189 replies to this topic

[Baba_Yaga]

Bitching about,MG, LRM SPAM is by far more abundant than MG's
Atleast MG's require skill!

Edited by Hamerclone, 07 September 2017 - 09:35 AM.

[Y E O N N E]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 07 September 2017 - 07:57 AM, said:

The lack of Heavy lasers also makes things a bit less appealing on the IS side since heavy lasers kind of combine well with weapons that already require lots of facetime, imo. Then again, I suppose so long as IS lasers can output higher levels of DPS that isn't as big of a problem.

I mean, we could quirk the cooldown on the lasers some more, but we can also throw IS MGs a bone so we don't have to lean so hard on energy quirks.

The whole MG line could use some tweaking. Range and ammo on HMGs need increases, IS MGs on the whole should probably have longer range and deal slightly more DPS. Blowing a whole ton on an HMG for something like the BJ-A is just way too taxing and results in a horrendous performance deficit.

[chucklesMuch]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 07 September 2017 - 07:04 AM, said:

Really all 3 of those should be given more ballistic mounts.

Sounded like Russ was up for increasing hard point starved mechs... and Chris was no... :/

Edited by chucklesMuch, 07 September 2017 - 11:17 AM.

[LordNothing]

i think its good for the game. light mechs reclaim their place and late game survival becomes an issue. it opens the niche for light kill securing boats to run out and take down the low of armor. its also nice that lights have viable ballistic options.

[Yellonet]

SKINLESS, on 03 September 2017 - 07:57 PM, said:

FIX: reverse the stupid cSPL nerf.

Yes, the solution would be to make a weapon that only clans can use the best for close range. Worst idea ever?

[Ruar]

Iron Heel, on 07 September 2017 - 07:40 AM, said:

That's what a crit seeker light does.
You're complaining about the nature of the beast.
Perhaps a crit seeking mg light pilot has taken the time to scan your armor for weaknesses and exploited those better than the heavier mechs pilots you encountered.
A proficient light pilot will do that.

Don't engage a crit seeker with armor open..

You do realize that a faster mech can force an engagement whether I want to fight or not.

Saying "don't engage a crit seeker with armor open" is a stupid thing to say. Of course if I had the option I'd engage them out of their range or from a position where they couldn't fire back. However since they are more maneuverable there is no way to avoid them.

Basically you are saying "if you don't like it, then don't play the game". Which is pretty much what I've done.

[Anjian]

If there is a new meta other than lasers and long range weapons, that would be a welcome change.

Personally I believe a game should have higher DPS rewarded to shorter ranged weapons.

[adamts01]

LordNothing, on 07 September 2017 - 11:43 AM, said:

i think its good for the game. light mechs reclaim their place and late game survival becomes an issue. it opens the niche for light kill securing boats to run out and take down the low of armor. its also nice that lights have viable ballistic options.

I'm all about lights having a place in the game, but I don't like these MG builds being so powerful. It feels too rock-paper-scissors to me. I don't think any weapon should ever be in a place where you instantly win regardless of skill because you walked in to the right situation. Especially when that build promotes you doing nothing for your team for most the match while you hope they all did work on your potential targets. I like the idea of crit-seeking weapons, but these went too far. If light MGs are going to have that range, then they need to reduce their ability to instantly crit everything they touch. I'd prefer them to lean more towards typical damage with a much less sever crit ability.

[qS Sachiel]

Ruar, on 07 September 2017 - 01:14 PM, said:

You do realize that a faster mech can force an engagement whether I want to fight or not.

Saying "don't engage a crit seeker with armor open" is a stupid thing to say. Of course if I had the option I'd engage them out of their range or from a position where they couldn't fire back. However since they are more maneuverable there is no way to avoid them.

Basically you are saying "if you don't like it, then don't play the game". Which is pretty much what I've done.

If you're getting rippe open by lights mid to early game you may have a point. Mid to late game is where that mech flourishes and you don't have a leg to stand on complaining that you: the high damage but injured party does not get to set the terms of engagement. If you're too far out, isolated, opened up or just in bad company it's too bad.

