255 replies to this topic

[Kubernetes]

Scout Derek, on 29 June 2017 - 12:06 PM, said:

The good and bad;


Good:

Heavy Machine Guns

Light Ferro

Light Fusion Engines

LBXAC/20

Heavy Gauss Rifle

Light PPCS


Bad:


Everything else just about.

Agree with most of this. IS ERML might have a place for more ranged laser vomit, and I can see throwing RLs into unused missile slots. But apart from those additions your list is spot on.

The snub-nose PPC is too hot for brawl.
Heavy PPC is too hot for the damage.
MRMs are trash.
RACs are a joke.
Heavy lasers--oh god no.

[Jay Leon Hart]

MechaBattler, on 29 June 2017 - 01:18 PM, said:

It not having a penalty does not make up for a 25% weight difference in my opinion. It is inferior without the penalty. Adding even half the penalty would only increase it's inferiority further.

And while I agree, only losing 4 slots for that weight saving compared the the STD isn't enough, either.

It seems pretty clear PGI won't buff the STD and they're (probably) not giving us a penalty free LFE, so let's try to mitigate how bad they make the penalty.

[0bsidion]

KevinZhang, on 29 June 2017 - 11:39 AM, said:

I didn't follow along with every release but only recently looked over the notes for the PTS and what is coming to MWO with the Civil War tech. I'm not sure if it is just me but doesn't it seem really skewed towards IS mechs with this release? A majority of the weapons and tech seem to be IS only (especially the bigger stuff like rotary AC, STEALTH ARMOR, rokkit launchas, etc) while clans only get some micro-lasers and whatnot. I know people complain that clan is too strong but is swinging the pendulum hard towards the IS side really the right fix for balance?

Speaking as someone who has tried a hand full of the new IS toys, as they stand on PTS they're mostly underwhelming. Granted I've only got to play around with about half of them but based on feedback from other players I'm not expecting much from the other half either.

So I wouldn't feel too badly, it's either heavily nerfed or restricted versions of what might otherwise be nice additions to the IS arsenal. When I heard IS was getting RACs I figured Clans were going to be straight up outgunned. After trying them, they're like long ranged MGs with the added bonus of jamming and massive heat spikes.

On TT, RAC/5s could dish out 30 damage point bursts, and RAC/2s could do 12. Granted that damage was likely to be spread out a bit. Here RAC/5s do 9 damage and RAC/2s do 6. Not much to be jealous about there.

[Angel of Annihilation]

Hell yeah they did. Been testing alot since yesterday and I can honestly say if what is on the Public test server was to go live today, there isn't one weapon outside of possibly the ER Micro Laser that I would remotely consider putting on any of my 60+ Clan mechs. I am not exaggerating either. They offer nothing to Clan mechs, nothing.

The IS on the other hand. Holy Hell in a Handbasket. Each and every IS mech I have tested so far has gotten a huge buff. LFEs along are having a crazy effect on how powerfuly my IS mechs have become and most of the weapons systems range from great to at least decent. There are only a few pieces of IS tech that appear to be duds so far.

Honestly I am rather excited that the other 60+ non-Clan mechs I own are going to get a huge buff with the new tech, but it makes me wonder if it will be worth it to plan Clan mechs any more. I am not joking either because don't forget, the current balance after the Skill Tree between Clans and IS was only 6%. Well my IS mechs so far seem to be getting a hell of alot more than a 6% buff in performance. 10-30% is more like it. Honestly I have had sinking feeling that those favoring IS mechs are going to get some Clan treatment shortly after the tech is introduced and experience what it is like to have sweaping, build altering changes across everything.

0bsidion, on 29 June 2017 - 01:58 PM, said:

Speaking as someone who has tried a hand full of the new IS toys, as they stand on PTS they're mostly underwhelming. Granted I've only got to play around with about half of them but based on feedback from other players I'm not expecting much from the other half either.

So I wouldn't feel too badly, it's either heavily nerfed or restricted versions of what might otherwise be nice additions to the IS arsenal. When I heard IS was getting RACs I figured Clans were going to be straight up outgunned. After trying them, they're like long ranged MGs with the added bonus of jamming and massive heat spikes.

On TT, RAC/5s could dish out 30 damage point bursts, and RAC/2s could do 12. Granted that damage was likely to be spread out a bit. Here RAC/5s do 9 damage and RAC/2s do 6. Not much to be jealous about there.

So in TT a RAC/5 could do 30 damage in 10 seconds or 3 damage per second (remember each turn represented 10 seconds of time passing) and In MWO, they can do 9.6 damage per second so they are junk?

