124 replies to this topic

[Johnathan Tanner]

Q, on 30 January 2018 - 03:31 PM, said:

Cool idea Stealthrider. I'm sure there will be a way to game around it, but it does address some of the bigger issues with gen rushing.

Unfortunately it sounds like a lot of work for PGI.

The same guys who threw out 90% of the round table desired features out "Because programming is hard".

[r4zen]

0regon, on 30 January 2018 - 02:39 PM, said:

Man, you make it sound so bad. It's not scummy. It's just different. And in Heavy's defense, he's a very good leader who listens to his guys, has real integrity, and is willing to adapt his strategy to accommodate his players wishes. That's respectable.

I do find a wave 1 gen rush to be scummy. It makes me feel dirty when it's called over comms. I don't enjoy playing that way. There's exceptions. I've herded pugs to gen rush before, from wave 1, against R79T and ARC7 (these are my most recent memories of gen rushing, maybe 3 months ago). I felt dirty, but it was more funny, ironic, and I didn't see a chance in hell of beating them with randos otherwise.

You drop with the over-weighted horse formation more than I do, so I'll yield to your insight there - my experience with him is mixed. I respect his ability as a pilot - and hate most of the calls I've heard him make. I despise running and hiding on polar after going up 1 kill in skirmish. It's annoying, unfun, and...scummy, IMO. If there's like 1 min left and you're shot to hell, fine, I get it. If there's still 10 mins in the match, boring and scummy.

The other half of the equation is that when I group up, it's almost always with others who I can trust to lay pipe and take care of themselves, and not hurt the team's chances of winning. I can understand a lot of the 'scummy' tactics being called if you can't trust the people you're with to do what needs to be done to win in a fight. I don't like it, but I get it. Not something I would want to be part of though, and I think the folks here who express extreme dissatisfaction with aforementioned tactics feel the same way.

[0regon]

Those are interesting suggestions. I, for one, think that objectives should all be harder to destroy. Across the board. And either remove incursion or make the bases harder to destroy and the turrets stronger.

But here's the real issue. None of the PGI guys even play CW. If they did, they'd know what to fix. The only reason we have to sit here and spell it out for them is because they don't even play the damn game. The mode is so damn broken and would be so easy to fix if they gave half a sh!t. Just sit down and play the game for one ***** hour a week!!! Then you'll know exactly what's wrong. It's not rocket science. It just takes giving half a sht enough to play the game. Wake up PGI. Pull your heads out of asses. wtf...

[Q]

0regon, on 30 January 2018 - 03:45 PM, said:

None of the PGI guys even play CW. If they did, they'd know what to fix.

Chill the horsies on the assumptions there, bud!

[0regon]

Q, on 30 January 2018 - 03:48 PM, said:

Chill the horsies on the assumptions there, bud!

I think not my friend. It's not an assumption, but deductive reasoning. If they actually played Community Warfare we'd know about it. It's a way the devs keep in touch with the community. If they did that here, we'd see them around. Similar to when Sean Lang and Tiffany used to play quick play with the community. Why do you think the games so rarely sees any noticeable improvements to the mechanics? Because it's "so hard to program"? No. That excuse worked years ago when the community didn't know better. Now that excuse just seems like a cop out. Reminds me of how politicians start back peddling on their promises after they get elected into office. It's much easier to make excuses for something than it is to actually do what you promised. Anyway, I'm done venting here. Again. Thanks guys for voicing your views here, and allowing me an opportunity to voice mine. I'll be gunning for you all on the battlefield! Cheers guys <3

[0regon]

r4zen, on 30 January 2018 - 03:44 PM, said:

I do find a wave 1 gen rush to be scummy. It makes me feel dirty when it's called over comms. I don't enjoy playing that way. There's exceptions. I've herded pugs to gen rush before, from wave 1, against R79T and ARC7 (these are my most recent memories of gen rushing, maybe 3 months ago). I felt dirty, but it was more funny, ironic, and I didn't see a chance in hell of beating them with randos otherwise.

You drop with the over-weighted horse formation more than I do, so I'll yield to your insight there - my experience with him is mixed. I respect his ability as a pilot - and hate most of the calls I've heard him make. I despise running and hiding on polar after going up 1 kill in skirmish. It's annoying, unfun, and...scummy, IMO. If there's like 1 min left and you're shot to hell, fine, I get it. If there's still 10 mins in the match, boring and scummy.

