66 replies to this topic

[El Bandito]

GuardDogg, on 21 July 2017 - 06:47 AM, said:

Past months, been stressing myself to get back up, and noticed that the battlefield is one messy place. No organization, formation. A friendly can have combat skills alone, but terrible piloting skills (banging into you, getting in front of your fire, on your back). Or yet bad combat skills, and great piloting, avoiding team mates, but end up losing at the beginning of round. Try put both together. Piloting and combat skills. Not easy with the team your in. Their is no formation. Everyone is scattered (but grouped together). The enemy can have bad tactics, and win over the best. So you lose rank, because of other players mistakes. You can be the best, helping the team, lose round and still lose rank. So when your trying, your screaming, upset, your heart rate is up, yelling, and then those who call out "Stupid team", even if your on a great team. You can lead command, and half your team does not follow instructions. Just not fair at all. Games, sims are suppose to be fun, enjoyable, but this one (like FPS), end up being unhealthy, stressful. Specially for a guy who enjoys the Battletech franchise and hopes to be in a Mech and in a battlefield. Some things need to change for the better, not to the hospital.

Then stand with me, and lobby for bringing back 8v8 for Solo-Q. You can make much better contribution in 8v8.

[PurpleNinja]

Tier is proof of playtime.
Also, the complaints are the same on all tiers.

[Mystere]

nehebkau, on 21 July 2017 - 08:46 AM, said:

IMHO PGI purposely rewards people who are "Play-time Whales".

And that's fine, especially for the "Play-time Whales".

For the rest, just ignore it. You're going to have more fun doing so, hopefully anyway.

nehebkau, on 21 July 2017 - 10:29 AM, said:

PGI just needs to stop being lazy and actually use ALL the pilot stats that they have to create a true metric of pilots skill. Damage done, kdr, accuracy, wins, friendly fire etc. etc.-- there is so much data available that you could create a pretty accurate picture of a pilot's skill.

The problem is that almost all of these stats can be gamed, with the exception of one -- wins. As such, wins should be the only determining factor used.

Brain Cancer, on 21 July 2017 - 11:06 AM, said:

The sad thing is, the tier system might actually work decently if higher tiers simply required more match score to go up/hold even/avoid losing in the PSR system.

Keep the current stuff as T5-T4, then steadily and ruthlessly increase the requirements for 3,2,and 1. T1 should be a constant, extraordinary effort to maintain in an actual ranking system, vs. the exp bar we have now.

There is no point on a more complicated system if there are not enough players available at any given time, players get furious when forced to wait, and the release valves are almost always wide open.

Just junk the system and go completely random on everything -- matchmaking, game modes, maps.

Edited by Mystere, 22 July 2017 - 04:58 AM.

[Brain Cancer]

Mystere, on 22 July 2017 - 04:49 AM, said:

There is no point on a more complicated system if there are not enough players available at any given time, players get furious when forced to wait, and the release valves are almost always wide open.

Just junk the system and go completely random on everything -- matchmaking, game modes, maps.

You have to actually have a foundation laid down for the hope of more players, or you're literally building the game to die.

Safety valves will work the same, after all- but at least we can then say there's a system that divides players on how much match score they're contributing to the team.

[Asym]

Greetings!

First, this isn't a game; it's a business.... And, having said that, business = work and work = stress..... (I'm retired, I know.)

Second, complicated games are expensive to maintain and keep an average players interest.... SO, less complication = larger populations which, when you follow that logic means the quality of the game starts to de-evolve into simplier gameplay models, which, boosts sales.

Third, the reason this is so frustrating is that this "game" is the grandchild of other really neat games....... SO, are we MW culturally competant? (No...........purist vs. players of games....)

Last, PGI MUST cater to the audience where the actual sales are generated from; period. So, in those terms, my frustration and the OP frustration aren't relevant..... PGI's focus is on who buys what..... Assault sales vs. Medium/Heavy/Light sales.

