112 replies to this topic

[Snazzy Dragon]

Jman5, on 06 August 2017 - 03:50 PM, said:

Sloths: Players who move so inexplicably slow around the map that you need a calendar to mark their progress.

An "S" is a straighter line than the path your slow @ss is taking to to reach the group.

lrm 120 stalker locks pls

[RussianWolf]

Zergling, on 08 August 2017 - 09:09 PM, said:

I haven't seen any evidence that the matchmaker works as you describe.

Given the way my W/L crashed when I went from Tier 2 to Tier 1, it seems there is a strong PSR Tier averaging effect going on. Other players have reported the same effect; personal performance doesn't change much, but W/L drops drastically.

I think this is the most recent thread on it from PGI.

https://mwomercs.com...ng-q-and-tiers/

[Zergling]

RussianWolf, on 09 August 2017 - 06:07 AM, said:

I think this is the most recent thread on it from PGI.

https://mwomercs.com...ng-q-and-tiers/

That doesn't say the game doesn't use any sort of PSR averaging.

And the matchmaker actually doesn't separate PSR Tiers like PGI describes; Tier 5s do get matched with Tier 1s; people have confirmed it, and I've seen it for myself too.

Edited by Zergling, 09 August 2017 - 06:47 AM.

[PyckenZot]

Racerxintegra2k, on 06 August 2017 - 06:51 AM, said:

I'm tired of seeing 3-4 people on my team EVERY match doing the forehead slapping idiotic things. I understand people need to learn but why are they learning with players that know better ??? We need a kids table and fast so the adults can have dinner in peace.

[RussianWolf]

Zergling, on 09 August 2017 - 06:46 AM, said:

That doesn't say the game doesn't use any sort of PSR averaging.

And the matchmaker actually doesn't separate PSR Tiers like PGI describes; Tier 5s do get matched with Tier 1s; people have confirmed it, and I've seen it for myself too.

You said pure random would provide you with less likelihood of "bad" players over what they do now because they average PSR ratings.

PGI as of Jan 14th has said once again that T1s and T5s NEVER see each other in Solo queue.

So a pure random MM would INCREASE your likelihood of being in a match with a "bad" T5 player.

What I described above will actually get a rough average although it is unintentional. If I start at T2 and get 17 players, then spread to T1 and T3 and fill the rest, they will be pretty close. But that is not like saying a T1 is placed on a team with a T5 to get to a T3 average.


Since Jan 14th? Prove it.

[Zergling]

RussianWolf, on 09 August 2017 - 08:04 AM, said:

You said pure random would provide you with less likelihood of "bad" players over what they do now because they average PSR ratings.

PGI as of Jan 14th has said once again that T1s and T5s NEVER see each other in Solo queue.

So a pure random MM would INCREASE your likelihood of being in a match with a "bad" T5 player.

What I described above will actually get a rough average although it is unintentional. If I start at T2 and get 17 players, then spread to T1 and T3 and fill the rest, they will be pretty close. But that is not like saying a T1 is placed on a team with a T5 to get to a T3 average.


Since Jan 14th? Prove it.

There have been threads where people have discussed it and proved it though, with screenshots showing they were in the same battle, with the players involved showing Tier 1 and 5.
Those threads conclusively proved that PGI was wrong about the matchmaker not stopping low tiers from being in the same battle as high tiers; after being repeatedly proven. IIRC, after being repeatedly proven wrong about it, PGI admitted all tiers could be in the same battle, if the matchmaker took long enough to fill a battle (exactly how long is unknown, and PGI apparently adjusts it from time to time).

I can't post proof of the players in my own battles being Tier 5 without breaking name and shame rules, but when I looked at their leaderboard stats they had many thousands of battles with sub-150 average matchscore and which means they were definitely Tier 5 due to how PSR works.

Edited by Zergling, 09 August 2017 - 09:21 AM.

[RussianWolf]

Zergling, on 09 August 2017 - 09:19 AM, said:

There have been threads where people have discussed it and proved it though, with screenshots showing they were in the same battle, with the players involved showing Tier 1 and 5.
Those threads conclusively proved that PGI was wrong about the matchmaker not stopping low tiers from being in the same battle as high tiers; after being repeatedly proven. IIRC, after being repeatedly proven wrong about it, PGI admitted all tiers could be in the same battle, if the matchmaker took long enough to fill a battle (exactly how long is unknown, and PGI apparently adjusts it from time to time).