The other half of the equation is that when I group up, it's almost always with others who I can trust to lay pipe and take care of themselves, and not hurt the team's chances of winning. I can understand a lot of the 'scummy' tactics being called if you can't trust the people you're with to do what needs to be done to win in a fight. I don't like it, but I get it. Not something I would want to be part of though, and I think the folks here who express extreme dissatisfaction with aforementioned tactics feel the same way.

Man, you are one cool cat Razen. You put some thought into what you write, and express yourself well. It's a real pleasure corresponding with you. 07

[Throe]

justcallme A S H, on 30 January 2018 - 04:24 AM, said:

woe be to those 50-60 players out of 3,500 that wanna play PvE

I'd venture to guess there are far more than 50 or 60. May I remind you that MechWarrior Online is the *only* contemporary first person MechWarrior game(indeed excluding the new BattleTech game which hasn't formally released yet, it's the only contemporary MechWarrior video game *in any genre*).

Does that mean I don't enjoy the PvP combat? Yeah, kind of. I enjoy it for the fact that it's MechWarrior, but I'd just as soon play a Campaign mode as online against real opponents. I tolerate the PvP combat.

[Marquis De Lafayette]

As a former member of the unit Oregon is in (With many friends still there) I will say a couple of things.

Several good points have been made here (by people from different viewpoints) on incursion, gen rushing and use of certain tactics

Incursion is broken and always has been in FW.....did some units help make it un-fun for others who were trying to find a way to enjoy it? There is sadly some truth to that critique.

I know for a fact that a unit may (wave 1....not just to pull a Match out in a later wave) gen rush for a variety of reasons. It might be they feel overmatched against certain opponents ...might be there are just trying to get planet tags (and the MC that comes with it) and it doesn’t matter who they are facing, etc. There may be legitimate uses and ones (gen rushing PUGs) that are thought of (fairly) as jerk moves. Where exactly to draw the line is were many of us here will differ. But discussion if kept reasonably civil can be of help in this and might even do good. I can say my point of view on this has changed away from the “win by any means necessary” view I used to be fine with when it comes to this topic. I would rather take a loss for a good match than do certain things. However, I get that not everyone will agree, but that isn’t new.. players never have in this game and I really don’t expect them to all do so now, but discussion can move the needle in some cases.

Myself, I came to view pure gen rushing as a waste of my time in most cases and worse...a waste of other players time. It was overly selfish (i wanted the sweet nectar of MC that came with planet capture too much I guess) and for that I apologize. I didn’t really see that part of the equation till a couple of months ago. We all have limited time and we would do better to respect each other on that.

That said....Overmatched teams need to have tactical options to try to pull a win out and certain modes are built for that. I know many good players want less experienced (or less talented) players/teams to use matches as a chance to improve their gunnery, positioning, etc. While this is good for the long run...people do want to have a shot at winning each match and you can’t in effect expect people to just take the loss (for the pure learning of it) in those modes the objectives often serve to Keep the more talented team honest. I do however think it is fair to believe that there are ways to try to win that probably shouldn’t be done. Like hiding (mentioned above), etc. There is a difference between if something is “technically legal” and if something “should be done”. Also, if people complain about losing conquest on caps or domination on the timer...both those modes were added to have the pressure of caps (or the timer)...if one losses on caps or the timer it isn’t cheap play on the other teams part. Mistakes were made on ones own part.

We all have limited time to play a game that should be fun....employing tactics that waste another’s time should be rare. Likewise, starting trash talk (not merely banter or friendly rivialry) just to get something off your chest should also be rarer in this game than it often is. We do need each other here and the community is small. We would do better to listen to each other’s (sometimes) legitimate criticism and critique others in better ways that are more likely to have a positive effect. In my view there was value in this thread if we have the ears to actually listen to some of what has been said here.

Edited by Marquis De Lafayette, 30 January 2018 - 06:05 PM.

[McGoat]

Go hug somewhere else, this is a spiderman thread.

[Yondu Udonta]

Incursion is a relatively ******** mode in FP where it does not have a 'balanced' drop like QP with a mix of all weight classes that effectively limits the effectiveness of a base rush. This mode in FP could theoretically be won by 12 tier 5 pilots who dump all 48 mechs on base objectives assuming that the opposition does not do likewise.

