52 replies to this topic

[Karl Streiger]

Jep Jorgensson, on 10 August 2017 - 02:20 PM, said:

That is basically what I said. Also, that was not a jab against you, it was against PGI for adding mechs in already crowded classes (anything IS right now) while starving other classes (like Clan lights and mediums).

Still missing a good IS mech that doesn't need heavy quirks to be on paar with the "best" clan mech of this weight class
of course with Uziel, Thanatos, Annihilator they are spamming IS mechs that are worth nothing.
Osiris and Night Star might be the first done right

hey you got your Cougar light clan mech isn't it total underwhelming

Edited by Karl Streiger, 10 August 2017 - 11:03 PM.

[The Basilisk]

Karl Streiger, on 10 August 2017 - 11:03 PM, said:

Still missing a good IS mech that doesn't need heavy quirks to be on paar with the "best" clan mech of this weight class
of course with Uziel, Thanatos, Annihilator they are spamming IS mechs that are worth nothing.
Osiris and Night Star might be the first done right

hey you got your Cougar light clan mech isn't it total underwhelming

Dear Karl...please visit me and my Anni in my Lobby this evening and let's talk about this "worth nothing" statement.

To further this discussion:
-- Well Clams got less Mechs than IS...Yes.

-- Omnis can be optimized more than IS due to exchangeable pods/hardpoints (but also got ironicaly less feeled diversity out of this since there are often only one or two competitive builds out of so many pod combinations)....Yes to this again.

-- Clams got the strongest mech in every weight class ACH, Huntsman, NightGyr, Marauder IIC....Yes true again.

So ... what mechs could successfully be added to the clan arsenal that would not be:

> Outright disapointing and a waste of dev time
> hillariously overpowered

Those are poor choices guys you first need to fill the gaps for IS.
Most IS mechs are iconic, sure and very stylish, but ultimately not played much.
Think of all the IS mediums you rarely see because they are redundant or utilize loadout concepts that do not work well in MWO.

Look at Quickplay in T1 and T2.
Want an fast heavy with high hardpoints and minimum frontal silhuette ? BAM Ebonjag.
Want to have a SRM splash fest ? BAM Maddog.
Want to play Jumpsniper and PPFLD? BAM NightGyr.
Want to be the ultimate squirrel? ACH is your friend.

With the new tech comming out this effect subsided a bit but it already grows again.
No new tech can make up for bad geometry idiotic hitboxes and the crippling lack of game mechanics that would make IS mech as cool as they are discribed in lore and rulebooks. (arms can not be elevated in humanoids, no hand to hand combat, no realy collisions and so on and do on)

[Karl Streiger]

The Basilisk, on 11 August 2017 - 12:50 AM, said:

Dear Karl...please visit me and my Anni in my Lobby this evening and let's talk about this "worth nothing" statement.

can we disable the quirks in the lobby?

[The Basilisk]

Karl Streiger, on 11 August 2017 - 12:57 AM, said:

can we disable the quirks in the lobby?

Sure if we also disable ghostheat ...

Karl this is not "make a wish" the mech is implemented at the moment as it is.
The perspective of it getting nerfed into oblivion eventually when it comes out for C-bills or shortly after is not beeing discussed here.

It has mindnumbing firepower and the armorquirks to use it.
Also it actually does spread dmg pretty well for an humanoid assault.
That is the situation as it is.

We all know why...KDK and Marauder IIC.

It is the same situation with the Clans/IS Mech balance.
No ammount of dicussion will change the fact that Clans got the better mechs and therefor no reason to bring more clan mechs that will stretch the gap further.

Edited by The Basilisk, 11 August 2017 - 01:19 AM.

[Karl Streiger]

The Basilisk, on 11 August 2017 - 01:11 AM, said:

Sure if we also disable ghostheat ...

Karl this is not "make a wish" the mech is implemented at the moment as it is.
The perspective of it getting nerfed into oblivion eventually when it comes out for C-bills or shortly after is not beeing discussed here.

It has mindnumbing firepower and the armorquirks to use it.
Also it actually does spread dmg pretty well for an humanoid assault.
That is the situation as it is.

We all know why...KDK and Marauder IIC.

It is the same situation with the Clans/IS Mech balance.
No ammount of dicussion will change the fact that Clans got the better mechs and therefor no reason to bring more clan mechs that will stretch the gap further.

no i simple ask for a mech whos stats and geometry is not so utterly broken that it is obviously that it need quirks (somehow PGI did think that the UZL is such a Mech)
good examples you only find currently within the clans - Marauder IIC, Huntsman and of course the Timber Wolf (some might object about its geometry)

the nightstar could become a bigger ebon jaguar - that is not bad - and the osiris is a smaller viper - (but both life and die with the 3d model) from the stats they are ok

Edited by Karl Streiger, 11 August 2017 - 02:41 AM.

[Mister Bob Dobalina]

Jep Jorgensson, on 10 August 2017 - 02:20 PM, said:

That is basically what I said. Also, that was not a jab against you, it was against PGI for adding mechs in already crowded classes (anything IS right now) while starving other classes (like Clan lights and mediums).

Indeed, they bled the Lights for so long. And if you look at all the classic pre-clan era novels, there is that tone that Lights and Mediums are in fact the working class of Mechs due to their larger avaliability and lower cost. Heavies were rarer and felt therefore much more dominant and Assaults felt like one in a million. Athough I reckon lights are not that favored in Clan toumans as they represent way less possibility to gain personal glory and fame, the ratio is way of. I was really surprised to see that the IS mediums outweight Clan Mediums by 2 to 1.

