439 replies to this topic

[MustrumRidcully]

W E N D I G O, on 17 June 2017 - 08:41 AM, said:

Because 10 vs 12 would have killed all fun? The tabletop values for weaponry still would have been inappropriate and would have been in need to be adjusted. Also, with only two additonal Mechs on IS side the tonnage for both teams could still be on equal/near equal level and wouldn't have to be an extreme difference. You are just twisting the whole idea to create a strawman argument to blanket justify yet another questionable balance attempt from PGI that overall turns out to be less impactful for IS tech.

Weirdly enough you don't seem to have a problem with asymmetric drop deck tonnage though - or are not mentioning it here - while the weapons are balanced directly against each other, same for all Mechs and all tech since this is PGI's approach to balance.

10 vs 12 means that the 10 guys have more powerful mechs and have more targets. The 12 IS players in the 12 vs 10 will constantly feel underpowered, because they know they are not worth a full Clan unit.

The drop deck balance tells you that one Clan Unit will be worth as much as an IS unit, but it will do it with less weight.


Of course, it would be even better if this nonsense imbalance in tech power would not exist in the first place, and the tech bases were just different.
Imagine IS players would have standard lasers, pulse lasers, standard ppcs,
LRMs, SRMs and Autocannons and MGs, while Clan players would have ER Lasers, Heavy Lasers, ER PPCs, MRMs, Streak SRMs, Gauss Rifles (of different sizes) and Flamers.

All on the same power level base, however (either all IS or all Clan equivalents of these weapons). The two sides would play differently and feel differently without one side clearly having OP stuff.

But Battletech's creators in their infinite wisdom didn't do it, and PGI didn't feel called upon to improve on that, either.

[Gannycus]

The spl nerf is too radical.

You collect data for 3 years from clan arrival and decide to massively nerf IS and clan spl now! After 1 months of skill tree! In a changed scenario where majority of builds in the battlefield goes for massive structure/armor buff, where flanking manouver become more and more hard to do cause the overall maneuverability/speed/sensor reduction and the massive use of lrms! You nerfed the weapons harder to use at the moment. This seem really really really stupid to me.

I did expect some kind of nerf but not on of this entity!

[Davy J0nes]

Please look over the trebuchet quirks badly need CT quirk.

The treb has always been overshadowed or forgotten

- We were told it was going to get rescaled ( even mentioned over twitter that it was ) noting happens.

- new skilltree system the mech is suffering badly compared to all other mechs out there

- Cuz of its size the treb is as tall as a atlas and as wide as a banshee.

If the treb cant be looked again for a rescaled can its armor quirks please be looked at again currently no etc armor on the CT please PGI give the mech a look again.

[Rho Treska]

Prosperity Park, on 17 June 2017 - 08:22 AM, said:

Clan players who think like this are very greedy, selfish, and toxic...

You just described a typical Clan warrior as we know and love them from the lore. If one identifies himself with any faction, I'd argue that this person would also mirror those faction's heroes and personalities to a degree, regardless of Clan or IS.

I say, get 5vs8, 10vs12 or 15vs20 going in FW. The lore-hounds on both sides will just plain love it, tacticians will find it challenging.

[Michal R]

Ohhh yeaa, another great mess with the game...
Nice one...how to losse more players after skill maze....

Good job, Perfect Game Industry you are awesome....

[SPNKRGrenth]

Okay going back and looking at the changes again, the Clan ER small laser and small pulse laser nerfs are actually just fine. If, and it's a very big IF, they also remove ghost heat from Clan smalls and small pulses. They'll be nerfed directly now and tamed down, so the hidden nerf of ghost heat isn't needed nearly so much on them now, if at all.

Or heck if not that, at least separate their ghost heat to not be linked to Clan medium lasers, and increase the number needed for ghost heat to 9. And if the damage nerf is going to be kept so high, at least drop the heat generated down to 2.5 instead of 2.7. Like you can even see that Clan small pulses now just run crazy hot, because.

[MechaBattler]

The thing I find strange is that they nerfed mechs that weren't even mentioned previously. And some of them got weird quirks. Missile spread for the King Crab? Que?

[Meppoy]

RIP clan small pulses.

[Wolf Clearwater]

Two questions:

1. Where the hell is an actual color blind mode (because I STILL CAN'T SEE THE I.S. CROSSHAIRS)
2. Where is the Wasp already?

Edited by Wolf Clearwater, 17 June 2017 - 11:56 AM.

[Bulletsponge0]

InnerSphereNews, on 16 June 2017 - 06:08 PM, said:

<snip>

So, still nothing about updating the PSR system so tis actually based on skill and not simply on how many games you've played?

[HGAK47]

The energy balancing is questionable.... however I am willing to see it through and see what happens, there are much better informed people than me to debate this.

What I really want to talk about is - What on earth possesed you to remove the MX90`s ballistics quirks? You gave in return silly (in my mind) energy quirks on a dakka mech. I dont understand the logic behind it.

I honestly dont get your haphazard balancing. How can I pay money for new mechs when you change the very essence of other mechs so much?

