90 replies to this topic

[MechWarrior414712]

All these people who say big damage is bad... lmao are you serious...

A 2k+ damage game means you've totally ripped like 3 or 4 mechs to shreds. Doesnt matter if that spreads to useless parts, medium/heavies have about 400-600 health when you count all the parts. And as this is a team game, one solo kill (one for one) should mean you've pulled your weight.

[No Skill Rush]

Good stuff, definitely some top tier potatoes farming

[Admiral-Dan]

NlGHTBlRD, on 16 July 2017 - 07:34 PM, said:

Marauder-IIC, 6C-ERLL, 30DHS, is clearly unbalanced, please nerf ASAP, by decreasing damage.increasing heat or both

Either you are trying to brag or you haven’t understood the real problem here.
The real problem is the bad matchmaking which allows you to use your teammates as armor while you farm useless damage and grind your way to Tier 1.

Your screenshots award you the title of “Laser equivalent of an LRM-Boat”. gz

[Metus regem]

Mystere, on 16 July 2017 - 09:51 PM, said:

Ah! But this game tends to punish efficient killers.

Tell me about it.

Still it keeps me the low end of things, letting me be as casual as I'd like... so not all bad.

[Lily from animove]

I O O percent KongLord, on 17 July 2017 - 05:07 AM, said:

All these people who say big damage is bad... lmao are you serious...

A 2k+ damage game means you've totally ripped like 3 or 4 mechs to shreds. Doesnt matter if that spreads to useless parts, medium/heavies have about 400-600 health when you count all the parts. And as this is a team game, one solo kill (one for one) should mean you've pulled your weight.

it still is bad, especially on low dps CERLL, because this means your incompetent opps weren't able to kill and nor your teammates. within competent players such thing doesn't happen. and efficient killing is the most important part if you want quick success so 2k+ means 8+ kills you should have done.

[Gas Guzzler]

Luminis, on 17 July 2017 - 02:00 AM, said:

With all due respect for your anti poptart nerf campaign, but I think this threat actually highlights one of the main issues pretty well: I have a hard time believing that the PPFLD nature of the Gauss / PPC combo eve allows you to farm up 1,500 - 2,000 damage without regularly killing at least half the enemy team.

I'm not gonna knock the damage numbers or overall performance, they're both damn impressive. But ERLLs posting a 600 dmg / kill ratio isn't exactly a huge argument against nerfing PPFLD which has always been famed for not spreading damage all over the place.

That can't be so, why just the other day someone said that a dual Gauss ER PPC Night Gyr racks up 1500 damage on the reg because its so OP.

And who said anything about poptarting? ER PPC Summoner/HBK-IIC can still poptart fine. And TBH the Night Gyr will be able to as well after this change. 15 DHS can handle the ghost heat for the 2 Gauss 1 ER PPC build unless they give the Gauss a huge multiplier.

Edited by Gas Guzzler, 17 July 2017 - 08:22 AM.

[Gas Guzzler]

TechChris, on 16 July 2017 - 11:38 PM, said:

Seriously???

How's the OP doing that? All OP has shown is that you can farm damage by spraying cERLL in masse from a mile away and that the MADIIC is a good platform to do such? (Not meant to sound negative, or like a dis. I mean if it works, it works!)

I mean if he'd been using, say a Scorch, with Gauss/PPC and had gotten his weapons on target as many times an he'd a needed to farm the damage shown in OP (and been able to hit them with said projectile weapons instead of spraying tracefire instant velocity lasers......those are 2 separate skillsets!) he'd likely have gotten half the damage and 4 times the kills AND likely carried ALL those to victory rather then the 4 where his team was able to capitalize on the softened mechs!!!

So I'm just not seeing the correlation of mass spraying of cERLLs to the Gauss/PPC GH linking thats finally coming this patch?

Uhh probably not because ER PPC Gauss has less effective range than a cERLL boat. Its more pointing out how misleading numbers can be, and that people saying "OMG PPC Gauss and those high damage stats, its OP" will turn around and say "well..." and make up a bunch of reasons for why he is getting such high damage.

The joke is that everybody is so behind the times that they don't realize that quad eR PPC boats and laser vomit are more effective than PPC-Gauss nowadays. Yeah, the Night Gyr is holding on because it can poptart, but that's it.

AlphaEtOmega, on 17 July 2017 - 07:12 AM, said:

Either you are trying to brag or you haven’t understood the real problem here.
The real problem is the bad matchmaking which allows you to use your teammates as armor while you farm useless damage and grind your way to Tier 1.

Your screenshots award you the title of “Laser equivalent of an LRM-Boat”. gz

So you are saying these stats are not a good representation of the state of cERLL boats?

[Y E O N N E]

Pro-tip for the incredulous individuals:
When you are ERLL sniping, you take every shot presented, even if it is to a non-critical location. Why? Because half of your job is to keep the enemy on the defensive so other people can have an easier time killing them. Hence the ridiculous damage numbers. I will not hold my shots for a better target. If it moves, I lase it.

