81 replies to this topic

[Verilligo]

Bombast, on 06 February 2018 - 06:59 AM, said:

I can quite honestly say I see absolutely no way to improve that.

More racing stripes, maybe?

[Lykaon]

VonBruinwald, on 06 February 2018 - 06:35 AM, said:

I run around in this!

Wait for it... someone's about to tell me how to improve it....

If you like that build then you need to get the Arctic Wolf hero.

I use a Blood Kit build with an LB20X w/ 4 tons ammo and 4 ER Micros 2 jumpjets and an XL 265 engine.

[mogs01gt]

No-one has ever said anything about my builds....Good players accept the criticism while the bad players stay bad.

[B0oN]

I repeatedly brought Summoner Prime with only 2 ERPPCs in the arms, a TC7 and 4 additional DHS .
People where dropping their wisdom left and right .
And then the dust settled and the rest is poptart history ...

[Bishop Six]

I play more mechs for the lols than serious mechs, especially in QP

QP is like "Woah, i'm drunk, lets have some fun! I'll take my Lurm-Urbie! Awesome!"

It's such a good feeling if you make top damage with lol-mechs

Edit:
Uh...what i wanted to say: Not everyone is taking serious builds into the matches

Edited by Bishop Six, 06 February 2018 - 08:33 AM.

[JC Daxion]

Well i did a bit of testing on top of this, though not with the cyclopes, but a catapult because it is an easy mech to do side by side. In the same mech, with same launch locations as it has 3 hard points in each arm.


Loaded up an A1 with an MRM 30 on one side, and 1 MRM 20+10 on the other side.. I also did a test with MRM 30, and then 3MRM10's (the three has a bit more heat too but was more for comparison.)


At long range, aka near max.. (i was testing at 550) The spread is noticeably larger with the MRM30. Some vollies would actually hit the both legs and both arms and that range. With out moving the mouse and firing the smallersmaller launchers the groupings were far more CT oriented. More often than not a missile would not hit both legs and both arms from the smaller launcher combo. The 3MRM 10's stayed even tighter with very few missiles hitting the arms/legs and some vollies they would only hit just a single leg/arm unlike the MRM30 whiich at times would hit all 4 at the same time. . More missiles with the smaller launcher hit the CT per volley. (i used the cataphract on tourmaline from a bit of a hill)

when i moved up closer to around 250m on the altas, the spread was still noticeable, coring the mech in fewer shots


So they didn't stagger persay, but they did spread more, especially at max range. I think that alone would be worth using the two launchers for the 1 heat depending on the mech. It also seams like the smaller launchers do fire a bit quicker than the large launcher as well. And no it did not seam to have that noticeable stagger that an SRM 6 has firing from a 4 tube for example.

That said, It might be worth upping the mrm 20 launcher for a 30+10, to get a tighter spread than the 40, but that is sort of a different topic and a built tweak.. and not really what the OP was about, that an MRM10+20 is always worse than an MRM 30.


So it comes down to +1 heat, for tighter spread. Feel free to go do some testing yourself.. I had never really did any controlled tests with MRM launchers, and i only have used a 30 and 40 on one mech so far so it was interesting.

[JC Daxion]

Yosharian, on 05 February 2018 - 09:04 PM, said:

I don't much care about your hurt feelings when someone criticises your mech, but please don't pretend your build is very good, because it isn't, it's average at best.

where did i say my build was the greatest thing ever.. i said i was messing around in PUG's a few nights before PIR dropped and playing around. And yes, i do play some assaults with some machine gun backups for lights on mechs with slow recycle times or for upclose brawling near end game. Often you can stuff them in for a tiny tweak on engine size.


For the record, i can probably count on one hand the number of times people have bitched about my builds in matches and when they do i typically don't care. But why this bugged me is because the his rant was basically wrong after doing even more testing there is still merit in the 10+20 verse a 30 if you have the hard points

Like i said, If i wanted to drop in a MRM Cyclopes i would of dropped in my Q

Bishop Six, on 06 February 2018 - 08:32 AM, said:

It's such a good feeling if you make top damage with lol-mechs

Yup i agree with this. Not that i make builds that are Bad on purpose, i make builds that i think could be fun. If they don't work out they get ditched rather quick, and often some of my weird builds actually work for me, especially when i compare them to some long range Meta style mechs which i don't do well in. For example the AC5 meta's that like to pop up.. or PPC's, miss half your shots and it don't matter. Get in a mech that you land 80% your better off.