Also the panther structure quirks to armour quirks is a very small token gesture hoped for more when I was looking through. Nothing for the Spider 5V? among others.

Edited by HGAK47, 17 June 2017 - 12:18 PM.

[Dee Eight]

There's a color blind reticle in the settings. Its been there over a year.

It would be nice if they at least de-grouped the clan small and medium scale lasers from all being together for ghost heat scaling as is the case with IS lasers (which have no heat scaling at all for small lasers and small pulse, and the mediums and medium pulses aren't a linked group to one another).

[Wattila]

Ayep, the cSPL was OP, but that nerf was still pretty rough. Hey, at least they also nerfed the IS SPL because the Locust and Partyback are too good . And yeah, could easily increase the cSPL GH cap a bit now.

Also, making pulses DPS weapons by nerfing their heat efficiency? Sure, you can increase the paper (burst) DPS, but real-world DPS is still determined by heat management. Medium pulse DPH actually went up for both IS and Clan, so they got something right at least.

[Wattila]

HGAK47, on 17 June 2017 - 12:05 PM, said:

What I really want to talk about is - What on earth possesed you to remove the MX90`s ballistics quirks? You gave in return silly (in my mind) energy quirks on a dakka mech. I dont understand the logic behind it.

The quirks seem to be an incentive to use the secondary hardpoints, so you get the best quirks on the least relevant hardpoints. Just look at what they did with the KGC quirks, I guess KGC-0000 will be the new Gauss/ERLL boat. Generally annoyed by PGI trying to outsmart the player base when it comes to quirks and skill tree.

[Dee Eight]

Bulletsponge0, on 17 June 2017 - 12:04 PM, said:

So, still nothing about updating the PSR system so tis actually based on skill and not simply on how many games you've played?

There's no way to do that though. How does a game measure skill exactly that's balanced and fair ? Players with higher end systems, lower ping #s, bigger monitors and faster twitch reactions are going to still out perform everyone else. If you tried to use say...the KDR as a measure of skill... there's going to be all those underhanded players who camp/poke the backfield or pretend to be AFK all game who then pickup easy kills they didn't do any real work for... after the rest of the team has died. Does that make them skilled ?

[HGAK47]

Wattila, on 17 June 2017 - 12:12 PM, said:

The quirks seem to be an incentive to use the secondary hardpoints, so you get the best quirks on the least relevant hardpoints. Just look at what they did with the KGC quirks, I guess KGC-0000 will be the new Gauss/ERLL boat. Generally annoyed by PGI trying to outsmart the player base when it comes to quirks and skill tree.

Its getting quite annoying now, granted this is a small change around sure but I will feel it in battle for certain. I certainly wont be fitting missiles, LRM'`s on a dakka specific boat? No tag or narc or probe, so now they expect me to fit some odd missiles and waste space to make the missiles worth a damn? How is that going to help me. And im much to slow to use SRMS so that isnt much of an option.

Im beginning to think that people are right - they dont play test their game enough and rely on 'on-paper calculations' and whiteboard guesswork. The king crab too is another example.

I could really start to list the mechs that have seen very questionable changes over the past few weeks and months. Not exactly what I expected when they talked about balance.

Edited by HGAK47, 17 June 2017 - 12:24 PM.

[Weeny Machine]

Davy J0nes, on 17 June 2017 - 11:24 AM, said:

Please look over the trebuchet quirks badly need CT quirk.

The treb has always been overshadowed or forgotten

- We were told it was going to get rescaled ( even mentioned over twitter that it was ) noting happens.

- new skilltree system the mech is suffering badly compared to all other mechs out there

- Cuz of its size the treb is as tall as a atlas and as wide as a banshee.

If the treb cant be looked again for a rescaled can its armor quirks please be looked at again currently no etc armor on the CT please PGI give the mech a look again.

They also said that the light mechs, the 35t ones, which got huge after the re-scaling would get quirk compensation. Reading the patch note comments of the devs they seem to consider lights to be in a good shape. Most likely they now consider the Treb also ok.

No need to comment that any further.

[BobTheBully]

The CSPL nerf is pretty harsh, CSPL builds can barely stand up against meta ballistic and SRM builds as it is, and now they are going to be a joke.

The insanely low range of SPL creates a risk and reward dynamic inherent to the weapon, now it is all risk and no reward, very disappointed, hope you guys will reconsider the numbers on the SPLs.

However everything else in the patch seems fair, and really looking forward to group leader switching and HPV fixes.

Edited by BobTheBully, 17 June 2017 - 12:46 PM.

[MovinTarget]

I like the "pass the lead" in groups, it is definitely needed.

Next we need a "take the lead" mechanism so be able to acquire the "crown" from someone that is AFK so a group can stay intact.

[UnseenFury]

C-AC/20s and C-UAC/20s are beyond useless, any change to them? No.
Dual UAC-10s on 75tonners bug - both jam on the first shot if fired together, fixed? No.
Tbr handles like a concrete block, why is it OK in a MechWarrior game?