77 replies to this topic

[Y E O N N E]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 07 April 2017 - 11:26 AM, said:

Terrain doesn't always really allow for that, but yeah, when domination is the mode it makes it more difficult to hold stronger positions and maintain control over the bubble.

Hmmm. Was there a phase where teams would try to let the other side take the bubble and then surround them with long range and keep the timer dead via pokes?

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Yeonne Greene, on 07 April 2017 - 11:32 AM, said:

Hmmm. Was there a phase where teams would try to let the other side take the bubble and then surround them with long range and keep the timer dead via pokes?

If there was, it was before the tourney started and people realized just ignoring the cap and brawl pushing it was the strongest option (or so it seems). Not that there aren't trading maps (looking at you Canyon), but a majority you seem to be able to just push through.

Edited by Quicksilver Kalasa, 07 April 2017 - 11:43 AM.

[Y E O N N E]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 07 April 2017 - 11:41 AM, said:

If there was, it was before the tourney started and people realized just ignoring the cap and brawl pushing it was the strongest option (or so it seems). Not that there aren't trading maps (looking at you Canyon), but a majority you seem to be able to just push through.

Sounds like the timer needs to be dramatically shorter to tighten the mode up. Wouldn't work in QP, but for competitive modes it would.

[B L O O D W I T C H]

Love how noone remembers that kintaros are still in the game.

MLX is trash.

Loyality BJ with SSRM2 quirks is also kinda lol.

[NextGame]

Vanguard319, on 06 April 2017 - 09:31 PM, said:

Let's see:

Shadowcat - Kind of disappointing, because it was a good mech in previous games. who the hell at PGI thought an all MG build was a good design? Thing really needs a couple more energy hardpoints.

you play sc differently from most other mechs, its a run around jumpy sniper, which its good at

[Mole]

Alright. I'll throw my list down. But I want to be clear right now that none of these 'mechs are unviable. I do well in all of them. But I am going to give you my least optimal performers.

Lights: Jenner IIC. I have played all the lights in the game extensively since the rescale. I'm a light jockey. The Jenner IIC used to be an amazing 'mech. Meta even. But since the rescale its already large CT hitbox got even larger and the knife fighting it used to excell at with SRMs and SPLs will now see you one-shot in short order before you have a chance to do anything with it. This has relegated the 'mech to a longer range role which is does not perform all that well due to not having enough tonnage to run longer ranged weaponry while also remaining heat efficient. It still works, but it is by far my most difficult ride in this weight class.

Mediums: Viper. Don't get me wrong, I love my Viper. Just so happens that all my other Mediums are better. The Viper is in a tough spot. It's more of a light than a Medium. With max armor it gets a measly 8.5 tons of pod space for weapons and heat sinks. This leaves it with the size of a medium but the firepower of a light. I run mine with 6 ERSL and 1 SRM6+ART. It's fun and I get some really good kills in it but it is hot and is by far the most challenging ride that I own in the Medium weight class.

Heavies: Dragon. I run the old, once meta dual AC/5 Dragon. All of my firepower is located in one huge, easy to hit arm. The thing is not viable with a STD engine and its armor feels weak on all components. Its one saving grace, the AC/5 fire rate quirk that it used to have that made it meta in the first place has since been nerfed into oblivion, leaving it a fragile 'mech that requires an enormous amount of facetime to deal serious damage. It works, but it is certainly the least impressive thing in my hangar for this weight class.

Assaults: Victor. The 'mech is simply not viable without an XL and its side torsos are huge. This once meta 'mech's saving grace, its ability to effectively utilize its jumpjets, is no longer present in this game. The Victor, without its ability to poptart, is fragile and has underwhelming firepower. In recent times in my Victor I was having such a hard time finding something that worked I created a build that I thought would never work out of sheer "I haven't tried this yet" desperation and actually found that 3 AC/2s made a fairly decent DPS chainsaw if I managed to position myself in a place where I could get some serious facetime without taking a lot of return fire. Much like the Dragon, it works, but is by far the least impressive thing in this weight class.

