153 replies to this topic

[Angel of Annihilation]

Fox With A Shotgun, on 10 September 2017 - 07:16 AM, said:

So let me get this straight.

You bring a loadout of 2 ERPPCs and 3 LRM5. Knowing the meta of poke and hide, you put the ERPPCs in the high torso slots, and your LRMs do diddly squat to anything under 180m.

You get attacked by mechs that are optimised for attacking at knife-fighting distances and have the speed to back it up. Your torso slots, while good at poking, are absolutely terrible at defending against close range threats. You have NOTHING to defend against close-up enemies.

So let me ask you this. If a Locust gets caught in the open and gets LRMed to death, does the Locust pilot complain and rage about LRMs being OP? No. It's a positioning error that lets him be spotted and LRMed to death. If you get murdered by a dedicated knife-fighting mech with no offensive power at all further than 200m away, while you yourself carry no weapons to defend at less than 200m away, is that an operator error or the other mech being OP?

Bring a couple of Medium Lasers or Small Pulses in your arms, and then come back. Or if you're still having trouble, bring some Streak-6. Lights absolutely hate them. But whatever you do, you don't get any sympathy from any light pilots by whining about OP lights when you have NOTHING in your loadout that is actually geared to fight them off at their optimal range. I bet that if a Viper with a SPL/MG loadout does the exact same thing, you'll cry and whine about OP mediums next.

Got to admit this is spot on. OP was running a build with exactly zero defensive capability against light mechs at short range (or really any mech at short range) and gets upset he is killed by light mechs at short range. If anything it is the players that are wrong with this game. I mean it isn't hard, every Warhammer has at least 2 energy located in their arms and those arms all have lower arm actuators so just add in a couple medium lasers for close in defense and then you can at least have a chance to defend yourself against close range lights but nope OP would rather whine.

[dario03]

Ted Wayz, on 10 September 2017 - 02:21 PM, said:

Ignoring the approach the OP took to make their point...he is right.

Lights are way too durable in this game and some have been for awhile. Armor creep and broken hitboxes are not a new thing. The skill tree just accelerated lights becoming mini-assaults.

The reason why? PGI has given up on creating dynamic game play involving roles. Instead rewards are damage/KMDD centric so they have been slowly buffing lights to make their scores more consistently competitive with the other weight classes.

If you had told me 5 years ago that MWO was going to evolve to a twitch shooter I wouldn't have spent a dime on it. But here we are.

Roles and a new scoring system are the solution. But we have a better chance of hearing a trump apology.

I remember those slow buffs...
The 40kph hardcap on legged mechs no matter what their original speed.
The fall damage being added in.
The mobility dropping.
Streaks being anti light weapons.
The great embiggening of 2016 that increased a bunch of mechs by ~30%, though the locust got left out and instead shrunk by ~7%, but thats okay they made up for it by reducing its pesky quirks by ~half.

KingCobra, on 10 September 2017 - 02:24 PM, said:

First off some of you have a few lights missing in your chandeliers I said I was in a Warhammer = Heavy the 2 lights were on or close to our spawn point under 30 seconds the game started so something is wrong there? next I was within 4 mech of my lance mates called for help and died in about 10 seconds later before they could help me.

Like I said all lights are not the problem just the OP lights that don't take proper damage lets see Locust-Spider-Arctic Cheater-ETC. Some of you just want to post trash comments because you are yourself so OP it never happens to you no matter your tier or skills or your defending OP lights because you pilot them to troll others in game.

PGI needs to rebalance lights that are too OP and can tank any mechs even assaults.

So nobody helped you?

Again.

2>1

Whats the problem?

[qS Sachiel]

Isn't grim portico a Fp map?..
How did you get stormed by lights within 30s in FP?

Something fishy going on here (and it's not the ppc lrm warhammer... Wait)

[chucklesMuch]

KingCobra, on 10 September 2017 - 02:24 PM, said:

First off some of you have a few lights missing in your chandeliers I said I was in a Warhammer = Heavy the 2 lights were on or close to our spawn point under 30 seconds the game started so something is wrong there? next I was within 4 mech of my lance mates called for help and died in about 10 seconds later before they could help me.