[Karl Streiger]

Thomster, on 11 August 2017 - 02:47 AM, said:

Indeed, they bled the Lights for so long. And if you look at all the classic pre-clan era novels, there is that tone that Lights and Mediums are in fact the working class of Mechs due to their larger avaliability and lower cost. Heavies were rarer and felt therefore much more dominant and Assaults felt like one in a million. Athough I reckon lights are not that favored in Clan toumans as they represent way less possibility to gain personal glory and fame, the ratio is way of. I was really surprised to see that the IS mediums outweight Clan Mediums by 2 to 1.

you could have this with different weight based match maker queues (Light <45t Medium <65t, Heavy)
So dropping with a vindicator might bring you into the top weight position of the light in the medium position in the meidum and in the last position in the heavy queue

This would also make "slow" combat Lights and Mediums more important because they trade weapons for speed (of course you need to disable the pinpoint convergence - otherwise the fast 6x1tbeamer with 120kph will always beat the 1x7t beamer with 80kph

.... but like so often i finish this topic with - not going to happen - time to do this is gone and never will come back

[The Basilisk]

Karl Streiger, on 11 August 2017 - 02:36 AM, said:

no i simple ask for a mech whos stats and geometry is not so utterly broken that it is obviously that it need quirks (somehow PGI did think that the UZL is such a Mech)
good examples you only find currently within the clans - Marauder IIC, Huntsman and of course the Timber Wolf (some might object about its geometry)

the nightstar could become a bigger ebon jaguar - that is not bad - and the osiris is a smaller viper - (but both life and die with the 3d model) from the stats they are ok

Well, you're right on that but honestly I do not think the Anni to be that broken in terms of hitboxes.
But yea, you're quite right concerning weapon placement and geometry issues.
All outright good mechs are clan. (No the Marauder is not good cause he can easiely be disarmed by taking out his AC hump.

[Hawk819]

Clans are in desperate need of Lights and Mediums. However, with the forthcoming Harmony Gold-diggers lawsuit, we can't count on getting any of the Classic Clan IIC design till this is resolved. It sucks. . . yea, I know.

Blame E-Harmony Gold-diggers!

We can get the other designs like the Commando IIC, Clint IIC, and there are still few designs left for OmniMechs.

The Mongrel/Grendel, Black Lanner, Fire Falcon, Fire Moth/Dasher, Battle Cobra, Piranha, Hellion, Phantom, Pouncer.

PGI, please, by request of the Community, please add Clan `Mechs further on into the game. Lights and Mediums only please.

Thank you.

Edited by Hawk819, 11 August 2017 - 10:00 AM.

[Burning2nd]

the introduction of clan mechs was a problem right in it self.. with the armor weight issue...

This goes back 3 years or so...

they should focus on ingame interaction more then sellable content

[KursedVixen]

Thomster, on 11 August 2017 - 02:47 AM, said:

Indeed, they bled the Lights for so long. And if you look at all the classic pre-clan era novels, there is that tone that Lights and Mediums are in fact the working class of Mechs due to their larger avaliability and lower cost. Heavies were rarer and felt therefore much more dominant and Assaults felt like one in a million. Athough I reckon lights are not that favored in Clan toumans as they represent way less possibility to gain personal glory and fame, the ratio is way of. I was really surprised to see that the IS mediums outweight Clan Mediums by 2 to 1.

Actually killing a bigger mech in a light brings more personal glory than doing the opposite, but it's also down to what is available for a clan warrior...


and I do agree, Burning the clans seemed to have been brought in just for a money maker, then they take all your fancy stuff away. My poor Dire wolves.

Edited by KursedVixen, 11 August 2017 - 09:40 PM.

[Nean]

KursedVixen, on 11 August 2017 - 09:38 PM, said:

Actually killing a bigger mech in a light brings more personal glory than doing the opposite, but it's also down to what is available for a clan warrior...


and I do agree, Burning the clans seemed to have been brought in just for a money maker, then they take all your fancy stuff away. My poor Dire wolves.

Honestly I don't know what you're talking about with the dires. If you come around a corner and find one, you ded. The only time it isn't viable is when it has a stupid build on it. I'm talking all medium pulse lasers and lrms. It's the goddamn mech with the most firepower on it, period. People just don't use it like that.

[TheFallOfTheReaper]

One small point, 9/10 people ignore the 8/8 quirks and just go with meta cheese ******** for omnis. It's been years since I saw any intelligent/unique builds. It's always the same, erll spamm for days, dakka pures, boom ravens....ad infinitum, but nothing truly "unique" well except that hilarity I saw the other day, an atlas loyalty with a lrm 5/10/15/20, so eyebleaching I couldn't stop spectating, and sadly he wasn't "that" guy in the back in his lrmatlas, he was up front. He ended up carrying and I only noticed it after the fact, glad I held my tounge, but still, the "meta" nonsense is only propogated by "cheeseguilds". Be an individual not the collective :3, this isn't the borg :3

And @thom
Math the forum trolls worst nightmare, well thought out discussion glad to see both sides can be relatively civil for once :3

Edited by ShadowHimself, 04 September 2017 - 04:54 PM.