145 replies to this topic

[TheArisen]

More than a few people consider these two weapons to be traps. The obvious question then is how to make them worthwhile but not OP?

The LGauss weighs 12t (same as a CGauss) but only does 8 DMG. It has a somewhat greater range though as well as more ammo per ton. Still, 8 DMG for such a heavy & crit eating weapon isn't very appealing. Maybe no charge needed? Faster cooldown?

Heavy Gauss at first glance looks like it'll be scary but it takes so much tonnage & slots along with forcing you to use a heavier std engine it's actually just a paper tiger. It's DMG dropoff is also pretty fast so really you'd be better off using combinations other weapons.

[Valhallan]

LGauss could be a thing if it was no charge, HGauss needs crit splitting.

[MechaBattler]

Light Gauss needs to have a lower cooldown to make up for it's lower damage. Combine that with no charge and it should be good for something.

[Mcgral18]

LGauss

No Charge
3 KM/s velocity
No firing limit
3x max range


Those might make it a long range choice, if it keeps 8 damage.

[Elizander]

MechaBattler, on 20 June 2017 - 09:02 PM, said:

Light Gauss needs to have a lower cooldown to make up for it's lower damage. Combine that with no charge and it should be good for something.

Lower CD and more damage per ton of ammo like AC/10. I don't care if it has charge time, but give it 200 damage per ton of ammo instead of the standard 150.

Heavy Gauss is more of a close-range weapon meaning it's more vulnerable to going boom. Making it more sturdy or minimizing the internal damage when it explodes is the make or break point for me. It can't be as fragile or as detrimental to have as the standard gauss rifle given its range.

Edited by Elizander, 20 June 2017 - 10:09 PM.

[Shifty McSwift]

You will probably be able to fire 3 light gauss without lock.

And I assume heavy gauss will be fittable in most big mech single gauss builds, otherwise why even bother.

[Elizander]

Shifty McSwift, on 20 June 2017 - 10:10 PM, said:

You will probably be able to fire 3 light gauss without lock.

And I assume heavy gauss will be fittable in most big mech single gauss builds, otherwise why even bother.

Heavy Gauss only fits in side torso. It won't fit in any arm.

[kapusta11]

Here's a thing with Light Gauss, let's say you poke around the corner with it and you see a clan gauss ppc assault, you fire your weapons, your enemy does the same and... you lose a trade, because clan gauss does more damage for the same weight. Your "better dps" is wasted because your enemy is not there anymore and if you try to find someone else to shoot you risk losing another trade.

[MechaBattler]

Elizander, on 20 June 2017 - 10:07 PM, said:

Lower CD and more damage per ton of ammo like AC/10. I don't care if it has charge time, but give it 200 damage per ton of ammo instead of the standard 150.

Heavy Gauss is more of a close-range weapon meaning it's more vulnerable to going boom. Making it more sturdy or minimizing the internal damage when it explodes is the make or break point for me. It can't be as fragile or as detrimental to have as the standard gauss rifle given its range.

I wonder if we'll be able to fire 3 Light Gauss Rifles at once. Though that's only 24 points of damage for 36 tons, plus ammo.

[Elizander]

MechaBattler, on 20 June 2017 - 10:27 PM, said:

I wonder if we'll be able to fire 3 Light Gauss Rifles at once. Though that's only 24 points of damage for 36 tons, plus ammo.

I really am not a fan of Light Gauss given the fairly simple stats of it being 3 less tons than Gauss and losing 7 damage out of the 15 gauss has. That's 20% weight savings and almost 50% damage loss. To me on paper that's really horrible.

2 Gauss is 30 tons and 30 damage. 3 Light Gauss is 36 tons and 24 damage.

[TheArisen]

kapusta11, on 20 June 2017 - 10:26 PM, said:

Here's a thing with Light Gauss, let's say you poke around the corner with it and you see a clan gauss ppc assault, you fire your weapons, your enemy does the same and... you lose a trade, because clan gauss does more damage for the same weight. Your "better dps" is wasted because your enemy is not there anymore and if you try to find someone else to shoot you risk losing another trade.

True but that's part of the purpose here, to figure out how to make them useful. But if you use the LGauss's greater range you might be able to win the trade.

[Shifty McSwift]

Elizander, on 20 June 2017 - 10:18 PM, said:

Heavy Gauss only fits in side torso. It won't fit in any arm.

Link to the stats? Or do you just sound definitive about that.