Like I said all lights are not the problem just the OP lights that don't take proper damage lets see Locust-Spider-Arctic Cheater-ETC. Some of you just want to post trash comments because you are yourself so OP it never happens to you no matter your tier or skills or your defending OP lights because you pilot them to troll others in game.

PGI needs to rebalance lights that are too OP and can tank any mechs even assaults.

So where was the rest of your team? How were you isolated and singled out 30 sec into a game where you drop with 3 other mechs beside you? And 8 more fairly close.

Did you have a super slow engine and couldn't keep up? Or did you linger in the spawn so that you weren't anywhere near the front lines?

[Valdarion Silarius]

Finally garbage? Where have you been for the past few years OP?

Btw, it sounds like you are a victim of the bad hit reg since you got killed so quickly by lights. Don't blame the mech OP, blame the god awful tiny hit boxes that lights have vs the inflated ones that assaults have. I had the same problems with my Executioner Prime and Mauler MX90, which is part of the reason why I haven't been playing ever since.

[Y E O N N E]

Arnold The Governator, on 10 September 2017 - 03:57 PM, said:

Finally garbage? Where have you been for the past few years OP?

Btw, it sounds like you are a victim of the bad hit reg since you got killed so quickly by lights. Don't blame the mech OP, blame the god awful tiny hit boxes that lights have vs the inflated ones that assaults have. I had the same problems with my Executioner Prime and Mauler MX90, which is part of the reason why I haven't been playing ever since.

You had problems with Lights in an EXE? What?

MX90 I can understand since its arm mounts are anemic, but then again that 'Mech absolutely savages anything bigger than a Light, so...

[Ted Wayz]

dario03, on 10 September 2017 - 03:49 PM, said:

I remember those slow buffs...
The 40kph hardcap on legged mechs no matter what their original speed.
The fall damage being added in.
The mobility dropping.
Streaks being anti light weapons.
The great embiggening of 2016 that increased a bunch of mechs by ~30%, though the locust got left out and instead shrunk by ~7%, but thats okay they made up for it by reducing its pesky quirks by ~half.

I see you are going for the balanced point of view.

Riddle me this, should a light be able to walk away from a direct hit from an AC20?

The decrease in speed due to legging doesn't mean as much with a 400% increase in armor and structure for legs, now does it?

Quirks...anyone who mentions them doesn't understand them. I mean really, lights are the only mechs affected by quirks?

Fall damage being added in..then addressed by the skill tree.

Mobility dropping...across the board. Then addressed by the skill tree.

Streaks being anti light weapons while lights are packing more firepower than mediums and some heavies. I feel for you.

And more pixels added...but broken hit boxes still not addressed. So net net it really didn't matter.

Need to try harder at getting people to cry with you. Right now your post is being filed either under "no sympathy" or "pointless rhetoric".

[Mcgral18]

Ted Wayz, on 10 September 2017 - 04:09 PM, said:

I see you are going for the balanced point of view.

Riddle me this, should a light be able to walk away from a direct hit from an AC20?

The decrease in speed due to legging doesn't mean as much with a 400% increase in armor and structure for legs, now does it?

Quirks...anyone who mentions them doesn't understand them. I mean really, lights are the only mechs affected by quirks?

Fall damage being added in..then addressed by the skill tree.

Mobility dropping...across the board. Then addressed by the skill tree.

Streaks being anti light weapons while lights are packing more firepower than mediums and some heavies. I feel for you.

And more pixels added...but broken hit boxes still not addressed. So net net it really didn't matter.

Need to try harder at getting people to cry with you. Right now your post is being filed either under "no sympathy" or "pointless rhetoric".

Talk about a garbage comment

[- World Eater -]

Make a tumblr about it.

[dario03]

Ted Wayz, on 10 September 2017 - 04:09 PM, said:

I see you are going for the balanced point of view.

Riddle me this, should a light be able to walk away from a direct hit from an AC20?

The decrease in speed due to legging doesn't mean as much with a 400% increase in armor and structure for legs, now does it?

Quirks...anyone who mentions them doesn't understand them. I mean really, lights are the only mechs affected by quirks?

