96 replies to this topic

[Missile Magic]

I hear all this - They're only good vs noobs and potatoes! Torso Twist etc etc etc....

But have you actually specced someone exploiting Rotary ac5s? I urge you to do so and tell me it isn't broken.

[The6thMessenger]

Zergling, on 25 July 2017 - 01:53 AM, said:

RACs are so terrible you don't need any specific tactics to beat them; the normal meta tactics of poking in and out of cover beats them hilariously easily.

Pretty much the only thing RACs are 'ok' against is Stare Warriors; the potatoes that don't spread damage at all, just let enemy mechs focus all their damage into the CT.

To be fair, that's why they actually work. Because not 100% of the players in the game actually play with proper etiquette. Hell, even I make mistakes. Granted balance by potato should never be done, but that is what is happening.

Yes poking beats it, but just as SRMs needing to get closer to brawl, LRMs to get a decent ange, RAC users just need enough skill (and a lot of luck) to get good and safe facetime. The RAC5 as the math says actually have good upfront damage, the RAC2 on the other hand is anemic. Whether the RAC5 has enough damage to outweigh the disadvantages of it's use, we're on our own opinions on that -- i'm okay with the damage output personally, but not the inconsistency, likewise the velocity.

If we just buff it into relevance willy-nilly say upping the damage MOAR, it wouldn't help cause its just making more useful at it's niche when it could be more useful at most cases instead. Best make it more usable and more consistent.

Stottie, on 25 July 2017 - 02:31 AM, said:

I hear all this - They're only good vs noobs and potatoes! Torso Twist etc etc etc....

But have you actually specced someone exploiting Rotary ac5s? I urge you to do so and tell me it isn't broken.

Riiight.

Define "exploiting", and explain to us how would you "exploit" it. Cause honestly, i don't even know how to respond to that.

Edited by The6thMessenger, 25 July 2017 - 02:46 AM.

[Zergling]

Stottie, on 25 July 2017 - 02:31 AM, said:

I hear all this - They're only good vs noobs and potatoes! Torso Twist etc etc etc....

But have you actually specced someone exploiting Rotary ac5s? I urge you to do so and tell me it isn't broken.

I've actually used them a few times, and fought against people boating them even more times.

They feel underwhelming when I use them, and hilariously easy to beat when I fight against them.

[Templar Dane]

The6thMessenger, on 25 July 2017 - 02:40 AM, said:

Define "exploiting", and explain to us how would you "exploit" it. Cause honestly, i don't even know how to respond to that.

A dude last night was complaining about the same exact thing after I killed him..........with quad UAC2s.

[Missile Magic]

ex|ploit




VERB
exploiting (present participle)

• 
  
  
  make full use of and derive benefit from (a resource):
  [color="#767676"]"500 companies sprang up to exploit this new technology"[/color]
  
  synonyms: [color="#001ba0"]utilize[/color] · [color="#001ba0"]make use of[/color] · put to use · [color="#001ba0"]use[/color] · use to good advantage ·
  [More][/color]

????

Zergling, on 25 July 2017 - 02:47 AM, said:

I've actually used them a few times, and fought against people boating them even more times.

They feel underwhelming when I use them, and hilariously easy to beat when I fight against them.

Fair enough, hasn't been the case when I have seen them - assault lances getting minced by rotarys.

[The6thMessenger]

Templar Dane, on 25 July 2017 - 02:55 AM, said:

A dude last night was complaining about the same exact thing after I killed him..........with quad UAC2s.

I still don't understand. That sounds like the RAC user is weaker, yet the other guy says that it's stronger, or it seems stronger.

If it's against an RAC5, it's understandable to win over it via 4x UAC2, at least when no jam. The RAC5 has 10.92 DPS, whilst the 4x UAC2 has 11.12 DPS.

Stottie, on 25 July 2017 - 02:57 AM, said:

ex|ploit




VERB
exploiting (present participle)

• 
  
  
  
  make full use of and derive benefit from (a resource):
  [color=#767676]"500 companies sprang up to exploit this new technology"[/color]
  
  synonyms: [color=#001ba0]utilize[/color] · [color=#001ba0]make use of[/color] · put to use · [color=#001ba0]use[/color] · use to good advantage ·

????

So in that context, how it's used. So you are implying that RAC is in itself a weakness to be exploited? Or the RAC is exploiting some form of weakness? Or you were making a point that you can't exploit an RAC user?

What does "specced" mean?

[TWIAFU]

one punch bot, on 24 July 2017 - 06:49 AM, said:

ok maby it just has not dawned on me.
but how do you deal with ac5 rot. mechs?
they can just blast threw you with no care, and god forbid more than one person has them. they make just about every AC weapon useless by comparison.
has anyone found a setup that punishes these builds?

Best way to learn how to beat a mech, drop in it yourself.

So, go get your IS mech and some RAC and see for yourself it's strength and weakness.

[Missile Magic]

Put to good use? used to an advantage? specced - watched? If you're finished being finicky we could stay on topic?

Edited by Stottie, 25 July 2017 - 03:08 AM.

[TWIAFU]

Zergling, on 25 July 2017 - 01:53 AM, said:

RACs are so terrible you don't need any specific tactics to beat them; the normal meta tactics of poking in and out of cover beats them hilariously easily.

Pretty much the only thing RACs are 'ok' against is Stare Warriors; the potatoes that don't spread damage at all, just let enemy mechs focus all their damage into the CT.

Peek a boo is meta?!?!?!

LOL

[The6thMessenger]

TWIAFU, on 25 July 2017 - 03:08 AM, said:

Peek a boo is meta?!?!?!

LOL

Kind of, yes. Minimizing return fire, while maximizing damage. Thats the stuff. precisely why Gauss + PPC was prevalent.

