2017 - 08:29 PM, said:

You get a heck of a lot more unlocks than there are useful nodes to unlock, gotta spend them on something. Try the system before complaining about it. PTR should have weeded out the biggest issues, now it's about fine tuning it if it needs it.

What makes you think I didn't try it? Because I sure as hell tried it.

I hate it when people assume that criticizing something means you didn't try it. "Oh, if you think there's anything wrong at all that means you didn't experience it, because everybody who did try it don't have any complaints at all!"

The whole system could easily be leaned down by trimming the excess fat (aka useless placeholder skills), following a "linear" type of structure, and then reducing the total SP pool. Right now it's very bloated and overly complicated for no good reason.

[Kin3ticX]

FupDup, on 12 March 2017 - 11:12 AM, said:

What makes you think I didn't try it? Because I sure as hell tried it.

I hate it when people assume that criticizing something means you didn't try it. "Oh, if you think there's anything wrong at all that means you didn't experience it, because everybody who did try it don't have any complaints at all!"

The whole system could easily be leaned down by trimming the excess fat (aka useless placeholder skills), following a "linear" type of structure, and then reducing the total SP pool. Right now it's very bloated and overly complicated for no good reason.

This is my main criticism of the tree but them trying to stop us from min maxing and force tradeoffs puts SP inflation into the design. They need more refinement and some of those skills indeed need to be replaced or modified.

They can do that, but ultimately cooldown skills > target info skills so they have to give tradeoffs so you dont get everything.

[FupDup]

Kin3ticX, on 12 March 2017 - 02:48 PM, said:

This is my main criticism of the tree but them trying to stop us from min maxing and force tradeoffs puts SP inflation into the design. They need more refinement and some of those skills indeed need to be replaced or modified.

They can do that, but ultimately cooldown skills > target info skills so they have to give tradeoffs so you dont get everything.

Actually, the current cooldown skills are so low that I wouldn't even want them for their own merit, I'd only get them as pre-requisites for other (better) skills.

The "unequal skills" thing can, in most cases, be solved by balancing both the value per node and the total number of nodes you need to max it out. Something like Target Info should only take like 3 or so SP to max out, for example.

Ultimately, preventing min-max with Skill Tree 1.0 is simply impossible. The fact that we can customize our skills at all makes this the case. If they didn't want minmax they shouldn't have let us choose our skills (like the old system).

Trying to get rid of minmax in a game about customization is fruitless; a more productive goal would be to make several different paths of minmax be viable.

Edited by FupDup, 12 March 2017 - 02:55 PM.

[-Ramrod-]

I'll be in the Billionaire class too. I've got over 120 modules not in use and at least 100 more in use. Also I'll probably be a GXP millionaire. (Any mech xp you've converted to gxp is refunded as gxp right? And from what starting point?)

Edited by -Ramrod-, 12 March 2017 - 03:11 PM.

[Marius Evander]

Any Gxp you have from any source will stay as gxp (pilot skills becomes gxp),

Legacy mech XP is that variant only.
EG. All xp currently on any of your multiple TBR-Prime becomes grouped as legacy xp for all TBR-Prime (not other variants.)

[Clownwarlord]

Hmmm ... I wonder. I have a lot of xp saved up on my Atlas DDC and some other mechs. Wonder if I will get enough CBills to buy an extra of the same variant and split the hxp between the two if the saved up xp goes into hxp?

Wonder if how many mastered TBR primes I can put together ... ? That being if saved xp goes into hxp as well.

[Electroflameageddon]

Mixed feelings about this.

I will have close to 300,000,000 C-Bills and a god awful amount of LGXP. I sat down and figured it out once but I can't remember the exact amount. Somewhere in the neighborhood of 700,000.

I only play 6 or 7 mechs regularly out of the 58 in my Mechodex and they have well over 300,000 Mech XP each. I have some in the 'bay that I have never played, some due to really bad hit boxes (I'm looking at you, Wolfhound) and others because I just can't find the groove in them. I have at least 1 of every variant that I'm going to sell once the rule of three is eliminated.

I will be able to master at least 25 of the mechs in my Mechodex. This is actually more than I have actually mastered with the current system.

I suppose it will be fun to play the Loyalty and Freebie Mechs that I haven't bothered with since I didn't want to buy two of the variants that I knew I would have problems playing them.

[Big Tin Man]

Still need to calc out my refund, probably close to the half billion club. I'm very excited to not play the awful spider and jenner variants to be able to finally level the only ones that matter. I'm also excited to feel like I can trim the fat out of mech variants that I just don't need floating around anymore now that we know for sure what the skill tree will look like (goodbye novas and hunchies)

[BattleBunny]

W A R K H A N, on 11 March 2017 - 06:34 AM, said:

Refund should bump me into the 2 billion club. Haven't worked out how much I'll be getting but all of my mechs are fully moduled. Got to catch Battlebunny!

You'll catch me fo sure, I only have 30 mechs or so moduled. the rest is just sitting there.

I am buying modules like crazy since we get them refunded. .... right?

Edited by BattleBunny, 14 March 2017 - 04:23 AM.

[Starbomber109]

Man, until the Cyclops release i didn't own a single module. I don't even really like modules.

[Bud Crue]

So...how about that refund?