Fall damage being added in..then addressed by the skill tree.

Mobility dropping...across the board. Then addressed by the skill tree.

Streaks being anti light weapons while lights are packing more firepower than mediums and some heavies. I feel for you.

And more pixels added...but broken hit boxes still not addressed. So net net it really didn't matter.

Need to try harder at getting people to cry with you. Right now your post is being filed either under "no sympathy" or "pointless rhetoric".

You should file it under "come back later when I understand it"

AC20 is 20dmg which is less than the head, legs, or front torsos of a fully armored light, so yeah it should be able to run off from that unless it was already damaged, had some odd armor distribution or was something like a locust and hit in the back and in that case it would die.

No lights are not the only mechs affected by quirks. I also never said they were....

Lights don't typically pack more firepower than mediums or heavies. Some exceptions are over engined fast medium mechs compared to slow under engined lights like a cougar vs a ice ferret but then the ice ferret still has medium mech armor while the cougar loses everything once somebody decides it should die. Or you are comparing point blank range dps to long range mechs.

Edited by dario03, 10 September 2017 - 04:35 PM.

[JC Daxion]

Yes it sucks when a 8 MG boat sneaks up on you..


BUT, if you really want to learn about these mechs, i suggest you just play some. Playing a mech makes you learn how to play them, and that in turn keeps you knowing what to look for.


That does not mean things still won't happen, like some how tonight i chased off two mechs with a friend, he left and then they looped around and attacked me. I ran back to everyone but they did not help outside of piling on damage by hitting me instead of them.

The point is,, sometimes you screw up.. that is basically what all those 8 MG mechs are banking on. Try light hunting for a bit.. I suggest ac20 or streaks.. though have some back up weapons if you choose streaks

[Trissila]

I saw an Arctic Cheetah crest a hill once.

So I alpha'd him with 4 SRM6+A and 4 MPLs.

All three torsos were cherry red with no armor.

I didn't see that cheetah again for the rest of the match.

So OP. Indestructible. I didn't one-shot total-core him. Absolutely broken. Need to be nerfed immediately. I should kill lights in one click, then they'll be balanced.

Assuming, of course, that we also reduce them to a maximum of one hardpoint and STD 200 engine cap.

[Kroete]

In tt a light explodes after a good alpha,
in mwo a light may explode after a good alpha or not,
depends on hitreg and hsr.

If a light fu... your leg in tt, you can kick it,
in mwo you can hit it with weapons or not,
depends on the mech.

Lights are ok,
even if we have lights that can do more then the 3 seconds jenner,
you know the one why we have ghostheat ...
Or the spider with only 4 mgs, because 6 mgs would be to much ....

But hitreg and no counter to legfuc.... in some mechs is the real problem.
If a locust can eat 72 streaks without opening his armor then there is something wrong ...

Edited by Kroete, 10 September 2017 - 04:56 PM.

[Brain Cancer]

Ted Wayz, on 10 September 2017 - 02:21 PM, said:

Ignoring the approach the OP took to make their point...he is right.

Lights are way too durable in this game and some have been for awhile. Armor creep and broken hitboxes are not a new thing. The skill tree just accelerated lights becoming mini-assaults.

Durable? Maybe Urbies. Those things can take a licking. WLF? Sure. Most of the rest? Not so much.

If you're dumb enough to be in my LOS with lock at around 300m as a light, the first salvo means no more armor, the second one means you're missing most of your vital bits. What lights have is high evasion, which effectively means damage reduction as long as they're moving and nobody fired a guided salvo their way. If you can keep that light in the crosshairs, it dies in short order to heavier tonnage. What drives heavier pilots nuts is that often, they can't focus that superior firepower on that fragile light, or at least not on a single component.

Thus, good light pilots tend to be chipped down by inches, rather than hacked in two by big guns in most games.

[Valdarion Silarius]

Yeonne Greene, on 10 September 2017 - 04:01 PM, said:

You had problems with Lights in an EXE? What?

MX90 I can understand since its arm mounts are anemic, but then again that 'Mech absolutely savages anything bigger than a Light, so...

