48 replies to this topic

[Anjian]

Lily from animove, on 24 August 2017 - 05:49 AM, said:

no anjin, there is no invisible ledge, the leg position is in relation to the center body, tahts why it steps into the open until the center mass finally "goes around the edge" then suddenly magically the leg sawps too

just watch the toes of that fist mech in the fist vid you posted all it does is partially hovering over or clipping in the surface. So where are those amazing toes you talk of.

BS. The legs are attached to the body which limits the extent of the joint geometry and that is consistent to inverse kinematics. The legs and toes will try to touch the surface but that is only to what the joint geometry allows you to.

Another thing is that while the textures give the surface a rounded appearance, rounded surfaces means infinite polygons, which is something that cannot be represented in a game due to limited resources, hence the surfaces aka surface hitbox will have more of a rough or crude lower polygonal count that does not completely align with the rounded surface. That creates invisible surfaces that creates a collision border that the legs hit and will not exceed through.

Please check your eyes. Every time the toes bite into the snow, the toes are partially buried and they put up a small ice cloud, while leaving permanent tracks.

Edited by Anjian, 24 August 2017 - 04:12 PM.

[Jay Leon Hart]

This is what I think of when IK comes up.

Nice to have, but it's up there with lens flare and sun rays with how much I really care about it.

[Lily from animove]

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Anjian, on 24 August 2017 - 03:13 PM, said:

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BS. The legs are attached to the body which limits the extent of the joint geometry and that is consistent to inverse kinematics. The legs and toes will try to touch the surface but that is only to what the joint geometry allows you to.</p>
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Another thing is that while the textures give the surface a rounded appearance, rounded surfaces means infinite polygons, which is something that cannot be represented in a game due to limited resources, hence the surfaces aka surface hitbox will have more of a rough or crude lower polygonal count that does not completely align with the rounded surface. That creates invisible surfaces that creates a collision border that the legs hit and will not exceed through.</p>
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Please check your eyes. Every time the toes bite into the snow, the toes are partially buried and they put up a small ice cloud, while leaving permanent tracks.</p>
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What have the toes entering the snow and leaving it even to do with inverse kinematics? exacly nothing. And honestly those puffy snow step effects arent even relaistic looking they behave like dust stompy clwods, but snow isn't dust.

In fact those footsteps aren even more incorrect because the toes bend when walking which wouldn't create such footsteps when beeing that deep in the snow. Something makes you see more awesomeness in this games features about walking than there actually is.

What they did made nice and right is the way how the turn movement keeps the foot on place giving the movement while tunring some "starfing" like animations, thats somethign that always looks awkward in MWO. And yes the foot stays in palce also on slopes. But old MWO inverse kinematics also included toe movement and this isn't present in that video as well.

[Anjian]

Lily from animove, on 25 August 2017 - 01:50 AM, said:

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What have the toes entering the snow and leaving it even to do with inverse kinematics? exacly nothing. And honestly those puffy snow step effects arent even relaistic looking they behave like dust stompy clwods, but snow isn't dust.

In fact those footsteps aren even more incorrect because the toes bend when walking which wouldn't create such footsteps when beeing that deep in the snow. Something makes you see more awesomeness in this games features about walking than there actually is.

What they did made nice and right is the way how the turn movement keeps the foot on place giving the movement while tunring some "starfing" like animations, thats somethign that always looks awkward in MWO. And yes the foot stays in palce also on slopes. But old MWO inverse kinematics also included toe movement and this isn't present in that video as well.

What the hell are you talking about?

When you look at the snow animations on the feet, the feet on BoT is consistent to the snow's surface. All during the game, the angle and geometry of the knees and thighs are also consistent to the angle of the feet as they are in contact to the ground. The angle of the foot's bottom surface are consistent to the ground surface.

Just before the feet touch the surface, there is a slight inward bent of the toes. When they hit the ground the toes would change geometry to match the surface.



blob:http://imgur.com/a2e060f6-c70d-4030-a52c-b07953334e18















As for old MWO, most of the mechs have feet that are more of less in effect, work more like shoes or hoofs depending on the mech, and are completely solid (they don't bend).

Edited by Anjian, 25 August 2017 - 03:48 PM.

[Koniving]

RestosIII, on 22 August 2017 - 08:12 PM, said:

Wait, people remember Supreme Commander?!?!

The real question is do people remember that Supreme Commander was going to be Total Annihilation's prequel, but the rights couldn't be secured and so its lore was changed?
It was originally titled: "Total Annihilation: Supreme Commander."

Edited by Koniving, 25 August 2017 - 05:18 PM.

[Jay Leon Hart]

Koniving, on 25 August 2017 - 05:17 PM, said:

The real question is do people remember that Supreme Commander was going to be Total Annihilation's prequel, but the rights couldn't be secured and so its lore was changed?
It was originally titled: "Total Annihilation: Supreme Commander."

Oooh, that I didn't know.

[Koniving]

Jay Leon Hart, on 25 August 2017 - 11:27 PM, said:

Oooh, that I didn't know.

The similarities go from the game mechanics, to unit design, same orchestra and writer, to even the same narrator (actually I believe the narrator got changed watching the Supreme Commander intro; perhaps he was too iconic.)

Trouble is the original creator sold his **** to some big company and couldn't buy it back.

Sound familiar? (Jordan Weisman, creator of Battletech, recently spoke of seller's remorse and financial realities which is why he sold Battletech/Mechwarrior to Microsoft.)

Some happy news though, he (total annihilation's creator) got it back. Then made Planetary Annihilation.

Which I think is a prequel since the emphasis is fighting between planets with the ability to destroy said planets. "What began as a conflict..... has decimated over a million worlds."

It just isn't set back as far as Supreme Commander might have been, which would have been when they were first beginning to transfer their consciousness to the machines. Then again I'm not sure, I don't have planetary annihilation.

Edited by Koniving, 26 August 2017 - 07:09 AM.

[Jay Leon Hart]

Koniving, on 26 August 2017 - 06:56 AM, said:

The similarities go from the game mechanics, to unit design, same orchestra and writer, to even the same narrator.

Trouble is the original creator sold his **** to some big company and couldn't buy it back.

Some happy news though, he (total annihilation's creator) got it back. Then made Planetary Annihilation.

Oh yeah, I know about Chris Taylor's involvement and some TA & SupCom folks making PA, mentioned it a few posts up. I just didn't know SupCom was planned as an actual tie-in.

I don't recall Chris Taylor being involved with PA though. So did he move to Uber Entertainment after Gas Powered Games dissolved, or was it another of the developers? As for the the TA IP, last I heard Atari had acquired all the Cavedog stuff. Then again, I haven't checked on that since the early 2000s.

[Koniving]

Jay Leon Hart, on 26 August 2017 - 07:04 AM, said:

Oh yeah, I know about Chris Taylor's involvement and some TA & SupCom folks making PA, mentioned it a few posts up. I just didn't know SupCom was planned as an actual tie-in.

I don't recall Chris Taylor being involved with PA though. So did he move to Uber Entertainment after Gas Powered Games dissolved, or was it another of the developers? As for the the TA IP, last I heard Atari had acquired all the Cavedog stuff. Then again, I haven't checked on that since the early 2000s.

Not entirely sure. It could be that he had nothing to do with it. I just know that some TA guys were excited that they got the rights to continue it. Figured one of them was the original guy.