The "game" is frustrating because we all have unique expectations..... I've almost quit several times in the SIX MONTHS I've been here..... Geeze, my entire host team LEFT MWO after the skill tree change because they saw the proverbial "writing on the wall" and may the CHOICE not to be frustrated or stresssed. Micro-sale paradigms all carter to sales volume and those who buy win and, in winning, the culture moves in that direction. So, for now, ALL of you brawlers rejoice!!! CW is the beginning of a new MWO era and if you love MWO, strap in Sparkey, it's gonna be a bumpy ride.....

[General Solo]

Switch off the Tier thing in the UI and Play

Play Higher Tiers long enough and some of it rubs off on you, if you can put up with the pain while that's happening.

Perhaps the Tier system ain't great with the skill thingie, but I do know that I don't know any Tier 4 and 5 pilots that should be in Tier1.

So its sorta working

(When playa numbers allow it to work better)

Edited by OZHomerOZ, 22 July 2017 - 08:21 AM.

[Electroflameageddon]

I'm Tier 4 and climbing.

I've been in many drops with Tier 1 players. The MM dropped me in to matches where I recognized names of people who I know are Tier 1 and 2. This is not late at night, but during peak play time.

Sometimes I was clubbed, sometimes I clubbed. It had more to do with how the team played than how well each individual played. Team play is the only way you will win in this game.

This last event my bar climbed rapidly. Tier is mostly based on the damage that you do. Do less than 430 damage and lose, drop tier points.

My personal feeling is that the weight of your mech should be factored in. I can consistently pull down around 400 to 500 damage in a heavy. I have people in my unit that can do that in a Locust. I'm more impressed with that, especially when I see them pull 800+ damage consistently in a Locust. That is 40 times the weight they are bringing to the party.

Yet when I ask them what their PSR is, they say that they are either Tier 2 or 3. Really? You are fielding a walking eggshell into a fire fight armed with peashooters and somehow wrecking. That takes some mad skills.

I say I have a decent game with a mech if I manage to 5 times the damage of the weight I'm bringing in. If I manage to do 7 to 10 times the damage, I'm having a good game. More than 10, I'm doing great. Some of my fun matches are when I'm in a light and pull down 350 to 500 damage. But, since the team lost, I've dropped tier because I didn't hit that magic 430, even though I had 2 to 3 kills, UAV detects, protected lights, etc.

[Baba Yogi]

El Bandito, on 22 July 2017 - 04:44 AM, said:

Then stand with me, and lobby for bringing back 8v8 for Solo-Q. You can make much better contribution in 8v8.

You know El bandito, if you are seriously going to lobby for 8v8 only QP, i'll add my voice to yours. I'm sure alot of people would as well.

Edited by Lordhammer, 22 July 2017 - 08:35 AM.

[El Bandito]

Lordhammer, on 22 July 2017 - 08:35 AM, said:

You know El bandito, if you are seriously going to lobby for 8v8 only QP, i'll add my voice to yours. I'm sure alot of people would as well.

I'll start a petition in the Feature Suggestion forums. Meanwhile I suggest you to tweet Russ and tell him how 8v8 benefits TTK, MM, and FPS. https://twitter.com/russ_bullock

Edited by El Bandito, 22 July 2017 - 09:28 AM.

[Skrapha]

Turn of the frontend so you don't see it at the top of the screen with that annoying progress bar, and play for fun. much better.

[Kin3ticX]

El Bandito, on 22 July 2017 - 04:44 AM, said:

Then stand with me, and lobby for bringing back 8v8 for Solo-Q. You can make much better contribution in 8v8.

but 8 isnt 3 lances making a company anymore

muh lore

[El Bandito]

Kin3ticX, on 22 July 2017 - 11:32 AM, said:

but 8 isnt 3 lances making a company anymore

muh lore

We got Clanners using lance structure and nerfed tech. I don't think that particular part of lore is very important.

Vote for it here: https://mwomercs.com...for-solo-queue/

Edited by El Bandito, 22 July 2017 - 11:36 AM.