[Alex Morgaine]

Toha Heavy Industries, on 07 April 2017 - 12:16 PM, said:

Loyality BJ with SSRM2 quirks is also kinda lol.

Lrm5s work decently with it though :3

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Yeonne Greene, on 07 April 2017 - 11:51 AM, said:

Sounds like the timer needs to be dramatically shorter to tighten the mode up. Wouldn't work in QP, but for competitive modes it would.

That would help brawlers more. The problem is more about location and size of the bubble.

Edited by Quicksilver Kalasa, 07 April 2017 - 02:16 PM.

[Y E O N N E]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 07 April 2017 - 02:15 PM, said:

That would help brawlers more. The problem is more about location and size of the bubble.

Potentially. If you go all-in on the brawl, you risk getting stalled by snipers.

Location and size, not sure how that would help. More open favors power position, closed favors brawlers.

[Deathlike]

Zergling, on 06 April 2017 - 09:41 PM, said:

Well, they aren't all 'dog crap', but here's the worst of each weight class and faction:

Urbanmech / Mist Lynx
Vindicator / Ice Ferret
Dragon / Orion IIC
Victor / Gargoyle

Ice Ferret is stronger than people give it credit for.. if anything it's very underrated (can spam mid-range with 5 CERMED, brawl, do what fat Lights do and be inherently tanky).

Mr. Gargles is the best 80-tonner in its class. I wish I were kidding.

Mcgral18, on 07 April 2017 - 09:13 AM, said:

I personally can't stand the SadCat
Maybe a playstyle thing...but at least the Fridge can take SPLs and lots of heatsinks, with the durability of a 55 tonner



Unlike the SadCat, The Fridge didn't lose his structure quirks

The Sadcat probably is the worst Clan Medium... and the best it can do is be kinda annoying vs Lights and be the best hiding mech with ECM and still be mostly useless most of the time. Those structure quirk nerfs on the Sadcat made it a real Scat.

I'm just amused that the premise of this thread's existence.... which is probably why bad players in Clan mechs are trying waaaaay too hard to keep that power differential.

Edited by Deathlike, 07 April 2017 - 02:35 PM.

[Skanderborg]

My opinion is the game is in a pretty sorry state with mech balance.

The only IS mechs worth taking over clans are the battle master and mauler. The rest are really wanting. All IS heavies are a shadow compared to clan heavies , IS mediums are a joke , IS lights are awful since the size increase.

Then you can compare the clan mechs , which some of them such as the Orion or Warhawk people call "bad" but they are still miles ahead of any IS mech.

Then on the clan totem poll most clan mechs are lack luster compared to the Night Gyr , Kodiak , ebon jaguar, Hunchback IIC , and arctic cheetah. The Kodiak has completely replaced the Dire Wolf on a competitive view.

This is unfortunate for me because ALL of my favorite mechs are Inner Sphere. The only IS mech I can pilot in confidence is my atlas because it hides behind a mountain of quirks and has the tonnage to actually make decent fire power.

For now i'm just waiting for the HBS battle tech game so i can play through the succession wars which is what i enjoy the most.

But to answer the OP , the Vindicator is really bad outside of pop tarting , the commando has no guns , the victor's weapons placement guarantee that you hit environment with every shot. That wolverine with MASC is probably the worst mech in the game other than the spider with 2 energy hard points.

Edited by Skanderborg, 07 April 2017 - 02:43 PM.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Yeonne Greene, on 07 April 2017 - 02:27 PM, said:

Potentially. If you go all-in on the brawl, you risk getting stalled by snipers.

Location and size, not sure how that would help. More open favors power position, closed favors brawlers.

Location can help because a lot of areas offer significant cover (tourmaline for example) where as size just means you don't have it is easier to pull away and still be within the circle (or hide a light in the circle while the brawlers push through the circle to get to you). If the brawling team is good, they are hesitating so getting stalled is only an issue for lesser teams generally.