It's the problem with QP and the game in general.. there are folks that never play anything but the top mechs top builds, and there are others than are just messing around and still others trying something that works, or perhaps is a bit different.

But there is certainly satisfaction playing a mech your good in and destroying someone in the so called Meta of the day. One reason why i love hopping in my 4G, or some of my other favs..

Edited by JC Daxion, 06 February 2018 - 12:11 PM.

[ANOM O MECH]

Rayden Wolf, on 06 February 2018 - 03:54 AM, said:

Dont know mate. If your opponent is a competent light pilot he isnt running in straight lines and you will probably land 5 missles out of your 30. Bad trade. IF you can land a volley, yeah that hurts these little buggers but its rarely seen :/
The best weapons for hunting lights are Pulselaser, LB-AC and Streaks(wich i dont use). I am even more succesfull with SRMs compared to MRMs.

Not talking about making the IV4 a light hunter.

Just personally don't find mrm's bad to get lights off buddies or if they come in close, I will land more than five out of sixty.

Agree with you at the weapons upper range. In close however, mrms don't make me feel anywhere near as vulnerable as say carrying guass where your shot better count.

Again, our experience might differ. We are also not talking about a purpose build light hunter. One of my Bushie P1's does that. IV4 however, is not an easy target for a Mistlynx or Piranha, because you can spray them down in close like your mrm's were a can of Raid.

Oh, and the vast majority of my matches, especially in the last month are all CW.

So not saying you are wrong. I am saying I personally don't find them bad for defending themselves. Seen swarms of Piranha's go down to a few of us IV4's.

[Athom83]

Had someone taking the piss on my 2 UAC/2 Blackjack build... finished the match with 600 damage, 4 kills, and 7 assists. Why was he able to see my build? He rushed ahead and died within the first 2 minutes of the match without even breaking 100 damage... yup.

[Athom83]

Yondu the Ravager, on 04 February 2018 - 09:08 PM, said:

Just have to put this out, some people in the community think they know it all and decide to take matters into their own hands when others do not comply. I had idiots who tell me I should go 'share armor' and brawl on my ERLL BLR-1G, shooting me in the back when I refuse to listen.

The entire point of the assault class is to take damage for their lightly armored teammates... Yah, you should be sharing armor but no it does not need in the brawl. You can support the brawl and draw fire from your mediums and heavies, but when you don't just because you want to build your damage number without taking any damage in return... that's called dragging your team down.

Yondu the Ravager, on 04 February 2018 - 09:08 PM, said:

Of course I turned around and dispatched these fools but the main point is there are such scums in this community who think they are always right and never wrong. Sometimes the best way to show whose boss is to commit some 'war crimes', aka deleting their mech.

No, it is not. The best way is to report them so they are suspended from the matchmaking for a time. When you stoop even lower than them, who are you showing is worse?

Yondu the Ravager, on 04 February 2018 - 09:08 PM, said:

And to those few fools that think you are so damn good, at least learn to aim before taking a shot at my rear because you can't even manage to hit the CT on an almost stationary mech.

You completely missed the point of them shooting you. They DELIBERATELY don't shoot your CT to get your attention as you are deliberately ignoring them. Jesus Christ you are thick.

[Yosharian]

JC Daxion, on 06 February 2018 - 12:05 PM, said:

where did i say my build was the greatest thing ever.. i said i was messing around in PUG's a few nights before PIR dropped and playing around. And yes, i do play some assaults with some machine gun backups for lights on mechs with slow recycle times or for upclose brawling near end game. Often you can stuff them in for a tiny tweak on engine size.


For the record, i can probably count on one hand the number of times people have bitched about my builds in matches and when they do i typically don't care. But why this bugged me is because the his rant was basically wrong after doing even more testing there is still merit in the 10+20 verse a 30 if you have the hard points

Like i said, If i wanted to drop in a MRM Cyclopes i would of dropped in my Q

I'm simply making the observation that there are several improvements you could make to your build that would make it objectively better. Bringing MRM60 over MRM30 is far better than bringing some Machineguns and a single SSRM6. MRMs are quite deadly against lights if you take the time to aim your shots, and I'm quite sure than an extra MRM30 is going to do more damage in 'upclose brawling near end game' than a few Machineguns.

That said, if you desperately wanted to bring the Machineguns you could drop some MRM tubes anyway, but a single SSRM6 is just not worth it. You should be torso twisting though, and Machineguns aren't good for that. If you're just staring at your opponent holding down your Machinegun hotkey then... well, you do you.