Elizander, on 20 June 2017 - 10:31 PM, said:

I really am not a fan of Light Gauss given the fairly simple stats of it being 3 less tons than Gauss and losing 7 damage out of the 15 gauss has. That's 20% weight savings and almost 50% damage loss. To me on paper that's really horrible.

2 Gauss is 30 tons and 30 damage. 3 Light Gauss is 36 tons and 24 damage.

Sure but the same has always been the case with ACs, an AC2s weight compared to an AC20, much the same kind of sillyness from first glance, at second glance you realise it has other factors.

[Shifty McSwift]

Promessa, on 20 June 2017 - 09:10 PM, said:

On lights, no charge would make sense, meaning you could shoot 3 at once. I'd imagine the fire rate will be pretty good, with high velocity and probably 750m range, should be a pretty nice weapon I think, compared to an ac10.

I believe the opposite, light being longer ranged isn't as adversely affected by a charge timer that heavy gauss, which is used at brawl/ac20 range most likely. Heavy gauss with no or very little charge timer makes more sense for balancing (less for logic, but hey).

[El Bandito]

Heavy Gauss costs 11 slots, the same as IS LB20X. Which means it is a bad weapon that forces Std engine, on top of not being able to fit on any arm. Unless PGI finally gets a clue and begin to reduce TT weight/slot values for better balancing, those two weapons are gonna be non-competitive.

[Valhallan]

El Bandito, on 20 June 2017 - 11:39 PM, said:

Heavy Gauss costs 11 slots, the same as IS LB20X. Which means it is a bad weapon that forces Std engine, on top of not being able to fit on any arm. Unless PGI finally gets a clue and begin to reduce TT weight/slot values for better balancing, those two weapons are gonna be non-competitive.

OR you know, allowing the TT crit splitting for 8+slot weapons, it would finally allow us to get fatter weapons too like the artillery guns. Yea yea pgi, but one could dream .

[El Bandito]

I personally would love crit splitting to get my beloved ARROW IV in this game, but reduced crit works out even better, no questions about that.

[Reno Blade]

Hmm thats a tough one for HG, but i guess LG could be working well with few tweaks.

Lets say: LG gets 1s less cooldown and only 50% of the charge time. Maybe increase damage to 10, then the tonnage is worth it, but it's competing against the AC2+5.
Charge limit: 2
Ammo / ton: 20(+4) (160dmg / ton)
4s cd, 1 heat, 0.5s charge time, 1s charge hold time

Gauss Rifle:
Charge limit: 2
Ammo / ton: 10(+4) (150dmg / ton)
5s cd, 2 heat (+1), 1s charge time, 1.5s charge hold time

Heavy Gauss range and tonnage makes it very hard to get into action. You will have a walking bomb in your Mauler/Atlas side torso and not enough speed to get close fast.
Maybe more ammo per ton than in TT?
Charge limit: 2
Ammo / ton: 7(+2) (175dmg / ton)
5s cd, 4 heat (+2), 1.5s charge time, 2s charge hold time

[LordNothing]

charging mechanics get problematic when the weapon gets smaller and has an increased rate of fire. heavy gauss i can see a longer charge and a longer hold time as well. but doing the inverse on the light version would make it a thing to fumble over. what if you just give the lgauss a quarter second delay between firing and popping. if it does end up with charge make it so you can fire 3 or 4 at a time.

Edited by LordNothing, 21 June 2017 - 02:44 AM.

[TheArisen]

LordNothing, on 21 June 2017 - 02:41 AM, said:

charging mechanics get problematic when the weapon gets smaller and has an increased rate of fire. heavy gauss i can see a longer charge and a longer hold time as well. but doing the inverse on the light version would make it a thing to fumble over. what if you just give the lgauss a quarter second delay between firing and popping. if it does end up with charge make it so you can fire 3 or 4 at a time.

Well I do think the LGauss should have a good hold time if it even got a charge. If it gets one we should be able to charge & fire at least 3 at the same time.

[MustrumRidcully]

El Bandito, on 20 June 2017 - 11:39 PM, said:

Heavy Gauss costs 11 slots, the same as IS LB20X. Which means it is a bad weapon that forces Std engine, on top of not being able to fit on any arm. Unless PGI finally gets a clue and begin to reduce TT weight/slot values for better balancing, those two weapons are gonna be non-competitive.

They probably won't do it because altering these will alter any stock versions they get into the game. Personally, I think crit slots can easily be dialed down - no one cares if you have a few crit slots empty.

Weight might be more difficult, since mechs are never "underweight".
But then, if the weapon is too heavy for its performance, it could simply be adjusted in range, cooldown or damage to bring its performance up.