[Mystere]

Brain Cancer, on 22 July 2017 - 06:16 AM, said:

Safety valves will work the same, after all- but at least we can then say there's a system that divides players on how much match score they're contributing to the team.

Match score is the easiest of them all to game simply because almost everything that score depends on can be gamed.

So I am still for using wins as the only determining factor.

[Dryderian]

Well when I was at the end of Tier 4 just about reaching Tier 3 I started to take the lead on voice chat in QPs.

After a while you know what is happening on a specififc map, what the ususal approaches of the enemy team are, were you usually start to meet the enemy force. You also start to notice if your team will probably fail looking at the movement of your team mates or if they are experienced and know what to do on a map and move together. So when I felt unsure about the teamwork I started to lead, first with hints where to go or a plan how to engage the enemy, later I was leading from the start after saying hello and if nobody else would take the cup.

I did lead over 300+ matches with a very good success rate in winning, when the team was following. I am not a pro and not a good commander, but in most cases it did work out very well.

This suddenly stopped when I reached Tier 2, people stopped following as a team, people were challenging my command with joke comments or insults or counter arguments, and when I said, lead if you like, the guy would just fall silent, while the team was spread up because of two different approaches how to engage the enemy and had no attack formation.

Imo looking at team work, the lower tiers are quite more willing to team up and work together than the higher tiers 1 and 2.

In the end I just got sick of seeing 11 Achilles impersonations thinking they are the pros , thinking each of them will roll over the enemy raging on voice chat when they got killed or the lay back guys who just stay out of the figfht, to chime in when the enemy is softenend up and calling out noobs if the fighting and dying people did not do enough damage for them to roll over the enemy or 6 snipers thinking they take out the enemy team on a map each alone in a different location...needless to say I took a break from the game for some time.

GuardDogg like in the GW2 GuardDogg ?

Edited by Dryderian, 22 July 2017 - 06:30 PM.

[General Solo]

8v8 might make it easier for the match maker as well, less players to fill the bucket.

Edited by OZHomerOZ, 22 July 2017 - 09:25 PM.

[Dee Eight]

Ssamout, on 21 July 2017 - 08:45 AM, said:

In solo QP I guess MM tries to match tiers something like this:

tier 5 matches have tiers 5-3
tier 4 matches have tiers 5-2
tier 3 matches have them all
tier 2 matches have tiers 4-1
tier 1 matches have tiers 3-1

It doesnt always feel like that though.

Actually it matches plus or minus 3 tiers. This means that 2 thru 4 can play with anybody.

[General Solo]

Dryderian, on 22 July 2017 - 05:25 PM, said:

Well when I was at the end of Tier 4 just about reaching Tier 3 I started to take the lead on voice chat in QPs.

After a while you know what is happening on a specififc map, what the ususal approaches of the enemy team are, were you usually start to meet the enemy force. You also start to notice if your team will probably fail looking at the movement of your team mates or if they are experienced and know what to do on a map and move together. So when I felt unsure about the teamwork I started to lead, first with hints where to go or a plan how to engage the enemy, later I was leading from the start after saying hello and if nobody else would take the cup.

I did lead over 300+ matches with a very good success rate in winning, when the team was following. I am not a pro and not a good commander, but in most cases it did work out very well.

This suddenly stopped when I reached Tier 2, people stopped following as a team, people were challenging my command with joke comments or insults or counter arguments, and when I said, lead if you like, the guy would just fall silent, while the team was spread up because of two different approaches how to engage the enemy and had no attack formation.

Imo looking at team work, the lower tiers are quite more willing to team up and work together than the higher tiers 1 and 2.

In the end I just got sick of seeing 11 Achilles impersonations thinking they are the pros , thinking each of them will roll over the enemy raging on voice chat when they got killed or the lay back guys who just stay out of the figfht, to chime in when the enemy is softenend up and calling out noobs if the fighting and dying people did not do enough damage for them to roll over the enemy or 6 snipers thinking they take out the enemy team on a map each alone in a different location...needless to say I took a break from the game for some time.