I've had problems with my Executioner when PGI decided to rescale it larger than mount Everest. I'm not siding with OP for going against light mechs in game, but more or less thoughtless nerfs that PGI did to the two assaults that I used to field the most. It doesn't help that some mechs got rescaled to the point where my Executioner Prime is a giant walking CT with not enough mobility from MASC to make it viable in the field.

[InfinityBall]

Viktor Drake, on 10 September 2017 - 03:44 PM, said:

Got to admit this is spot on. OP was running a build with exactly zero defensive capability against light mechs at short range (or really any mech at short range) and gets upset he is killed by light mechs at short range. If anything it is the players that are wrong with this game. I mean it isn't hard, every Warhammer has at least 2 energy located in their arms and those arms all have lower arm actuators so just add in a couple medium lasers for close in defense and then you can at least have a chance to defend yourself against close range lights but nope OP would rather whine.

FTR, the only Warhammer with 3 missile HP only has one energy HP in each arm. It has 2 more in each ST. If he was using artemis, the ERPPCs had to be in the arms.

Not that any of this makes his argument less than terrible

[chucklesMuch]

InfinityBall, on 10 September 2017 - 05:42 PM, said:

FTR, the only Warhammer with 3 missile HP only has one energy HP in each arm. It has 2 more in each ST. If he was using artemis, the ERPPCs had to be in the arms.

Not that any of this makes his argument less than terrible

ummm no? You can fit 2xerppc, 3xlrm5 (art or not) all in the torso's (Unless awemech is lying to me)... and i think that you would want to strip the arms to have more tonnage for cooling and ammo, oh but then you don't want to stray far from the pack... cos you know lights... and I would expect there to be a brief upturn with Javelins now available for cBills...

[InfinityBall]

chucklesMuch, on 10 September 2017 - 05:59 PM, said:

ummm no? You can fit 2xerppc, 3xlrm5 (art or not) all in the torso's (Unless awemech is lying to me)... and i think that you would want to strip the arms to have more tonnage for cooling and ammo, oh but then you don't want to stray far from the pack... cos you know lights... and I would expect there to be a brief upturn with Javelins now available for cBills...

Edit: oops, I read it as 3 LRM 15s, not 5s. deleted

Edited by InfinityBall, 10 September 2017 - 06:08 PM.

[Angel of Annihilation]

Ted Wayz, on 10 September 2017 - 04:09 PM, said:

I see you are going for the balanced point of view.

Streaks being anti light weapons while lights are packing more firepower than mediums and some heavies. I feel for you.

Seriously, your going to use this? The only lights with that kind of firepower give up the vast majority of their speed and agility to do it. Cougar comes to mind. All the Speed of a medium or heavy mech with none of the armor...but it has that firepower your talking about right.

Also a light mech isn't all the potent by itself or if the mech it is trying to engage is smart and carrying anti-light weaponry and I am not talking Streaks here, I am talking about small, quick firing lasers, usually mounted in the arms where you have superior speed and arcs of fire. More often than not if a light mech sees that you can actually engage them, they run off to find someone like the OP who has some crazy or Meta build that can't. (Meta usually isn't all that great in QP in my opinion). Where lights are dangerous are when they operate in a group of two or three which is also the situation where the OP found himself. When they are Wolfpacking they are brutal but on the other hand if the enemy lights are off 2 v 1 or 3 v 1, then you have at least a 1-2 mech advantage for the duration that it is occurring.

[DivineTomatoes]

chucklesMuch, on 10 September 2017 - 05:59 PM, said:

ummm no? You can fit 2xerppc, 3xlrm5 (art or not) all in the torso's (Unless awemech is lying to me)... and i think that you would want to strip the arms to have more tonnage for cooling and ammo, oh but then you don't want to stray far from the pack... cos you know lights... and I would expect there to be a brief upturn with Javelins now available for cBills...

REDACTED

As he's using the 7S there's still room for 2 med pulse with stripped arms or more if he keeps those arms intact.

They have the ability to put some backup weapons on there but they didn't.

Edited by poopenshire, 11 September 2017 - 02:56 AM.
Redacted