60 replies to this topic

[InvictusLee]

Templar Dane, on 19 May 2017 - 03:45 PM, said:

So any time someone kills you, it must have been cheating and you report?

I dont know about anyone else, but unless its an amazingly lucky aimed head-shot from 1000m away (which HAS happened, some gauss users have amazing aim), then yeah, I would consider it cheating.

[Templar Dane]

November11th, on 19 May 2017 - 03:50 PM, said:

I dont know about anyone else, but unless its an amazingly lucky aimed head-shot from 1000m away (which HAS happened, some gauss users have amazing aim), then yeah, I would consider it cheating.

OP was killed by SRMs and the dude told him to report the guy that killed him for cheating.

[InvictusLee]

Templar Dane, on 19 May 2017 - 03:53 PM, said:

OP was killed by SRMs and the dude told him to report the guy that killed him for cheating.

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL....

Okay.

Nvm man. That was probably me with the SRMS. LOL. All I run are LPL's or Splat builds xD

[Alexander of Macedon]

Colonel Presumptuous, on 19 May 2017 - 02:15 PM, said:

Yeah NEVER stick ammo in your CT or head... EVER one bad crit and boom you go pop. Legs are fine, since something like a heavy or assualt people dont usually go for the legs.

Disagreed very sharply. The ammo feed order drains the ammo from your head first and CT second. If you're getting cored out before you can drain 1-3t of ammo, you're (as others said) not shooting enough 'mechs. By the time you get cored out you should be down to your leg-stored ammo (or ST/arm ammo, if in clam 'mechs).

That, and a lot of 'mechs which like to pack ammo into the legs (like Jagers) are also notorious for stripping leg armor to fit high-weight ballistic builds.

[Grus]

I will say if you have a well praised team and you have a sneaky light or med get behind You, I tend to hold fire till I see you take damage then fire into your rear ct at the same time.

[Big MO]

Grus, on 22 May 2017 - 09:34 AM, said:

I will say if you have a well praised team and you have a sneaky light or med get behind You, I tend to hold fire till I see you take damage then fire into your rear ct at the same time.

I think this combined with an ammo explosion is probably what happened to you. When playing a light, it is always advantageous to try to hit a target in sync with a larger ally. Most people don't even realize they got hit by multiple enemies, so never turn to look for the light.

[meteorol]

sgtarkeus, on 19 May 2017 - 09:15 AM, said:

I had at least two matches last night where I was fairly fresh - maybe the armor on my arms and possibly a ST being yellow but the CT was undamaged, turn a corner and a rushing linebacker or catapult hit me with something, I'm guessing SRMs (they're the last thing on the list of damage by what screen), and I'm dead. CT only thing damaged really. Each death like this has like 4-6 weapons showing on the death/damage screen.

I've never seen this before, has any one else? My Orion ON1-K has 448/462 Armor with points in the survival tree, and my Cyclopes CP-11-A has 544/558 Armor also with points in the survival tree.

There seems to be an issue with the paperdoll not updating correctly. I felt like something was not right about the paperdolls ever since the patch, and others seem to have made the same experience.

https://www.reddit.c.../paperdoll_psa/

Could be possible that your CT wasn't really undamaged, but the paperdoll didn't show the correct damage values, so you actually had a lot less remaining CT hitpoints which lead to a oneshot.

Edited by meteorol, 22 May 2017 - 12:02 PM.

[Widowmaker1981]

Colonel Presumptuous, on 19 May 2017 - 02:15 PM, said:

Yeah NEVER stick ammo in your CT or head... EVER one bad crit and boom you go pop. Legs are fine, since something like a heavy or assualt people dont usually go for the legs.

Both are fine. CT because its used first, and if you're open CT before using the first two tons of ammo then its a bad game anyway, head because its used last, so when you have weapons in each side of the mech it doesnt matter which side you lose toward the end of the game, you'll stil have ammo left.