[TechChris]

Gas Guzzler, on 17 July 2017 - 08:23 AM, said:

Uhh probably not because ER PPC Gauss has less effective range than a cERLL boat. Its more pointing out how misleading numbers can be, and that people saying "OMG PPC Gauss and those high damage stats, its OP" will turn around and say "well..." and make up a bunch of reasons for why he is getting such high damage.

So are you saying the OP likely wouldn't have done so well if he hadn't been Hiding At The Most Extreme Of Ranges the whole Match while his teammates played decoy?
Or that spraying those cERLLs is more effective than if he'd moved a bit closer into gauss/ppc range and made each his shots count (obviously OP knows well how to get his guns on target) while possibly taking some the return damage for his team?

For me personally at least Gauss/PPC has never been about the "OMG look at that damage" factor. I've seen, or personally gotten, crazy damage with plenty different weapon systems. If the match plays out right and you know what your doing....well, yeah, you can make it hurt for the enemy with a lotta things. I mean we all know the sad state of brawling since engine desync/skilltree yet just this week I've had 4 games I can remember where I got to do 800-1000 damage with 5+ kill/kmdds in a pure srm brawler cause team was able to close gap with enemy and got chance to chew thru there flanks. Doesn't mean SRMs need nerfing by any stretch (hell...they might need a buff to help nudge back the short range game).

Gauss/PPC is about how easily, at a pretty decent range, with minimal exposure if ya do it right, you can put out "meaningful/crippling" damage. Two 50 damage PP alphas to same spot is a good way to wreck many a mechs day if not outright kill em.

I like the Gauss/PPC GH linking since as they stated in the post, it means they finally balance the individual weapon systems without fear of the combo becoming more problematic. So maybe one day we can have back Gauss with out the silly charge mechanic. Or can get PPCs that are fast enough to effectively use there full range, I mean they already gave a velocity boost in the same patch!!!

Gas Guzzler, on 17 July 2017 - 08:23 AM, said:

The joke is that everybody is so behind the times that they don't realize that quad eR PPC boats and laser vomit are more effective than PPC-Gauss nowadays. Yeah, the Night Gyr is holding on because it can poptart, but that's it.

Yeah.....there's no denying it took PGI so long to get around to this that other stuff has already moved into limelight thanks to all the "reshuffling of meta" and new "balance issues' the engine desync and skilltree has brought about! But still a step in right direction so now the systems can be balanced individually, and maybe, just maybe, it means there's hope that PGI has grown some spine and will be willing to push other "drastic" changes as needed for sake of balancing........one can hope!?

[Gas Guzzler]

TechChris, on 17 July 2017 - 09:10 AM, said:

I mean we all know the sad state of brawling since engine desync/skilltree yet just this week I've had 4 games I can remember where I got to do 800-1000 damage with 5+ kill/kmdds in a pure srm brawler cause team was able to close gap with enemy and got chance to chew thru there flanks. Doesn't mean SRMs need nerfing by any stretch (hell...they might need a buff to help nudge back the short range game).

Wait, what? Brawling is probably in a better place than most of the PPC Gauss mechs in the game...

[davoodoo]

Gas Guzzler, on 17 July 2017 - 09:14 AM, said:

Wait, what? Brawling is probably in a better place than most of the PPC Gauss mechs in the game...

I would argue considering amount of truly amazing brawl mechs and the fact that it just doesnt work with assaults anymore.

Edited by davoodoo, 17 July 2017 - 09:17 AM.

[Gas Guzzler]

TechChris, on 17 July 2017 - 09:10 AM, said:

Gauss/PPC is about how easily, at a pretty decent range, with minimal exposure if ya do it right, you can put out "meaningful/crippling" damage. Two 50 damage PP alphas to same spot is a good way to wreck many a mechs day if not outright kill em.

I mean.. don't stand there for 6 seconds after you get shot. Problem solved.

The 50 damage alphaers aren't even in a great place right now. The Gauss PPC Night Gyr is really the last one left prior to the nerf. Assaults are too sluggish to do it well and are better served going Quad cER PPC.

davoodoo, on 17 July 2017 - 09:16 AM, said:

I would argue considering amount of truly amazing brawl mechs and the fact that it just doesnt work with assaults anymore.

Yeah brawl assaults don't work very well, but a pack of brawl mediums and fast heavies...

Edited by Gas Guzzler, 17 July 2017 - 09:16 AM.

[TechChris]

Gas Guzzler, on 17 July 2017 - 09:14 AM, said:

Wait, what? Brawling is probably in a better place than most of the PPC Gauss mechs in the game...

I'd care to disagree, but that is neither here nor there, nor even on topic with this post......so yeah!

Gas Guzzler, on 17 July 2017 - 09:16 AM, said:

I mean.. don't stand there for 6 seconds after you get shot. Problem solved.

The 50 damage alphaers aren't even in a great place right now. The Gauss PPC Night Gyr is really the last one left prior to the nerf. Assaults are too sluggish to do it well and are better served going Quad cER PPC.

Not disagreeing on this.
As I said last post, took so long for PGI to do anything, it's almost completely "after the fact".