I can't post proof of the players in my own battles being Tier 5 without breaking name and shame rules, but when I looked at their leaderboard stats they had many thousands of battles with sub-150 average matchscore and which means they were definitely Tier 5 due to how PSR works.

link to any thread showing this since Jan 14th?

[Zergling]

RussianWolf, on 09 August 2017 - 09:25 AM, said:

link to any thread showing this since Jan 14th?

Dunno, I don't have links to the specific threads and finding something like that would be total needle in the haystack to find, but it did happen.


After I hit Tier 1 in (late) February this year, I ran the stats of every player in two of my next battles as Tier 1, and at least one of the players was a definite Tier 5:

Here's the one the one with the worst stats:
Season 8 / February = 406 battles, 0.72 W/L, 128 average Match Score
Season 7 / January = 363 battles, 0.67 W/L, 153 average Match Score
Season 6 / December = 208 battles, 0.74 W/L, 145 average Match Score

That is more than enough battles to cause a large PSR Tier drop; that guy had to have been Tier 5.


Another player:
Season 8 = 630 battles, 0.77 W/L, 166 average Match Score
Season 7 = 187 battles, 1.10 W/L, 208 average Match Score
No battles before Season 7

The Season 7 battles probably would have caused an increase PSR, although unlikely enough to cause a Tier increase. The Season 8 battles would have caused a large drop.
Not as confident this guy was Tier 5 as the previous one, although I think it is still probable. If he wasn't, he would have been Tier 4 for sure... and I ran into this guy in both battles, which in unusual given Tier 1s are only rarely supposed to encounter Tier 4s (and the matchmaker time definitely wasn't 4.5 minutes or more either).


Another:
Season 8 = 128 battles, 1.03 W/L, 150 average Match Score
Season 7 = 157 battles, 0.93 W/L, 171 average Match Score
Season 6 = 187 battles, 0.65 W/L, 150 average Match Score

Like the previous player, I'm not 100% certain this guy was Tier 5; he might have been Tier 4.

Edited by Zergling, 09 August 2017 - 10:23 AM.

[RussianWolf]

Zergling, on 09 August 2017 - 10:23 AM, said:

Dunno, I don't have links to the specific threads and finding something like that would be total needle in the haystack to find, but it did happen.


After I hit Tier 1 in (late) February this year, I ran the stats of every player in two of my next battles as Tier 1, and at least one of the players was a definite Tier 5:

Here's the one the one with the worst stats:
Season 8 / February = 406 battles, 0.72 W/L, 128 average Match Score
Season 7 / January = 363 battles, 0.67 W/L, 153 average Match Score
Season 6 / December = 208 battles, 0.74 W/L, 145 average Match Score

That is more than enough battles to cause a large PSR Tier drop; that guy had to have been Tier 5.


Another player:
Season 8 = 630 battles, 0.77 W/L, 166 average Match Score
Season 7 = 187 battles, 1.10 W/L, 208 average Match Score
No battles before Season 7

The Season 7 battles probably would have caused an increase PSR, although unlikely enough to cause a Tier increase. The Season 8 battles would have caused a large drop.
Not as confident this guy was Tier 5 as the previous one, although I think it is still probable. If he wasn't, he would have been Tier 4 for sure... and I ran into this guy in both battles, which in unusual given Tier 1s are only rarely supposed to encounter Tier 4s (and the matchmaker time definitely wasn't 4.5 minutes or more either).


Another:
Season 8 = 128 battles, 1.03 W/L, 150 average Match Score
Season 7 = 157 battles, 0.93 W/L, 171 average Match Score
Season 6 = 187 battles, 0.65 W/L, 150 average Match Score

Like the previous player, I'm not 100% certain this guy was Tier 5; he might have been Tier 4.

Nah, I think you underestimate things.