Anyway, if you want to bring a joke mech into QP then that's your choice, but if you want to be effective, there are better ways to do it.

Athom83, on 06 February 2018 - 01:24 PM, said:

Had someone taking the piss on my 2 UAC/2 Blackjack build... finished the match with 600 damage, 4 kills, and 7 assists. Why was he able to see my build? He rushed ahead and died within the first 2 minutes of the match without even breaking 100 damage... yup.

AC2s generally are in a much, much better place than they were, say, a year ago, to be fair.

tker 669, on 06 February 2018 - 01:15 PM, said:

Not talking about making the IV4 a light hunter.

Just personally don't find mrm's bad to get lights off buddies or if they come in close, I will land more than five out of sixty.

Agree with you at the weapons upper range. In close however, mrms don't make me feel anywhere near as vulnerable as say carrying guass where your shot better count.

Again, our experience might differ. We are also not talking about a purpose build light hunter. One of my Bushie P1's does that. IV4 however, is not an easy target for a Mistlynx or Piranha, because you can spray them down in close like your mrm's were a can of Raid.

Oh, and the vast majority of my matches, especially in the last month are all CW.

So not saying you are wrong. I am saying I personally don't find them bad for defending themselves. Seen swarms of Piranha's go down to a few of us IV4's.

I guess I'm incompetent because when I'm running a light and I see MRMs I GTFO

Edited by Yosharian, 06 February 2018 - 05:29 PM.

[Athom83]

Yosharian, on 06 February 2018 - 05:09 PM, said:

AC2s generally are in a much, much better place than they were, say, a year ago, to be fair.

True... except I used Ultra 2s and this was about a month ago...

[Yondu Udonta]

Athom83, on 06 February 2018 - 01:37 PM, said:

The entire point of the assault class is to take damage for their lightly armored teammates... Yah, you should be sharing armor but no it does not need in the brawl. You can support the brawl and draw fire from your mediums and heavies, but when you don't just because you want to build your damage number without taking any damage in return... that's called dragging your team down.


No, it is not. The best way is to report them so they are suspended from the matchmaking for a time. When you stoop even lower than them, who are you showing is worse


You completely missed the point of them shooting you. They DELIBERATELY don't shoot your CT to get your attention as you are deliberately ignoring them. Jesus Christ you are thick.

I forgot I was in the general discussion section of the forums and not in the faction play section. Probably need to explain things more clearly here.

My mech is built to snipe. Why go into the brawl when my job is to pick off targets with the wide field of vision I have at range? Besides, compared to brawl-based mechs my sustained DPS is significantly lower than them, hence I cannot be in an extended teamfight which is the case in brawls. It is too bad that the IS top sniping mech is an assault that possesses plenty of armor.

If you think every reported case is a confirmed case of suspension you are wrong. I have reported plenty of players deliberately ejecting from their mechs in FP because they refuse to play against a stronger opponent and yet I still see them around in games. An act of self-defense is never wrong, how can you even suggest that it is worse than what the provocateur did?

Could you please restructure your sentence? Getting shot in the back when one is facing the enemy is sure to get the attention of any pilot. What are you even trying to say?

[Bohxim]

^ unfortunately, an act of retaliation in self defense is still an offense based on the COC. Whilst not as bad, still penalised and a reportable act.
That however does not discount the satisfaction of doing so tho.

[Yosharian]

Athom83, on 06 February 2018 - 07:00 PM, said:

True... except I used Ultra 2s and this was about a month ago...

Yes but my point is that AC2s were a bad weapon for a long time. They are better now, but the weapon still has a bad rep attached to it because it underperformed for so long

[Yondu Udonta]

Bohxim, on 06 February 2018 - 08:19 PM, said:

^ unfortunately, an act of retaliation in self defense is still an offense based on the COC. Whilst not as bad, still penalised and a reportable act.
That however does not discount the satisfaction of doing so tho.

I admit it is considered as an offence. But who's gonna report me? Not my teammates since I would inform my teammates initially before I retaliate. Not the enemy because hell yea that TKer just made my game easier. The TKed would but his report will go ignored considering that he started the trouble first.

And goddamn yes, the satisfaction of showing who's the better one on the battlefield.

[Dee Eight]

JC Daxion, on 04 February 2018 - 04:22 PM, said:

Because i did not want to make that giant rack on the shoulder.. because adding a mrm 10 or 20 would do that as it adds a huge hitbox, and tube count makes the 30 stagger, not the 10+20

and yes, i have another that has a larger MRM count.. but that is not the point. the point is, don't rant when you have facts completely wrong.