Stottie, on 25 July 2017 - 03:08 AM, said:

Put to good use? used to an advantage? specced - watched? If you're finished being finicky we could stay on topic?

So you mean to say. I exploited the RAC5?

[Zergling]

Stottie, on 25 July 2017 - 03:00 AM, said:

ex|ploit




VERB
exploiting (present participle)

• 
  
  
  
  
  make full use of and derive benefit from (a resource):
  [color="#767676"]"500 companies sprang up to exploit this new technology"[/color]
  
  synonyms: [color="#001ba0"]utilize[/color] · [color="#001ba0"]make use of[/color] · put to use · [color="#001ba0"]use[/color] · use to good advantage ·
  [More][/color]

????

Exploit has a different meaning in gaming circles.

https://en.wikipedia...o_game_exploits
"In video games, an exploit is the use of a bug or glitches, game system, rates, hit boxes, or speed, etc. by a player to their advantage in a manner not intended by the game's designers.^[1]"

TWIAFU, on 25 July 2017 - 03:08 AM, said:

Peek a boo is meta?!?!?!

LOL

Shooting with short exposure times is meta.

[9thDeathscream]

I found the Rac5 useful as a secondary weapon. Great to exploit gaps in armour. Aside from that pretty mediocre. I think of it as an ultra heavy machine gun.

[MustrumRidcully]

As usual, cover is your friend.
As might be your allies. When a RAC user is shooting his weapon, he cannot torso twist or move into cover. So if you see a RAC user opening fire, you know it is vulnerable and can be easily focused on, unless it stops shooting. That's quite different form LRM rain, for example, where people can hit their from the relative safety of their own cover, or high damage alpha builds that just take one shot and then are gone into cover.

That doesn't help you that much when you're alone, since you're facing a lot of incoming damage. Try to get off your shot and get into cover, ideally moving sideways to him, so he has to change his lead, and while twisting, so he doesn't get to take out any vital hit locations easily. Once his gun is jammed up, he's obviously also vulnerable. Of course, a clever Rotary user will go back to cover then.

[Ngamok]

one punch bot, on 24 July 2017 - 06:49 AM, said:

ok maby it just has not dawned on me.
but how do you deal with ac5 rot. mechs?
they can just blast threw you with no care, and god forbid more than one person has them. they make just about every AC weapon useless by comparison.
has anyone found a setup that punishes these builds?

Took out one with my HBK-4G(F) last night. AC20 still scares them easily. It was a MAD 3R he had 2 RAC5s. If they start hitting you twist and turn and wait for them to finish their cycle and blast them. I was able to get 2 AC20 strikes and 2 strike of my 3 MLs on him to finish him off before he started the RACs again.

Edit: Running 2x RAC5s on my Enforcer and Bushwacker I can tell you that heat goes up fast by the end of the cycle and they will be close to 80 heat at the end, if they fire anything else, wait for the shutdown.

Edited by Ngamok, 25 July 2017 - 06:09 AM.

[ScrapIron Prime]

Move. You defeat a RAC armed mech by moving. Lights in particular are great at taking out mechs that depend on RAC and MRM systems, as you really have to train fire on people to do meaningful damage.

[Sucy Manbavaran]

Well i guess the real problem with RAC (if it's a problem) is the 3/4 mechs Behind the RAC user ><,
but 1V1 ... it's a pointless Weapon cause it's hot and you can spread (sound like every ClanWeapon this way)

[Wildstreak]

If you have a good team, someone can call out RAC users to be targeted since RAC needs a lot of stare time to really damage a target making them easy for allies to shoot.

[C4NC3R]

Aleski, on 25 July 2017 - 12:16 AM, said:

I usa high alpha pin point brawler since new tech.

Examples :
Dragon Flame with LFE300 + AC/20 + SNPPC
Marauder 3R with LFE325 + AC/20 + 2xSNPPC
Protector with LFE325 + Gauss + SNPPC + 2xASRM6

On the clan side, i have a Redline with 6xMPL, works like a charm too.

When you face a RAC/5 mech, go in range while using covers, when in range strike with high alpha and twist like a crazy. You will not die if play wisely. They are very hot and tend to jam or overheat in a brawl.

The light mechs are great against RAC too cause those weapons have bad velocity, so it's hard to focus on them. I use Grinner, Huggin, Ember, PB, Cheetah, Anansi : they work well if you run like a crazy.

BNC 3M or Annie 1E with 2xHPPC+3xLPL eat any dual-RAC carrier in two salvoes.

Edited by C4NC3R, 25 July 2017 - 07:09 AM.

[C4NC3R]

Ngamok, on 25 July 2017 - 06:07 AM, said:

Took out one with my HBK-4G(F) last night. AC20 still scares them easily. It was a MAD 3R he had 2 RAC5s. If they start hitting you twist and turn and wait for them to finish their cycle and blast them. I was able to get 2 AC20 strikes and 2 strike of my 3 MLs on him to finish him off before he started the RACs again.

Edit: Running 2x RAC5s on my Enforcer and Bushwacker I can tell you that heat goes up fast by the end of the cycle and they will be close to 80 heat at the end, if they fire anything else, wait for the shutdown.

Man, face the WHM-6R with 2xRAC5+6ML's... deadlier only TBR-A with 5xMPL+2xATM12. 100tons Annie goes down in seconds against them.

Edited by C4NC3R, 25 July 2017 - 07:24 AM.

[C4NC3R]

The6thMessenger, on 25 July 2017 - 03:11 AM, said:

Kind of, yes. Minimizing return fire, while maximizing damage. Thats the stuff. precisely why Gauss + PPC was prevalent.



So you mean to say. I exploited the RAC5?

Extreamly countered by any DUAL-HPPC welding.