Head is perfectly safe, heads rarely get hit anyway, and when they do they have very little internal HP, so the chances of a crit on the ammo are very, very low (you need to get 10 dmg worth of crits on a 1 in 6 chance to hit the item before doing 15 structure dmg) and its even less likely now with PPCs and Gauss no longer being able to one hit the ammo's 10 HP.. and even if by some miracle it DOES crit the ammo out? 10% of the time it explodes, 90% of the time it is fine. Head stored ammo killing you is a 1 in 1000 games occurrence or less.

Edited by Widowmaker1981, 22 May 2017 - 12:36 PM.

[Aggravated Assault Mech]

Bishop Steiner, on 19 May 2017 - 12:15 PM, said:

That's not from the Survival Tree, that's Survival Tree stacked on top of massive Quirks. The actual amount from the Tree is much smaller.

What? 25 to 35 pts of extra hp is right on the money for most heavy and assault mechs assuming you're taking 8 rear armor...

Even an unquirked 75t mech (like the Timberwolf) is getting 13.8 pts of structure and 12.75 pts of frontal (assuming 8 rear) armor from the full tree. An unquirked 100t mech (Kodiak) is getting 15.5 pts of structure and 11.6 pts of frontal.

Superquirked mechs like the Zeus gains 23.2 pts of structure and 12.88 pts of armor. AS7-S gains. 24.25 pts of structure and 11.6 pts of armor. BLR-2C is gaining 23.24 pts of structure and 13 pts of armor. Roughnecks all gain 19.84 pts of structure and 14.62 pts of armor. This is to the CT alone.

Over the average match a heavy or assault mech with full durability skills is probably taking 100+ more damage as it washes over the arms and left and right torsos. It's not "an extra medium laser" worth of damage.

Edited by Aggravated Assault Mech, 22 May 2017 - 01:05 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Colonel Presumptuous, on 19 May 2017 - 02:15 PM, said:

Yeah NEVER stick ammo in your CT or head... EVER one bad crit and boom you go pop. Legs are fine, since something like a heavy or assualt people dont usually go for the legs.

Head is about the safest place you can stick it. Almost never hit, and if it is, you are far more likely to lose the whole head long before you have an ammo explosion.

CT ammo goes first and again, almost never goes boom, regardless. Have had less than a dozen deaths by ammo explosions in over 22000 matches.

Methinks thou dost worry too much.

[Angel of Annihilation]

Vonbach, on 19 May 2017 - 09:18 AM, said:

I got a side torso cored one shot from a gauss rifle. Green to orange and a srm gone no other damage taken in the match first shot I'd taken. The survival tree is basically useless. It gives you something like one medium lasers worth of damage.

Its worthless until that extra 5 points of structure is the difference between you being alive and killing stuff or dead and spectating.

[Aggravated Assault Mech]

At no point are you ever gaining only five points. Even an unquirked 20t mech is gaining just over 9pts of total frontal CT health and 7pts of ST with full Armor Hardening and Skeletal Density.

I made a spreadsheet for anyone interested in how much they're actually gaining from full armor and structure skills. Just input the value of the quirks for the chassis in question in the appropriate row.

https://docs.google....cvxs/edit#gid=0

Edited by Aggravated Assault Mech, 22 May 2017 - 03:22 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Viktor Drake, on 22 May 2017 - 03:09 PM, said:

Its worthless until that extra 5 points of structure is the difference between you being alive and killing stuff or dead and spectating.

IT's actually a quite useful tree, if used intelligently, on mechs it really compliments. HBK-4SP and UM-r60 mate well to it. Certain Atlases. Other mechs, it's really not worth it, because those Nodes make a much more important difference elsewhere (like my LRM MDD or CPLT-C1). Which means it's actually pretty close to where it needs to be.

If it's "too good" it becomes mandatory upgrade for everyone, it it's "not good enough" nobody uses it. The very fact that it's situationally quite useful, and absolutely not worth it in other situations? Is the mark of it being just about where it needs to be.