[Commander A9]

Two words.

Assault Lasers Heavy Lasers, my bad!

Be them. Know them. Do them. They will melt stuff!

I used to use them all the time in Mechwarrior 4. They perform here exactly the way they do there. It's freakin' disgusting!

I fully intend to strap 4 of these bad boys onto my SRM-brawling Timber Wolf, and replace my Medium Pulse Lasers with them, along with adding a Double Heat Sink per Medium Pulse Laser replaced which will help mitigate heat. It's going to wreck stuff like no tomorrow.

RACs, I'm really interested in too. I have to say I'm actually excited about this new technology.

Edited by Commander A9, 29 June 2017 - 03:36 PM.

[FupDup]

Commander A9, on 29 June 2017 - 03:17 PM, said:

Two words.

Assault Lasers.

Be them. Know them. Do them. They will melt stuff!

I used to use them all the time in Mechwarrior 4. They perform here exactly the way they do there. It's freakin' disgusting!

I fully intend to strap 4 of these bad boys onto my SRM-brawling Timber Wolf. It's going to wreck ****!

Assault Lasers only existed as a non-canon weapon in MekTek's MekPak updates for MW4. The chances of PGI adding them are approximately 0.0%.

Also, Assault Lasers were an Inner Sphere weapon. You cannot equip them on a Timber Wolf because MWO does not allow faction tech mixing.

Edited by FupDup, 29 June 2017 - 03:22 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

KevinZhang, on 29 June 2017 - 11:39 AM, said:

I didn't follow along with every release but only recently looked over the notes for the PTS and what is coming to MWO with the Civil War tech. I'm not sure if it is just me but doesn't it seem really skewed towards IS mechs with this release? A majority of the weapons and tech seem to be IS only (especially the bigger stuff like rotary AC, STEALTH ARMOR, rokkit launchas, etc) while clans only get some micro-lasers and whatnot. I know people complain that clan is too strong but is swinging the pendulum hard towards the IS side really the right fix for balance?

It's called playing catch up. Since ya know... Clams have sort of had the edge for 3 years now.

[Commander A9]

Whoops! I meant "Heavy Lasers!" Excuse me. XD

Meanwhile, yes, HEAVY LASERS, I'm definitely looking forward to. They're going to melt stuff!

Edited by Commander A9, 29 June 2017 - 03:37 PM.

[Mcgral18]

Jay Leon Hart, on 29 June 2017 - 01:49 PM, said:

PGI won't buff the STD

PGIplz

[Angel of Annihilation]

Bishop Steiner, on 29 June 2017 - 03:23 PM, said:

It's called playing catch up. Since ya know... Clams have sort of had the edge for 3 years now.

Disagree Bishop. It has been a long time since I felt most of my Clan mechs had any sort of real advantage and there are two fact your omitting.

1) PGI flat out told us that the Clans were attracting more of the higher skilled player base. That is skill advantage, not tech advantage.

2) As of the data after the introduction of the skill trees, PGI was showing only a 6% overall difference between Clan and IS mechs and this was before the nerfed several of the best performing Clan mechs into the ground and further beat up the Clans with the energy re-balance. Sorry Bish, but the skill advantage alone would account for that 6% difference, maybe even more. All PGI did with the energy re-balance is give the Clans a handicap to balance out the skill gap between Clans and IS. I am talking overall here, not individual skill because there are quite a few skilled IS player out there, just not as many as on the Clan side of things.

So honestly at best, taking into account skill and tech, we are easily at parity level right now in IS vs Clan fights. Take the skill out and look only at the tech we are probably realistically at a point where IS mechs are a bit better. After the new tech drops, IS will be clearly superior skill factored in or not at least that is what I am seeing on the current PTS. I kid you not Bishop, every IS mech I have built on the PTS has gained at least a 10% performance increase and many even feel stronger than that compared my current builds in the live environment. I am really feeling like half my mechs, the Clan ones, are going to be feeling rather inferior come the July Tech patch.

Of course this means I have mixed feelings. Disappointed about the Clan tech but am jumping for joy at the buffs my IS mechs are going to be getting.

[FupDup]

Viktor Drake, on 29 June 2017 - 04:46 PM, said:

1) PGI flat out told us that the Clans were attracting more of the higher skilled player base.

Probably because skilled players often prefer to compound their skill advantage by also using the strongest mechs/guns/strats/etc.