[Ruar]

qS Sachiel, on 07 September 2017 - 05:26 PM, said:

If you're getting rippe open by lights mid to early game you may have a point. Mid to late game is where that mech flourishes and you don't have a leg to stand on complaining that you: the high damage but injured party does not get to set the terms of engagement. If you're too far out, isolated, opened up or just in bad company it's too bad.

So basically... don't lose your armor if there is a MG light on the other team because if you do then you deserve to lose all your weapons and structure faster than any other mech in the game.

Got it.

[Y E O N N E]

chucklesMuch, on 07 September 2017 - 11:16 AM, said:

Sounded like Russ was up for increasing hard point starved mechs... and Chris was no... :/

I think Chris was leery of it, not outright against it. He made a valid point that if we just inflate all the hardpoints everywhere, 'Mechs lose their flavor.

However, adding more MGs to the LCT-1V and LCT-3V doesn't change their flavors relative to each other; one would still be more ballistics-heavy than the other, they would just both be better 'Mechs than they currently are. Even if we give the SDR-5K more MGs, it's not redundant with the LCT-1V since the SDR-5K will run those MGs with a long range laser while the Locust is strictly close-range.

[LordNothing]

adamts01, on 07 September 2017 - 05:26 PM, said:

I'm all about lights having a place in the game, but I don't like these MG builds being so powerful. It feels too rock-paper-scissors to me. I don't think any weapon should ever be in a place where you instantly win regardless of skill because you walked in to the right situation. Especially when that build promotes you doing nothing for your team for most the match while you hope they all did work on your potential targets. I like the idea of crit-seeking weapons, but these went too far. If light MGs are going to have that range, then they need to reduce their ability to instantly crit everything they touch. I'd prefer them to lean more towards typical damage with a much less sever crit ability.

i wouldnt say it promotes idleness. when you got a mech that can rapidly (its not instant, and thats a perilous position for a light to be in) crit out any open target you tend to go looking for those targets. you are out there spamming that r key looking for a soft target. providing your team with critical intel about the enemy team. an idle mg boat is going to be an unsuccessful mg boat.

and its not really the machine guns, its a couple builds specifically that are doing this. mgs are still fairly mediocre on the lights with only 4 ballistic hardpoints. dont blame the weapon because the mech is overperforming. that makes the weapon useless across the board. its the kodiak boondoggle all over again. utilize negaquirks when such problems arise. its much more targeted than a far sweeping nerf to the weapon system.

then you got spinoff effects that really imrove the game's dynamics. people start running meds to deal with the squirrel problem, streaks become useful. in a game thats grown stale a few changeups are a good change of pace.

[adamts01]

LordNothing, on 07 September 2017 - 05:59 PM, said:

and its not really the machine guns, its a couple builds specifically that are doing this. mgs are still fairly mediocre on the lights with only 4 ballistic hardpoints. dont blame the weapon because the mech is overperforming. that makes the weapon useless across the board. its the kodiak boondoggle all over again. utilize negaquirks when such problems arise. its much more targeted than a far sweeping nerf to the weapon system.

Good point. The only way I've ever seen to balance things out is with cone of fire, the way every single other game balances out these problems. You want 8 MGs firing at the same time on a light platform? Then deal with the horrendous recoil of that setup. Much better solution than ghost heat. So glad I left this game.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Yeonne Greene, on 07 September 2017 - 05:48 PM, said:

However, adding more MGs to the LCT-1V and LCT-3V doesn't change their flavors relative to each other; one would still be more ballistics-heavy than the other, they would just both be better 'Mechs than they currently are. Even if we give the SDR-5K more MGs, it's not redundant with the LCT-1V since the SDR-5K will run those MGs with a long range laser while the Locust is strictly close-range.

I mean it certainly won't be more redundant than they already are, that's for sure.