GuardDogg like in the GW2 GuardDogg ?

Could be the Higher Tiers use different tactics to the ones used in the lower tiers, so perhaps they didn't like your plan a lot.

They can be a bit snobby if your an unknown to them.
But once to make your self known at those tiers, they 'll follow a good idea like anyone.
No Guarantees thou, so you need a (personal) plan for that as well.

The higher tiers have a plan for everything
Or they wing it like a casual.

Edited by OZHomerOZ, 22 July 2017 - 09:36 PM.

[Aim64C]

OZHomerOZ, on 22 July 2017 - 09:34 PM, said:

Could be the Higher Tiers use different tactics to the ones used in the lower tiers, so perhaps they didn't like your plan a lot.

They can be a bit snobby if your an unknown to them.
But once to make your self known at those tiers, they 'll follow a good idea like anyone.
No Guarantees thou, so you need a (personal) plan for that as well.

The higher tiers have a plan for everything
Or they wing it like a casual.

This isn't necessarily my experience.

A higher percentage of the T2 and T1 players really seem to think two things - either that the team should follow them, or that their playstyle allows them to take 'liberties' in following the plan.

It's not always egotism that underwrites it. Myself, I will back out of a push because I don't get the sense I have a team behind or beside me - when there was one or two other guys there who I under-estimated. We've all had those times where we tried to follow a plan and were only doing it by ourselves... and that can make us a little squeamish.

Moving from T3 to T2, I noticed a lot more players independently steaming, going OFP. In some cases - it's not really a big deal. Lights and fast mediums should fan out just a bit to give some overlapping fields of fire that help defeat cover. Other times... it's a sign of players who will get blown up by 4 enemy 'mechs then rage about the team sucking.

Ideally, you do want 'mechs to spread out a bit. They need room to maneuver and you don't want to get pinned down because everyone is on top of each other and no one can poke out without being bombarded by half the enemy team. Everyone should be in positions where they can easily and quickly move to support one of the flanks - or know when to fall back to form a riposte. But this is essentially a form of maneuver warfare, and good luck getting that set up without an organized group... and I haven't really seen anything worthwhile in this game to do more than quick play, so... meh.

If groups were part of faction warfare, and there were more players... but... the game is so one dimensional that it's more just a stompy robot arena shooter. Only real thing you need to know is target the big things first and crush them. Swing both the number and tonnage advantage so heavily in your favor that it's almost impossible for the team to lose.

[The Unstoppable Puggernaut]

I've clicked the link and voted for 8 vs 8. I find it a bit odd so many people voted against the idea. I find too many mechs bumping into each other especially on city maps (which is most of them) gets annoying.

Also it's hopefully less people to carry.

[Rusharn]

I personally like the 12 vs 12 because it lessens the blow of a disconnect, or if one or two players derp out fast you still have a chance of pulling through. Where in the 8 vs 8, one loss to a mistake or a disconnect has a bigger impact on the game and can almost cost you the match right out, much less if you ever fall more than two kills behind.

The high in the tiers I have gone the wider range of outcomes I have seen in game play. Mostly I see more dynamic play but it requires you to really be paying attention to the mini map and judging the flow of the battle. I see more random teams at higher level tiers pulling off rapid strike or fast flanking maneuvers that are beautiful. I personally have had a lot more enjoyment when I reached tier two then when I was at the lower tiers.

However there are some special tier eon pilots that suffer from a severe narcissism that can really sour a match, especially if they lose. Sometimes it was just the other team performed better overall, other times the other team pulled off an awesome maneuver. But to those narcissists its always their other team members faults, not that the other team just played better or that they themselves may have made a tactical mistake. Ever worse are those tier one pilots that heavily up gun their mechs while stripping armor and use their entire team as a meat shield while racking up kills but then whine when the meat shield doesn't follow "orders" to move to protect them, or doesn't death ball up so they can hide in the back.