197 replies to this topic

[Gas Guzzler]

Jun Watarase, on 10 August 2017 - 07:04 AM, said:

Why would people buy IS omnis when standard battlemechs are superior in almost every way? Most clan omnis are heavily gimped by the lack of tonnage due to oversized engines and inability to add endo-steel/FF. Unless the IS omnis come in with OP quirks and they cherry pick them to avoid the ones with oversized engines....wait....that sounds like something PGI would do...

They could just get quirks and good baseline agility. Most Clan omnis are above average to good mechs... the only one that isn't that I can think of is the Mist Lynx.

[Jay Leon Hart]

Jun Watarase, on 10 August 2017 - 07:04 AM, said:

Why would people buy IS omnis when standard battlemechs are superior in almost every way?

So the IS can boat 12+ energy weapons as well

[CK16]

If they had a loadout selection for Omni's permission that would make them alot better and flexible. Where battlemechs get the flexibility in the mech lab Omni's would have the flexibility to adapt quickly (as in the lore!). Would make thier value alot more useful imo. That is what Omni's need is that on the fly adaptability and flexibility.

[R Valentine]

Nema Nabojiv, on 10 August 2017 - 06:34 AM, said:

They can always allow engine change in omnies. And make a lot of clan ones not as terrible in the process.

They won't even let us take the jump jets off omnis, and you think they'll suddenly let us change engines? You're smoking the dirtiest of dope if you think PGI will ever allow engine swaps on omnis.

[Ch_R0me]

Since I'm heavily interested to see IS Omni's, I've given my votes:

Lights:

• Raptor
  
• Owens

Mediums:

• Strider
  
• Men Shen
  
• Blackjack (Omni)
  
• Firestarter (Omni)

Sorry Centurion fans, it's Omni version will come in XXXII century
Heavies:

• All of them (Perseus, Avatar, Black Hawk KU)

Assaults:

• All of them (Sunder, Templar, Hauptmann)

[Metus regem]

IS Omni's are a tricky thing, as depending on the generation of them you go from really, really bad to half way decent, from half way decent to solid and from solid to likely meta.

I'll skip over Gen 1, as really there is two solid mechs in that groupd:

Raptor 25t
Black Hawk KU, 60t

Questionable mention: Sunder, this one is largely hit box and art dependent. It is a fast assault, with a locked 360 isXL engine.


Gen 2 omni's you are seeing better units. Note from my perspective Gen 1 omnis are any IS unit produced before 3058.

As there are some real gems in here, I will list them:

Men Shen, 55t
Templar, 85t

Questionable mentions: Hauptmann, 95t with a locked 285 standard. Perseus, 75t with a locked 300 XL. Both of these would likely be quirk and geometry dependent.

Gen 2.5, also known as WoB Celestial mechs, these things can be down right beastly, if ugly... They are an odd mix of rugged equipment and fragile equipment, often all packing things not in game.

Gen 3 is Dark Age units, no real stand outs here.

[Lucian Nostra]

FLG 01, on 10 August 2017 - 06:21 AM, said:

You may want to add the Firestarter and Blackjack Omnis, also the IS Battle Cobra. Not that they are great, but compared to the Strider....

I'd probably go with Raptor, Men Shen, Black Hawk-KU, and Hauptmann.




One Battle Cobra is Clan, the other is not.




Um, Strider... a Mech with locked SHS.
And Avatar, a Mech with fixed XL, easily singled out STs, and low speed on top of that.

You are Clan, fine, but please don't sabotage the IS.

Sabotage? Never! We all know how amazing Omni mechs are the ability to swap hardpoints is so amazing as I've been told over the years by IS pilots that having stuff like standard structure on the Gargoyle is perfectly fine. Surely the amazing build potential of omnis will over ride the downfalls of IS omnis

[Jun Watarase]

Jay Leon Hart, on 10 August 2017 - 07:16 AM, said:

So the IS can boat 12+ energy weapons as well

Not that impressive as that sounds when you really only need up to 9 for laser vomit (3x LPL/LL, rest med lasers of some kind). I mean sure, the Nova can run 12x med lasers, but thats really really dumb.and nowhere near as impressive as it sounds. Plus the main attraction, the ability to swap pods, is negated by the fact that quirks are being moved to set of 8 pod bonuses and the fact that you can just pick a normal mech with the hardpoints that you want anyway.

[R Valentine]

Jun Watarase, on 10 August 2017 - 08:08 AM, said:

Not that impressive as that sounds when you really only need up to 9 for laser vomit (3x LPL/LL, rest med lasers of some kind). I mean sure, the Nova can run 12x med lasers, but thats really really dumb.and nowhere near as impressive as it sounds. Plus the main attraction, the ability to swap pods, is negated by the fact that quirks are being moved to set of 8 pod bonuses and the fact that you can just pick a normal mech with the hardpoints that you want anyway.

I hate set of 8 quirks so much. It's like, "Look, an omnimech! You can do what you want! Except it's sub-optimal if you use it as an omnimech and not a battlemech because set of 8".