[qS Sachiel]

Ruar, on 07 September 2017 - 05:41 PM, said:

So basically... don't lose your armor if there is a MG light on the other team because if you do then you deserve to lose all your weapons and structure faster than any other mech in the game.

Got it.

You're always so hostile if someone chooses not to line your echo chamber.
No.
If you're injured and unable to respond based upon your positioning or remaining teammates being already killed by bad mistakes or a superior team, then the light - which had the speed and profile to pick and choose its engagements - is perfectly poised to obliterate you. Like I said, if lights are able to shred you towards the start of the game, that is cause for concern. But that's not what you've suggested, do I don't see the problem.

Its unfortunate that you seem to feel you alone should survive the entire match without significant loss or death, but you're in a big stumpy robot that is meant to draw attention and return fire. A light is built to avoid fire and slip in between your ribs when the time is right.

[Wil McCullough]

Ruar, on 07 September 2017 - 05:41 PM, said:

So basically... don't lose your armor if there is a MG light on the other team because if you do then you deserve to lose all your weapons and structure faster than any other mech in the game.

Got it.

No. The lesson is "ablate your armor as needed. Just keep in mind that the opfor may be fielding light mechs that are useless in almost all other situations except taking down an enemy mech with ablated armor."

Play accordingly.

[MW Waldorf Statler]

Ruar, on 07 September 2017 - 03:31 AM, said:

Because a mech with 4 ballistic points which are obviously meant for MGs doesn't have any energy or missile points either?

I can't think of a single mech in the game that is designed to only use MGs with no other weapon hardpoints.

and from all Weapons , the MGs OP and most dangerous ?Which other Aspects and Targets we have for MGs ? heres no Infantry an LAVs

[Ruar]

qS Sachiel, on 07 September 2017 - 06:27 PM, said:

You're always so hostile if someone chooses not to line your echo chamber.
No.
If you're injured and unable to respond based upon your positioning or remaining teammates being already killed by bad mistakes or a superior team, then the light - which had the speed and profile to pick and choose its engagements - is perfectly poised to obliterate you. Like I said, if lights are able to shred you towards the start of the game, that is cause for concern. But that's not what you've suggested, do I don't see the problem.

Its unfortunate that you seem to feel you alone should survive the entire match without significant loss or death, but you're in a big stumpy robot that is meant to draw attention and return fire. A light is built to avoid fire and slip in between your ribs when the time is right.

I've found the echo chamber on these forums is the light and lrms pilots. They tend to be the ones repeating the same things over and over. Not sure where you got hostile from, I've not put any hostility in my remarks, but it's text so people tend to read their own expectations.

In no way do I think I alone should survive the match. Kind of pathetic that you can't engage what is said but have to create a strawman instead.

I just want to play a balanced game that is fun, even when I die early or the result is a loss. When a weapon or mech, especially after changes have been made, is unbalanced then it takes the fun out of the game. Although I guess some people's version of fun is found in unfair advantages instead of balance due to competitive drive. Which is why we have these threads where the echo chamber is talking about how people should get good and if X or Y happens then it's obviously poor skills and nothing to do with current FOTM being out of balance.

However, I'll step out of the thread. I've said my piece, hopefully Chris sees my point.

[Mcgral18]

Ruar, on 07 September 2017 - 08:33 PM, said:

However, I'll step out of the thread. I've said my piece, hopefully Chris sees my point.

Seeing as reason goes against it...yes, he probably will


RIP MGs

[Mole]

All of you guys pounding home the point that MG boat lights are useless against armored targets. You are wrong. Absolutely, dead wrong. You guys do realize that these little MG boats also come equipped with enough lasers to peel your armor away and then eat your internals with their MGs, right? My 8 MG Mist Lynx can deliver 20 points of damage to armor from 200m out, and my 6 MG Arctic Cheetah can do the same at 270. When piloting my MG lights I do not need nor do I ever wait for a soft target. I go find a target and then I make it soft. This idea that lights packing large numbers of MGs are helpless against targets with armor needs to stop because it is a blatant falsehood.