MRM's don't rely on tube counts the same way as LRMs do. MRM's all stream fire like clan LRM launchers. The # of tubes on the mech only slightly impacts the time for the full stream to leave the tubes. There's no pause between volleys like what happens when you install an LRM20 on a mech with a 10, 6 or 5 tube limit hardpoint (such as on an Atlas D-DC where the first hardpoint has 10 tubes, and the other two have six max if SRMs or 5 if its LRM/MRMs fitted) so its not as if your aim gets affected by a burp in the stream. Now you could have tried explaining that the component health of the two launchers add up to more than the single larger launcher as a reason to run the MRM10/20 combo over the MRM30.

The video link Bombast posted up took used a Trebuchet with 20 tube hardpoints and with that mech you have to get off more than a dozen volleys in a row at the same target to start to see the nearly insignificant differences add up to anything meaning in it. I also suspect that video is out of date and PGI actually has fixed the stream bug because I just took an Atlas D-DC into testing grounds and after TWENTY volleys there was no difference in the firing cycle of an MRM10 and an MRM30 on the same weapon group. I fitted that D-DC with the MRM10 in the first hardpoint (which has 10 tubes) and the MRM30 in the second (which has 5 tubes) and the time for the entire stream from either hardpoint to leave was less than a second.

Now what was that you were saying about having facts completely wrong ?

[Dee Eight]

Verilligo, on 05 February 2018 - 06:21 AM, said:

I'm not as certain of this. While a 30 count of MRMs on a Cyclops is absolutely a bad idea, doesn't 20+10 have a somewhat significantly lower spread than one 30? If you can cram them all in the same section without compromising geometry or convergence, the additional 1 heat seems paltry to having a little more focused damage. Albeit there are only a few instances where running a build like that would be an option on the table, mostly with things like the Hellspawn.

The spread of the MRM10 & 20 is 4.3 meters and the MRM30 is 4.5 meters.

[Jingseng]

one time someone told me in chat to "play a real mech".

Pretty sure that was because I had just killed him though.

[Athom83]

Yondu the Ravager, on 06 February 2018 - 08:12 PM, said:

My mech is built to snipe. Why go into the brawl when my job is to pick off targets with the wide field of vision I have at range? Besides, compared to brawl-based mechs my sustained DPS is significantly lower than them, hence I cannot be in an extended teamfight which is the case in brawls.

I see the problem here. You keep relating sharing armor with brawling. Those two things are not mutually inclusive. You can still share armor while being at range by forcing the enemy to pay attention to you at range instead of pining down your other teammates who are in the "brawl".

Yondu the Ravager, on 06 February 2018 - 08:12 PM, said:

It is too bad that the IS top sniping mech is an assault that possesses plenty of armor.

Debatable. Black Knight, Thanatos, Grasshopper, and Thunderbolt are also up there and some are better in situations than the Battlemaster.

Yondu the Ravager, on 06 February 2018 - 08:12 PM, said:

If you think every reported case is a confirmed case of suspension you are wrong. I have reported plenty of players deliberately ejecting from their mechs in FP because they refuse to play against a stronger opponent and yet I still see them around in games.

1) Reports are cumulative. The more they get reported the longer and longer the in-between match suspension lasts for until they accrue enough reports to be banned.
2) Never said every case reported leads to suspension, just that it is likely with enough reports.

Yondu the Ravager, on 06 February 2018 - 08:12 PM, said:

An act of self-defense is never wrong, how can you even suggest that it is worse than what the provocateur did?

Because he damaged a non-critical part of you to make a point instead of outright TKing like you did? Its like when a coworker slaps you upside the head because you were doing something dumb and you take out a gun and blast him in the face...

Yondu the Ravager, on 06 February 2018 - 08:12 PM, said:

Could you please restructure your sentence? Getting shot in the back when one is facing the enemy is sure to get the attention of any pilot. What are you even trying to say?

Didn't need to because it was self explanatory, but fine. When they shot you in the back, they were not aiming to shoot out your CT nor were they likely using all of their weapons. The reason they shot you was to get your attention from your tunnel vision sniping to get you to notice that armor is needed closer to the fight while you were still in the back sniping away in an assault. Now, I do not know the full story here because you seem to be leaving out information on the situation so you could have been in the right. However I am giving the side that sees what you were doing to be in the wrong.