38 replies to this topic

[Defensores 6]

I absolutely love the skill tree. I think it represents a real effort at balancing the game - not really. My IS Mechs are still showing basic quirks and my Clan Mechs are still showing basic nerfs. Everything is status-quo, what was the point of this again?

Additionally, I am somewhat confused by the refund ledger; specifically the module breakdown GSP versus CB and the amount refunded. According to the ledger, I've spent 1.063 Billion C-Bills in modules and my refund is only 1.26 Million, about 1%. I'm not complaining, I'm just saying...that's kind of paltry. Why not refund me the entire amount? Don't be the Madoff of MMO's. At a minimum, I would like to know why there is two Module Breakdowns for GSP and CB - what accounting rule did you use to come up with this? It still seems that you are penalizing a large group of your most loyal players with this effort; this is the reason that I initially could not support the new skill tree. I still don't know / understand why it is even necessary; other than to keep up with other MMO games.

Like I said, great job on the skill tree - I really like it. However, I don't think it makes a difference in the game play and the refunds offered in the change are laughable for guys like me that have spent the last 4 years building a really nice Mechlab.

So, in an effort protect myself from further abuses, I pledge to never buy another thing from PGI unless you guys rectify or at least explain the reason you've chosen to steal my time and money invested in this game with not so much as a thank you, explanation, or swift kick in the ***.

Defensores 6 - CBGI

[ForceUser]

Any modules bought before the.. 3rd of December? gets refunded as GSP (not GXP) any modules bought after that is refunded as cbills.

In both cases you get refunded for the full cbill value that you spent on modules.

[Defensores 6]

ForceUser,

You are incorrect. Maybe that is what PGI said, but according to my account it isn't accurate. Let me clarify, by module - I mean Mech Modules like "radar deprevation", not pilot skills. Take a look at your account in the PTS and you may understand better what I mean.

[Michaelson Snow]

Many times NO!! i paid in cbills...cbills is what needs to be refunded.

I do not care for why, what, future or now. in the past i paid with cbills....cbills need to be what i get back. i may not choose to use that cbill the same, i may spend it differently...new choices...same cbills. do not presume to make my choices for me, you (PGI) did not make my first choices, do not presume to make these...

do not try to explain how it is the same(equal).... to have to explain, means it is not the same(equal)

Now for the flames...........

[ForceUser]

Defensores 6, on 25 April 2017 - 09:50 PM, said:

ForceUser,

You are incorrect. Maybe that is what PGI said, but according to my account it isn't accurate. Let me clarify, by module - I mean Mech Modules like "radar deprevation", not pilot skills. Take a look at your account in the PTS and you may understand better what I mean.

They amended the date. The current PTS does not reflect this but future PTS / Live patch will.

[Kinski Orlawisch]

GSP are much more worthy than C Bills.

[Wibbledtodeath]

GSP are more worthy than CBILLS- until you have more SP than you know what to do with because you paid for lots of modules.

I understand the reasoning behind the GSP conversion, but it leaves so many people with oodles of skill unlocks and no cash to buy mechs to unlock their skills. Reducing the grind to CBILL grinding for the next mech, rather than playing a new one and levelling it up. The latter is the more fun way to grind.

I would suggest a partial refund in CBILLS (maybe 1/3-1/2.) and a reduction in GSP (by 1/3-1/2). It is a hard pill to swallow to get more refund from consumables than from the HUGE outlay of modules some of us have paid. A partial refund would ease the pain somewhat. The other alternative is a formula- if SP= cost of mastering all mechbays in current possession, then excess refund over this is in CBill only. That way we get full value for our module expenditure.

[Kerrisis]

So how many GSP will a new KGC-000 or Nova Prime cost me?

The problem is GSP is limited purely to levelling mechs. At the moment, if I wanted, I could sell some of the ~600mil in Modules I have to buy a mech or equipment. At a massive loss, sure, but it's doable. Once PGI go live with the new skill system, I no longer have that flexibility.

[ForceUser]

Quote

I would suggest a partial refund in CBILLS (maybe 1/3-1/2.) and a reduction in GSP (by 1/3-1/2). It is a hard pill to swallow to get more refund from consumables than from the HUGE outlay of modules some of us have paid. A partial refund would ease the pain somewhat. The other alternative is a formula- if SP= cost of mastering all mechbays in current possession, then excess refund over this is in CBill only. That way we get full value for our module expenditure.

There is nothing stpping you from selling your modules for a 1/2 refund right now.

[Naaaaak]

Michaelson Snow, on 25 April 2017 - 11:16 PM, said:

Many times NO!! i paid in cbills...cbills is what needs to be refunded.

I do not care for why, what, future or now. in the past i paid with cbills....cbills need to be what i get back. i may not choose to use that cbill the same, i may spend it differently...new choices...same cbills. do not presume to make my choices for me, you (PGI) did not make my first choices, do not presume to make these...

do not try to explain how it is the same(equal).... to have to explain, means it is not the same(equal)

Now for the flames...........

Exactly this. Under the new refund idea, I'm out 500+ million C-Bills that I spent on modules, but suddenly I get these dumb "unlock tokens" / GSP. More than I'd ever want or need.

I earned and paid C-Bills for something that no longer exists. Return C-Bills to me.

Cut-off dates do not matter.

Edited by Naaaaak, 26 April 2017 - 02:50 AM.

[Ockish]

ForceUser, on 26 April 2017 - 01:33 AM, said:

There is nothing stpping you from selling your modules for a 1/2 refund right now.

Yes he can sell his modules now if he wants to.
However that's not his point, he has that option at any time, and can choose not to take it if he wants, or to sell later when he needs to. How much is that option worth to him? You don't get to say.