I had an average match score of 181? and 184? in seasons 1 and 2 and dropped to 154? in Season 3 when I stopped playing. Yet I was steadily moving UP in Tier 3. And people I've matched with would rarely call me a "bad" player (although there was a couple that got upset that I didn't follow them up tryhard mountain for the same old same old match on Alpine)

Wins/Losses are more about luck of the draw since its almost guaranteed that 50% lose and 50% win (almost because of the occasional tie). 1 person is rarely a "cause" for a loss. Usually victory being the overall team that worked better together (communication or just reacting to each others moves).

[LowSubmarino]

Its not about someone being not as experienced or overheating a bit more often or not having perfect loadouts or not having good aim.

Its about being completly braindead which I cannot ever respect or accept.

I just cant.

And many ppl play brainlessly to and extent that its basically impossible for them to be real humans.

Which is why I have come to the conclusion that a ginormous portion of mwo players are in fact no homosapiens but instead some other life form or bots from the very first generations of computers that were created prolly almost or more than half a century ago.

They do completly braindead stuff.

I jsut cant respect anybody that instamelts running ahead of team in light mech and then just melting after 30 seconds.

Who can respect such a person or bot or animal. Its just weak.

[Zergling]

RussianWolf, on 09 August 2017 - 11:56 AM, said:

Nah, I think you underestimate things.

I had an average match score of 181? and 184? in seasons 1 and 2 and dropped to 154? in Season 3 when I stopped playing. Yet I was steadily moving UP in Tier 3. And people I've matched with would rarely call me a "bad" player (although there was a couple that got upset that I didn't follow them up tryhard mountain for the same old same old match on Alpine)

Wins/Losses are more about luck of the draw since its almost guaranteed that 50% lose and 50% win (almost because of the occasional tie). 1 person is rarely a "cause" for a loss. Usually victory being the overall team that worked better together (communication or just reacting to each others moves).

You had a W/L over 1.00 in Season 1 and 2, which is why you were going up in PSR despite sub-200 matchscore.
And you only played 38 battles in Season 3, which isn't enough to make significant difference to PSR.

With the first player that had W/L well below 1.00 for many hundreds of battles, along with around 150 or less average Match Score? That'd cause a big drop in PSR; that guy was definitely Tier 5.

Edited by Zergling, 09 August 2017 - 12:05 PM.

[RussianWolf]

Zergling, on 09 August 2017 - 12:04 PM, said:

You had a W/L over 1.00 in Season 1 and 2, which is why you were going up in PSR despite sub-200 matchscore.
And you only played 38 battles in Season 3, which isn't enough to make significant difference to PSR.

With the first player that had W/L well below 1.00 for many hundreds of battles, along with around 150 or less average Match Score? That'd cause a big drop in PSR; that guy was definitely Tier 5.

You THINK it should. You THINK he must be...

Took me two seconds to figure out his name, should I message him and ask?

Edited by RussianWolf, 09 August 2017 - 12:18 PM.

[Humpday]

Man I don't know whats going on, but the MM literally hates my guts. I must have ran 10-12 last night with only like 1-2 wins, scoring in the 400-1100 range. If i had to estimate, I was averaging about 500 damage per bout, if not more.

Still no dice.

I think whats different now, as opposed to when i first started to play and had decent stats, I was on the mic much much more...but lately, just really not wanted to talk, just want to play.

I dunno, but its very frustrating pugging whilst consistently putting up big numbers, but in the end to just lose...which in turns makes me "try harder" which leads to mistakes(over committing to kills).

The thing is, if I switch to group, well now you're stuck with tonnage restrictions and everyone right now wants to play with their new toys, so you basically have to wait in line to play your Assault mech.

I dunno, just as many have said before, if there is a lose, there is someone winning. I just don't get how keep getting thrown on the losing side. I don't know how many games I threw up ~700dmg, and i'm talking a legit, front to back fighting, no hiding, score...but to still lose the fight by a good margin.

I put up 3 kills and 1100 with my Anni one match, and still...loss.

Its rather strange.

[Tarl Cabot]

Zergling, on 09 August 2017 - 06:46 AM, said:

That doesn't say the game doesn't use any sort of PSR averaging.

And the matchmaker actually doesn't separate PSR Tiers like PGI describes; Tier 5s do get matched with Tier 1s; people have confirmed it, and I've seen it for myself too.