[Bishop Steiner]

Viktor Drake, on 29 June 2017 - 04:46 PM, said:

Disagree Bishop. It has been a long time since I felt most of my Clan mechs had any sort of real advantage and there are two fact your omitting.

1) PGI flat out told us that the Clans were attracting more of the higher skilled player base. That is skill advantage, not tech advantage.

2) As of the data after the introduction of the skill trees, PGI was showing only a 6% overall difference between Clan and IS mechs and this was before the nerfed several of the best performing Clan mechs into the ground and further beat up the Clans with the energy re-balance. Sorry Bish, but the skill advantage alone would account for that 6% difference, maybe even more. All PGI did with the energy re-balance is give the Clans a handicap to balance out the skill gap between Clans and IS. I am talking overall here, not individual skill because there are quite a few skilled IS player out there, just not as many as on the Clan side of things.

So honestly at best, taking into account skill and tech, we are easily at parity level right now in IS vs Clan fights. Take the skill out and look only at the tech we are probably realistically at a point where IS mechs are a bit better. After the new tech drops, IS will be clearly superior skill factored in or not at least that is what I am seeing on the current PTS. I kid you not Bishop, every IS mech I have built on the PTS has gained at least a 10% performance increase and many even feel stronger than that compared my current builds in the live environment. I am really feeling like half my mechs, the Clan ones, are going to be feeling rather inferior come the July Tech patch.

Of course this means I have mixed feelings. Disappointed about the Clan tech but am jumping for joy at the buffs my IS mechs are going to be getting.

except telemetry don't lie, 3 sweeps of Tuk don't lie, etc.
Also there is a reason Clams attract the"skill" crowd... because they play what works.

FupDup, on 29 June 2017 - 04:48 PM, said:

Probably because skilled players often prefer to compound their skill advantage by also using the strongest mechs/guns/strats/etc.

yup.

Some may like the challenge, but when it's time to go big boi, they take the best.

[Johnny Z]

The clan heavy medium laser does 10 damage for 1 ton? Meanwhile the LPL does 10 damage for 7 tons? This cannot be right.

[Scout Derek]

Johnny Z, on 29 June 2017 - 05:00 PM, said:

The clan heavy medium laser does 10 damage for 1 ton? Meanwhile the LPL does 10 damage for 7 tons? This cannot be right.

I mean....

HML: 1.6 Laser Duration

LPL: 1.12 Laser Duration


A full .5 more seconds to stare at a target....

IMO only good for smaller low tonnage hardpoint starved mechs.

[FupDup]

Johnny Z, on 29 June 2017 - 05:00 PM, said:

The clan heavy medium laser does 10 damage for 1 ton? Meanwhile the LPL does 10 damage for 7 tons? This cannot be right.

There are other factors like beam duration, range, heat, and cooldown at play. The LPL has the advantage in those four areas.

[Daemon04]

the real improvement IS mechs desperately needed were the non-insta-gib xl-engines and the weapons clans already have such as streaks, uacs, er-lasers and lbx's.

with so many weapons missing on IS side it just looks like we are being favored but i think they shouldve been added a long time ago.

Edited by Daemon04, 29 June 2017 - 05:25 PM.

[Snowbluff]

Daemon04, on 29 June 2017 - 05:25 PM, said:

the real improvement IS mechs desperately needed were the non-insta-gib xl-engines

nop

Quote

and the weapons clans already have such as streaks,

BOOOH! No one wants streaks.

Quote

uacs,

UAC10, maybe

Quote

er-lasers

I guess.

Quote

and lbx's.

BOOOH!

It's nice that IS is getting some filler tech, but I think the new stuff is really more fun. The Clans aren't getting anything fun.

Edited by Snowbluff, 29 June 2017 - 05:43 PM.

[El Bandito]

PGI is simply following lore. IS had to develop tons of new tech to try to catch up to Clan tech, while Clanners were mostly content with their current weapon system. Which is why in lore there were tons of new tech for the IS between Clan invasion and 3067.

Or do you want PGI to invent non-lore weapons just for the sake of giving Clanners something?

[Snowbluff]

El Bandito, on 29 June 2017 - 06:05 PM, said:

PGI is simply following lore. IS had to develop tons of new tech to try to catch up to Clan tech, while Clanners were mostly content with their current weapon system. Which is why in lore there were tons of new tech for the IS between Clan invasion and 3067.

Or do you want PGI to invent non-lore weapons just for the sake of giving Clanners something?

RACs and HAGs were in development for the clans during this era. So no, they wouldn't have to make something up if they moved the year up by 2.

[Revis Volek]

Welcome to the party cupcake(OP).