Even worse in my mind modules and skill points are not an even trade, I can use my modules on ten different mech's in a day. Can you move these skill points from one mech to another between matches while your friend's are waiting? We paid for something and it's going to be taken away without equal (or greater) compensation.

Would it be such a tragedy if someone were given back what they paid, can you put a dollar value on me felling like you have treated me fairly.

[Kroete]

Kinski Orlawisch, on 25 April 2017 - 11:41 PM, said:

GSP are much more worthy than C Bills.

My mechs are mastered (and have at least 3 modules),
most have over 200.000 xp sitting,
i have lots of gxp and my mechs will get 91 skillpoints because their are mastered.

Please tell me how much GSP are worth when i cant buy anything from it and dont need to level anything with them?

Maybe we can do an exchange?
Ill give you 20 Bison-Dollars for each 80 real dollars you give me!
Isnt that a great deal?
Comeone, normaly you will get only 10 of that great Bison-Dollars for that!
Deal?

Edited by Kroete, 26 April 2017 - 04:09 AM.

[Peiper]

Yup. I paid C-Bills for my modules, that's what I want, expect, and deserve to get back. I don't mind grinding up skills. Leveling, like PGI says, is fun. But grinding is not.

[Shadowspawn42]

Kinski Orlawisch, on 25 April 2017 - 11:41 PM, said:

GSP are much more worthy than C Bills.

Not to me. The GSP are totally worthless to me. The C-Bills should be refunded in full because modules will no longer be part of the game. If they dont announce a change in this direction I will have to sell off all my modules before May 16th to make sure I dont get screwed over by PGI any more than I already am.

FULL C-Bill REFUND FOR MODULES PLEASE!

[shameless]

I bought them with cbills, I want my full refund in cbills. my mechs are mastered, so they already have 91 HSP on them.

[L1f3H4ck]

A full cbill refund was on the table in March, but the cheapskates had a hissy fit and it got shouted down. Take your admittedly valid complaints to those people, you can probably find them on reddit.

I'm not even trying to defend the current solution, I'm just tired of waiting, tired of PGI caving to anyone whining loud enough, tired of module swapping, tired of grinding variants I don't even like... The list goes on. Let's just get it over with already.

[S9ectre86]

Frechdachs, on 26 April 2017 - 03:59 PM, said:

A full cbill refund was on the table in March, but the cheapskates had a hissy fit and it got shouted down. Take your admittedly valid complaints to those people, you can probably find them on reddit.

I'm not even trying to defend the current solution, I'm just tired of waiting, tired of PGI caving to anyone whining loud enough, tired of module swapping, tired of grinding variants I don't even like... The list goes on. Let's just get it over with already.

True that...just give me the GSPs and get this over and done with.

Best thing about the new structure of the refunds for me is that it removes the headache of mastering mechs for a long time to come, letting me just focus on playing for fun rather than to grind XP. When I have more fun, I play more, the more I play, the more c-bills I earn.

[slide]

Most of you aren't looking at the big picture. I think the GSP refund is a great idea when looked at in perspective, which is something a lot of you seem to have lost. For the record I will come out of this with more GSP than I will ever need (273+ mechs worth).

Lets look at things now.
1. Buy a mech. 3-20m Cbills
2. Put what ever weapons/tech you like on it (cost 0-10m depending on choice). This will be the same no matter what
3. Grind out around 70k Xp (+module unlocks if you don't have them)
4. Buy modules 12-25m Cbills depending on what you mount

Total Cost, min 12+tech to 45+tech

As an example buy a Locust for around 3m, Engine/weapons/endo etc 5m, modules (radar, seismic, weapons) 16m, Total 24m

New system
1. Buy mech
2. Add tech/weapons to choice
3. Grind XP
4. Add nodes to choice Max 4 million Cbills

Max Cost Mech+Tech + 4 million Cbills

Using the Locust from before around 3m, Engine/weapons/endo etc 5m, levelled with nodes of choice 4m, Total 12m

With GSP
1. Buy mech
2. Add Tech

So Locust+Tech= 8m Cbills.

So the reality is you are going to need only a 1/3 to 1/2 the Cbills you needed before to do the same thing. Considering that the cost is mostly the mech and anything you put on it, is a constant through the whole process I fail to see why so many people are upset about the refund change.

Don't forget that PGI are also giving you 800 XP free for every GSP you get. For a lot of people that is a real and worth while bonus too.

The fact is for every 91 GSP you get you are saving 4m Cbills and getting a free mastered mechs worth of XP. That is a great deal. In most cases that 4m Cbills will cover the cost of an engine, weapons, endo and what ever else you want.

Without doubt modules were the biggest CBill sink in this game, With them gone everybody is going to be better off.

[Oddmund]

I want my ******* cbills back!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Been playing this game a long time bought a lot of things i now see i should not have with real money. MWO will be a total waste of time if this stays the way it is. if it stays like this then **** spending anything on mechwarrior 5 PGI can go eat a ****.

Edited by dankith, 26 April 2017 - 07:05 PM.

[Mike Barnes]

Just gimme the GSP, C-bills are cake to make. GSP gets me into new 'mechs and shooting people faster. The 'mechs I have paid for from civil war and resistance heroes will be mastered instantly and so will anything else I buy for a while. The instant mastery will make the new mechs more competitive out of the gate, and thus I will make more c-bills off of them. I'll get my money back after a while. Now I don't have hundereds of millions of c-bills tied up into modules or even hundreds of mechs at my disposal so maybe your problems are different than mine, for me though the system is really nice. Hey if it comes to it, you can just unlock all 242 skills on your most played 'mechs and just derp around with weird configs, where a lot of us will really have to grind that out on anything but a few variants.