Survival. Jump Jets and Sensors should be very situational, and so far, I have found them to be exactly that, instead of "must haves". 3/4ish of Operations feel pretty mandatory, and most mechs probably need 1/3 or more to Firepower (mostly for heat gen, IMO), but almost nothing else feels across the board mandatory. Not even mobility (my CPLT-C1 has none opened up, and fulfills it's role fine. My Jester on the other hand, fills a different role, and does benefit from Mobility, though I am still undecided on Jump Jets)

Aggravated Assault Mech, on 22 May 2017 - 03:21 PM, said:

At no point are you ever gaining only five points. Even an unquirked 20t mech is gaining just over 9pts of total frontal CT health and 7pts of ST with full Armor Hardening and Skeletal Density.

I made a spreadsheet for anyone interested in how much they're actually gaining from full armor and structure skills. Just input the value of the quirks for the chassis in question in the appropriate row.

https://docs.google....cvxs/edit#gid=0

And for some mechs, it's still not worth the investment. Other mechs, it absolutely is. Working as intended.

[Aggravated Assault Mech]

Bishop Steiner, on 22 May 2017 - 03:24 PM, said:

And for some mechs, it's still not worth the investment. Other mechs, it absolutely is. Working as intended.

I agree, however I think that many players are undervaluing it based upon a basic misunderstanding of how much health it actually amounts to.

[Revis Volek]

Templar Dane, on 19 May 2017 - 03:45 PM, said:

So any time someone kills you, it must have been cheating and you report?

He does actually...


IF you are better then him you cheat more then likely(which means 1/6th the pop cheats in his eyes i think). Hes not even kidding or is some deep undercover troll spec ops mofo i cannot tell either way

Edited by Revis Volek, 22 May 2017 - 03:57 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Aggravated Assault Mech, on 22 May 2017 - 03:36 PM, said:

I agree, however I think that many players are undervaluing it based upon a basic misunderstanding of how much health it actually amounts to.

I would tend to agree with this, or people are just wanting it to be broke as heck to make Super Gundams. Andi Nagasi has a poll up on it which frankly does not thing to restore my faith in the intelligence (or at least lack of agenda) for humanity.

IMO it's just about spot on where it sits, ATM.

[JadePanther]

Jay Leon Hart, on 19 May 2017 - 11:30 AM, said:

It gets used first, doesn't it? If you're dying from a CT ammo explosion, you were caught out of position with no time to fire a decent amount of rounds. Unless CT ammo isn't used first, but I'm sure it is.

Leg ammo is another beast - fine if you don't strip them, but if you have ammo in your legs *and* armour strip them? Well, you're gonna have a bad time!

last i remember CT ammo gets spend first.

[sgtarkeus]

meteorol, on 22 May 2017 - 11:51 AM, said:

There seems to be an issue with the paperdoll not updating correctly. I felt like something was not right about the paperdolls ever since the patch, and others seem to have made the same experience.

https://www.reddit.c.../paperdoll_psa/

Could be possible that your CT wasn't really undamaged, but the paperdoll didn't show the correct damage values, so you actually had a lot less remaining CT hitpoints which lead to a oneshot.

I think this might be the problem. Last time I was playing was Saturday night/Sunday morning and I took a hit to my RT, and lost the whole ST. Strange thing was my RA was still on the paper doll, and I still had both MPLs. Very strange. It looks like the issue has been submitted according to the reddit post comments.

[PhoenixFire55]

sgtarkeus, on 19 May 2017 - 09:15 AM, said:

Each death like this has like 4-6 weapons showing on the death/damage screen.

When its 4-6 weapons showing on the death screen it means that its 3-4 mechs shooting you. And when its 3-4 mechs shooting you when you "turn a corner" in an assault you will be instagibbed.

[Devils Advocate]

I've had my Kodiak be two-shotted from the front from what was either two alphas or shots that didn't visually register from my end around four times in about twelve games. I think it's just the meta or something.