[Jun Watarase]

Kiran Yagami, on 10 August 2017 - 08:11 AM, said:

I hate set of 8 quirks so much. It's like, "Look, an omnimech! You can do what you want! Except it's sub-optimal if you use it as an omnimech and not a battlemech because set of 8".

Set of eight quirks wouldnt be so bad if they were massive bonuses for underperforming variants. Like, the summoner prime. The summoner is only useful for poptart ER PPC builds now...trying to run anything resembling the prime config (er PPC, LBX, LRMs) is a joke because it doesnt have the tonnage for it. So a set of eight quirks for it should massively reward someone who wants to run that config, but the problem is, it doesnt...you would need like -50% LBX cooldown or something massive and massive armor quirks to prevent the arms from being shot off.

[Jay Leon Hart]

Jun Watarase, on 10 August 2017 - 08:08 AM, said:

I mean sure, the Nova can run 12x med lasers, but thats really really dumb.and nowhere near as impressive as it sounds.

Well, my Nova, Stormcrow, Gargoyle and Executioner builds disagree with you there. Just being able to have 6+ in a single arm is pretty fantastic.

[R Valentine]

Jay Leon Hart, on 10 August 2017 - 08:32 AM, said:

Well, my Nova, Stormcrow, Gargoyle and Executioner builds disagree with you there. Just being able to have 6+ in a single arm is pretty fantastic.

Having 6+ in a single arm has next to nothing to do with being an omnimech. That's just a mech with good hardpoints. It only really matters if you can mix and match the omnipods to make awesome combinations, which a lot of omnimechs can't because of negative quirks and set of 8 bonuses that you're missing out on.

[The Zohan]

Jun Watarase, on 10 August 2017 - 07:04 AM, said:

Why would people buy IS omnis when standard battlemechs are superior in almost every way? Most clan omnis are heavily gimped by the lack of tonnage due to oversized engines and inability to add endo-steel/FF. Unless the IS omnis come in with OP quirks and they cherry pick them to avoid the ones with oversized engines....wait....that sounds like something PGI would do...

Yeah... in theory, omnis should be the most versatile of mechs. I get the omnihardpoint/pod system we have in MWO. What I dont get is the set of eight quirks for omnis but that is another topic to discuss.

Battlemechs should NEVER be more versatile than omnis, but alas...
IS omnis would be doa, by this games standarts. They would be the most dumbest things to implement and quite frankly, I dont see even PGI let IS omnis change/unlock engines and internals. These are red lines that even they wont cross.

[Jay Leon Hart]

Kiran Yagami, on 10 August 2017 - 08:42 AM, said:

Having 6+ in a single arm has next to nothing to do with being an omnimech. That's just a mech with good hardpoints. It only really matters if you can mix and match the omnipods to make awesome combinations, which a lot of omnimechs can't because of negative quirks and set of 8 bonuses that you're missing out on.

However, the ones I listed *can* mix them to make something awesome. That's why I mentioned them.

Not all Omnis are amazing, but they aren't all garbage either, as some seem to be claiming.

[Battlemaster56]

While IS Omni's have mixed opinions, but god d@mn I want my Owens real bad, even if it's bad and size of a Cicada it be enjoyable to run.



Just look at this beauty!!!

Edited by Battlemaster56, 10 August 2017 - 09:32 AM.

[Y E O N N E]

Jun Watarase, on 10 August 2017 - 07:04 AM, said:

Why would people buy IS omnis when standard battlemechs are superior in almost every way?

Because some of them, like the Raptor, are cute. Which is why I bought the Mist Lynx package (with real money).

Raptor pls, pls, pls, pls, pls!

[Bombast]

Battlemaster56, on 10 August 2017 - 09:31 AM, said:

...I want my Owens real bad, even if it's bad and size of a Cicada...

Presumably, it would be as tall as a Jenner, only twice as wide.

And the Strider would be the same size as the Cicada, only with arms that completely cover the torso from the sides.

[Metus regem]

Battlemaster56, on 10 August 2017 - 09:31 AM, said:

While IS Omni's have mixed opinions, but god d@mn I want my Owens real bad, even if it's bad and size of a Cicada it be enjoyable to run.



Just look at this beauty!!!

I'll give you that, it does look good. But stat wise, it's another story....

[FupDup]

Yeonne Greene, on 10 August 2017 - 09:56 AM, said:

Because some of them, like the Raptor, are cute. Which is why I bought the Mist Lynx package (with real money).

Raptor pls, pls, pls, pls, pls!

I don't think the Raptor is the best example for the argument of "buying sub-par mechs" because it actually does some unique things that the IS doesn't have for a 25-tonner yet (chicken walker, high mounts, Omnimech, slower speed, hardpoints up the wazoo) and will have at least some sort of niche use as a result.

[Y E O N N E]

FupDup, on 10 August 2017 - 09:59 AM, said:

I don't think the Raptor is the best example for the argument of "buying sub-par mechs" because it actually does some unique things that the IS doesn't have for a 25-tonner yet (chicken walker, high mounts, Omnimech, slower speed, hardpoints up the wazoo) and will have at least some sort of niche use as a result.

That it does, I have been saying that all along. But it being a tiny chicken-leg box with guns is Reason No. 1 why I want it, 11xE is just icing.