We actually do not know the exact parameters PGI has in place. They simply said T1 and T5 should not group together but is that taken from the viewpoint that the seeded player is either T1 or T3, that at the time there were a massive amount of T3 in play that it would not go to the extremes? Remember, PGI said a seeded T3 can have a T1 or T5. It is specifics like this that PGI has NOT addressed.

Sorry, I am not sure why no one else is asking these type of questions since there can be many loopholes we the players are not aware of. Again, and sorry PGI, but this is PGI.

Edited by Tarl Cabot, 09 August 2017 - 02:20 PM.

[Knuckles OTool]

I watched an assault self destruct within 1 min of the start tonight with 10 damage done. Another assault, the annihilator in that group, was a lrm boat. I sometimes think people are just messing with us. Its a game and all and sometimes people care way less than you think they should.

Edited by Knuckles OTool, 09 August 2017 - 03:03 PM.

[InfinityBall]

Knuckles OTool, on 09 August 2017 - 03:01 PM, said:

I watched an assault self destruct within 1 min of the start tonight with 10 damage done. Another assault, the annihilator in that group, was a lrm boat. I sometimes think people are just messing with us. Its a game and all and sometimes people care way less than you think they should.

My first game this morning was in an Atlas and when I dropped... "Holy *bleep*, how drunk was I when I made that loadout?"

Yep, I'm pretty sure I didn't care much when I put that crap on those hardpoints

[Mystere]

Knuckles OTool, on 09 August 2017 - 03:01 PM, said:

Its a game and all and sometimes people care way less than you think they should.

WUT? MWO is serious business and a world-class eSport, heretic!!!

Edited by Mystere, 09 August 2017 - 04:06 PM.

[Racerxintegra2k]

Humpday, on 09 August 2017 - 12:29 PM, said:

Man I don't know whats going on, but the MM literally hates my guts. I must have ran 10-12 last night with only like 1-2 wins, scoring in the 400-1100 range. If i had to estimate, I was averaging about 500 damage per bout, if not more.

Still no dice.

I think whats different now, as opposed to when i first started to play and had decent stats, I was on the mic much much more...but lately, just really not wanted to talk, just want to play.

I dunno, but its very frustrating pugging whilst consistently putting up big numbers, but in the end to just lose...which in turns makes me "try harder" which leads to mistakes(over committing to kills).

The thing is, if I switch to group, well now you're stuck with tonnage restrictions and everyone right now wants to play with their new toys, so you basically have to wait in line to play your Assault mech.

I dunno, just as many have said before, if there is a lose, there is someone winning. I just don't get how keep getting thrown on the losing side. I don't know how many games I threw up ~700dmg, and i'm talking a legit, front to back fighting, no hiding, score...but to still lose the fight by a good margin.

I put up 3 kills and 1100 with my Anni one match, and still...loss.

Its rather strange.

This has been my experience for the last couple months as well. Its basically boiled down to not being fun anymore. Time to take a break for me.

[Fox With A Shotgun]

Racerxintegra2k, on 10 August 2017 - 03:08 AM, said:

This has been my experience for the last couple months as well. Its basically boiled down to not being fun anymore. Time to take a break for me.

Might join you there. Just came out of a match where charlie lance was calling for help, bravo were chasing after alpha (on a scouting run). Alpha comes back, Bravo apparently has inertia problems and runs off in the direction that Alpha just came back from...and by the time Alpha reaches Charlie, Charlie turns around and flees in the face of an oncoming enemy deathball, leaving Alpha to die to cover their pathetic retreat.

-flips table-.

[Almond Brown]

Zergling, on 07 August 2017 - 10:28 AM, said:

Your stats suggest you are Tier 5 and still performing poorly, which means a particularly high level of starch.





The majority of potatoes never 'git gud'.

They are either delusional enough to think they are doing good when they aren't, or they realise they aren't doing good, but still sufficiently delusional to blame their failures on everything but themselves.
Either way, they never accept responsibility for their failure, so they never try to actually improve.

Why bother trying to "Git Gud" when every Tier (insert any # above 5 here) douchebag on your team keeps telling you your just a Losing Spud Potatoe if you don't Solo kill the whole other team?

"*** em All but Six I say, for they will be your Pall-Bearers"...