Deathlike, on 07 April 2017 - 02:34 PM, said:

Mr. Gargles is the best 80-tonner in its class. I wish I were kidding.

If only people were watching the Star League tourney, they would understand how intimidating Mr Gargles can be.

[Y E O N N E]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 07 April 2017 - 02:49 PM, said:

Location can help because a lot of areas offer significant cover (tourmaline for example) where as size just means you don't have it is easier to pull away and still be within the circle (or hide a light in the circle while the brawlers push through the circle to get to you). If the brawling team is good, they are hesitating so getting stalled is only an issue for lesser teams generally.

None of that sounds like it would do anything except make brawl even stronger.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Yeonne Greene, on 07 April 2017 - 02:54 PM, said:

None of that sounds like it would do anything except make brawl even stronger.

Being able to stay at a further distance because the bubble is larger is a pretty important facet. Allows more of the map to be used and ideally will force there to be longer distances a brawl team would have to travel to reach you. On paper it sounds like it should help but honestly I don't know if it would fix anything. Shorter timers wouldn't help though since generally that is in the path of the brawl team (meaning they can control it a lot easier than a ranged team can).

[Y E O N N E]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 07 April 2017 - 03:04 PM, said:

Being able to stay at a further distance because the bubble is larger is a pretty important facet. Allows more of the map to be used and ideally will force there to be longer distances a brawl team would have to travel to reach you. On paper it sounds like it should help but honestly I don't know if it would fix anything. Shorter timers wouldn't help though since generally that is in the path of the brawl team (meaning they can control it a lot easier than a ranged team can).

It just turns it into more skirmish than it already is.

Furthermore, you don't have to be in the bubble to maintain control. If the map has prolific cover then, yes, you would want a larger bubble. If it's more open, you want a smaller bubble because you can keep fire on the people inside that bubble.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Yeonne Greene, on 07 April 2017 - 03:07 PM, said:

If it's more open, you want a smaller bubble because you can keep fire on the people inside that bubble.

Very few of the bubbles are that open (surrounding area also matters as well), Canyon and Frozen are probably the most open.

[Y E O N N E]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 07 April 2017 - 03:17 PM, said:

Very few of the bubbles are that open (surrounding area also matters as well), Canyon and Frozen are probably the most open.

Grim is also pretty open.

But it's not about where they are now, we're talking hypothetical changes.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Yeonne Greene, on 07 April 2017 - 04:00 PM, said:

Grim is also pretty open.

The bubble may be, but the surrounding area is not, and that's very important (similar to why Polar is not as friendly to long range as something like Frozen).

Edited by Quicksilver Kalasa, 07 April 2017 - 04:07 PM.

[Dee Eight]

Snazzy Dragon, on 06 April 2017 - 07:26 PM, said:

Kit fox without purifier omni pods. Pay to balance!

Doesn't need those pods. I mastered leveled the KFX-D with 2xASRM4 and 2xSSRM4 in only 57 matches and 6h18m of play with a 1.07 W/L. My purifier is a 1.08 W/L over 50 matches.

[InspectorG]

Skanderborg, on 07 April 2017 - 02:40 PM, said:

But to answer the OP , the Vindicator is really bad outside of pop tarting , the commando has no guns , the victor's weapons placement guarantee that you hit environment with every shot. That wolverine with MASC is probably the worst mech in the game other than the spider with 2 energy hard points.

Ive heard the Dire Ultraviolent(8uac2) out performs the KDK-3 on certain maps and brawls.

Warhawk can be totally gimped by terrain but if in the relative open, at range, is strong.

HBK-SP, Cicadas, Cents seem decent for what they do.

Commando 1B and TDK are quite stronger than people think, particularly in Solo. The rest are junk.

I dont even see jenner oxides anymore.

FS is pretty gimp.

The 2E 2B Locust is trashy.