Still don't see how this makes OP about the Gauss/PPC thing?
Still think Gauss/PPC GH link will be alright since it finally allows them to balance the weapons individually.......depending on what they do to each system individually of course, still plenty ways PGI would be capable of making things worse as we know.

Either way, been a fun little chit chat man.
Hope it all works out to be something good.
Gosh knows we're not in need of anymore hot garbage round here!

[Luminis]

Gas Guzzler, on 17 July 2017 - 08:17 AM, said:

That can't be so, why just the other day someone said that a dual Gauss ER PPC Night Gyr racks up 1500 damage on the reg because its so OP.

I'm not saying it can't rack up as much damage, I'm saying that you'll inevitably kill more Mechs if your dealt that much damage.

Gas Guzzler, on 17 July 2017 - 08:17 AM, said:

And who said anything about poptarting? ER PPC Summoner/HBK-IIC can still poptart fine. And TBH the Night Gyr will be able to as well after this change. 15 DHS can handle the ghost heat for the 2 Gauss 1 ER PPC build unless they give the Gauss a huge multiplier.

Should have said PPC / Gauss instead of poptart. My bad.

[Gas Guzzler]

Luminis, on 17 July 2017 - 09:32 AM, said:

Should have said PPC / Gauss instead of poptart. My bad.

I mean I have other builds. Laser vomit is already better than PPC/Gauss and its getting buffed. I also like PPC/AC builds a lot. Just seems foolish to nerf variety.

TechChris, on 17 July 2017 - 09:32 AM, said:

I'd care to disagree, but that is neither here nor there, nor even on topic with this post......so yeah!



Not disagreeing on this.
As I said last post, took so long for PGI to do anything, it's almost completely "after the fact".

Still don't see how this makes OP about the Gauss/PPC thing?
Still think Gauss/PPC GH link will be alright since it finally allows them to balance the weapons individually.......depending on what they do to each system individually of course, still plenty ways PGI would be capable of making things worse as we know.

Either way, been a fun little chit chat man.
Hope it all works out to be something good.
Gosh knows we're not in need of anymore hot garbage round here!

Okay. I mean... SNV/WHK quad cER PPC boats are already good, why they needed a buff is beyond me. Seems like the only weapon that really needed to be buffed was the IS ER PPC, and they could have done that without touching PPC/Gauss and it would have been fine.

[Luminis]

Gas Guzzler, on 17 July 2017 - 09:38 AM, said:

I mean I have other builds. Laser vomit is already better than PPC/Gauss and its getting buffed. I also like PPC/AC builds a lot. Just seems foolish to nerf variety.

We're drifting off topic here, but going by the patch notes, it's not just to nerf the outright performance of Gauss / PCC builds. It's just as much, if not primarily, because of the interaction between the two was limiting design space and PGI's ability to work with the weapons as freely as they would like. I mean, they'd have to severly nerf the ERLLs compared to how they are now if you were allowed to fire four of them at the same time without Ghost Heat...

Either way, the only thing I wanted to point out is that the ability to rack up excessive damage with a different weapon system doesn't really say anything about PPC / Gauss - unless we wanted to specifically discuss spread damage vs. pinpoint damage, but I think we all know the advantages of PPFLD compared to spread damage, anyway.

[Gas Guzzler]

Luminis, on 17 July 2017 - 09:59 AM, said:

We're drifting off topic here, but going by the patch notes, it's not just to nerf the outright performance of Gauss / PCC builds. It's just as much, if not primarily, because of the interaction between the two was limiting design space and PGI's ability to work with the weapons as freely as they would like. I mean, they'd have to severly nerf the ERLLs compared to how they are now if you were allowed to fire four of them at the same time without Ghost Heat...

Either way, the only thing I wanted to point out is that the ability to rack up excessive damage with a different weapon system doesn't really say anything about PPC / Gauss - unless we wanted to specifically discuss spread damage vs. pinpoint damage, but I think we all know the advantages of PPFLD compared to spread damage, anyway.

Well, to go off topic one last time.. I don't see how they were limited by the combo. Clan ER PPCs were already just fine on their own. In fact, for long range trading, quad ER PPC assaults like the Warhawk and SNV-C are more attractive than the 50 damage PPC Gauss mechs.

The only PPC that really needed a buff was the IS ER PPC, and they could have done that without PPC-Gauss getting out of hand, because IS PPC-Gauss was never really an issue.

[Skanderborg]

I'm the best MWO player in the universe. Fear me!

[Angel of Annihilation]

They have already been nerfed to the point almost no one uses them so lets nerf them some more. Sounds like a plan only PGI could come up with.

Edited by Viktor Drake, 17 July 2017 - 11:27 AM.

[Brain Cancer]

Any missile boater can tell you damage alone isn't good, it's putting that damage into locations that disable and kill enemy 'Mechs.

Those kind of numbers are so inefficient as to almost be worth accusing the OP of deliberately using his team to farm damage while leaving the enemy alive as long as possible to kill everyone else. Which I'm sure they enjoyed, both the guys on his team as the OP deliberately shot for arms and legs and the enemy team, who had more time to kill off everyone else.