To be honest, even domination needs a rework for it to be viable in FP. One puny circle and if one side rolls over the other side's first wave, 90s isn't going to be enough to fight one's way back to the circle since the enemy would be deathballing to your spawn. At least make the circle bigger or extend the timer.

And KMDD/KDR is life, if you think those stats don't matter in a FPS game please get lost lol.

[BigScwerl]

TLDR.

This notion that Bacon rushes "all the time" are grossly exaggerated. We really only make the call to rush when we are up against a team and we know it will make you guys really salty. jk?.... Its what we call, "getting your collective goats". We high five, stroke our linebackers, and light cigars with our MC notes. The rest of the time, we farm damage, try to make calls and play as a team... and 4/5 times a night we get good challenges and close matches. When a quick match is called, it is is for a very specific reason.

Edited by BigScwerl, 30 January 2018 - 11:32 PM.

[r4zen]

BigScwerl, on 30 January 2018 - 11:30 PM, said:

This notion that Bacon rushes "all the time" are grossly exaggerated. We really only make the call to rush when we are up against a team and we know it will make you guys really salty.

Sounds like something an embarrassed gen rusher would say

"lol jk guys it was just a big joke haha amirite? ...guys?"

[0regon]

Yondu the Ravager, on 30 January 2018 - 07:47 PM, said:

And KMDD/KDR is life, if you think those stats don't matter in a FPS game please get lost lol.

Ha ha! I gotta admit. That's the best I've heard it said yet! 07

[justcallme A S H]

r4zen, on 30 January 2018 - 11:39 PM, said:

Sounds like something an embarrassed gen rusher would say

&quot;lol jk guys it was just a big joke haha amirite? ...guys?&quot;

Exactly.

Given you never know until you hit the game if you are actually against a team or not (and you can't change mechs at this point)... Well... It's planned out pre-drop, always is.

Edited by justcallme A S H, 31 January 2018 - 03:26 AM.

[McGoat]

[Yondu Udonta]

McGoat, on 31 January 2018 - 07:58 AM, said:

I love your memes.

[Q]

I like that this thread is following the normal dynamics of internet forums.

Person 1 claims assertion A as a fact.
Person 2 denies A.
Person 1 ignores denial and restates their assertion as fact.

Many lolz are had.

Can we get back to spidermemes?

[Throe]

Windscape, on 30 January 2018 - 09:05 AM, said:

The way i determine how good someone is is biy dividing the KMDD by total matches
Kcom, evil, and other very strong FP players have 6+
Other good players have 4-5
Decent players have usually 3 KMDDs per game
Mediocre players have 1-2
Bad players will have a rating less than 1

Its not a perfect system, but thats what i use to roughly gage the preformace of players
Last time i checked mine it was around 5.5

The flaw in your logic is that it assumes all highly skilled players play with the goal to directly fight the enemy instead of playing toward the "PvE" objectives when that is more likely to secure the win.

[Windscape]

Throe, on 31 January 2018 - 09:46 AM, said:

The flaw in your logic is that it assumes all highly skilled players play with the goal to directly fight the enemy instead of playing toward the &quot;PvE&quot; objectives when that is more likely to secure the win.

That is true, but since Pve objectives arent rewarded, there is no other way to gauge player skill.

[BigScwerl]

r4zen, on 30 January 2018 - 11:39 PM, said:

Sounds like something an embarrassed gen rusher would say

"lol jk guys it was just a big joke haha amirite? ...guys?"

Hhaha Yeah, dang you busted me. OK in all honesty... I hatez shooting mechs.... they are always moving around, and its so hard to focus components =o(. Oh how I dream every night of overheating while I shoot that beautiful box. There is just nothing more glorious than shooting buildings... In other game modes all bacons just walk around the map aimlessly shooting at buildings hoping there is a gen inside we can destroy.

And you're right R4zen... its because we have no skill. although.. I did have 2 solo kills and 3 kmdds against you in 1 match last night...sooo what does that say about your skill? hate the game not the player.

I will say, that the more everyone whines about it, the more fun I think it is. I guess its my inner troll. But this concept that bacon always plays the objective game every time is just nonsense and conjecture. And it is driven by a delicate few that just prefer that their seals line up to receive their clubbing every match.

Edited by BigScwerl, 31 January 2018 - 10:36 AM.