42 replies to this topic

[Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood]

Giving the K a ballistic and missile in each torso would help it out a lot. Could do some neato stuff like dual UAC10s with dual MRM20s for a nice 80 damage alpha with a bit of extra DPS thrown in to make it competitive with the UAC20+MRM60 builds. Would also allow it to have dual gauss and dual hgauss and whatever people want on it.

[Angus McFife VI]

Alright alright, so how do we get this to PGI?

[Athom83]

Dont LRM me please, on 07 February 2018 - 05:05 PM, said:

The Atlas S is no longer superior because the Atlas D can just load two MRM30's and deal around the same amount of damage 4 SRM6's could do but much further away with much less heat. Not to mention it can even do it with a light fusion engine. THIS DOES NOT MEAN NERF THE ATLAS D.

I mean... you can just load the same AS7-D build in the AS7-S but you can't do the reverse... so...

Dont LRM me please, on 07 February 2018 - 05:18 PM, said:

I'm just thinking make the Atlas as tanky or near so as the Annihilators, and I feel as if the D and K do it adequately, although maybe a bit less tanky.

Which is funny... as the Atlas is supposed to have like ~35% more armor than an Annihilator.

[Angus McFife VI]

Athom83, on 07 February 2018 - 06:56 PM, said:

I mean... you can just load the same AS7-D build in the AS7-S but you can't do the reverse... so...

Yeah and it's almost objectively superior than 4 SRM6 on the Atlas-S. You can load an LFE, shoot way further than 270 meters with MRM60. You can also load two RAC5, two LBX10 or two Ultra AC5, which work pretty good on the D. There are plenty of mechs that can replicate eachother's builds, but some do it better or have more options than others.

[Khobai]

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Which is funny... as the Atlas is supposed to have like ~35% more armor than an Annihilator.

35% more armor is a bit excessive lol.

I think this would be fine:

annihilator gets armor quirks +25a, +20a, +20a

atlas should get combined armor/structure quirks +26a/13s, +23a/12s, +23a/12s and torso pitch increased to 20-25 degrees along with the other changes we discussed for the specific variants (like 1B in each side torso for the K variant)

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Yeah and it's almost objectively superior than 4 SRM6 on the Atlas-S

to be fair SRMs could use a buff. increasing SRM damage to 2.15 for clans and 2.3 for IS would be a good start.

And if that isnt enough, MRMs might need damage dropoff under 90m. MRMs are not really supposed to be point blank splat weapons and they certainly shouldnt be better at point blank splat than SRMs.

It might be necessary to make MRMs worse at point blank splat in order to keep SRMs relevant in that role.

Edited by Khobai, 07 February 2018 - 07:14 PM.

[Athom83]

Dont LRM me please, on 07 February 2018 - 07:00 PM, said:

Yeah and it's almost objectively superior than 4 SRM6 on the Atlas-S. You can load an LFE, shoot way further than 270 meters with MRM60. You can also load two RAC5, two LBX10 or two Ultra AC5, which work pretty good on the D. There are plenty of mechs that can replicate eachother's builds, but some do it better or have more options than others.

Shhh... don't reveal ma secrets .

Khobai, on 07 February 2018 - 07:03 PM, said:

35% more armor is a bit excessive lol.
I think this would be fine: annihilator gets armor quirks +25a, +20a, +20a atlas gets combined armor/structure quirks +26a/13s, +23a/12s, +23a/12s and torso pitch increased to 20-25 degrees

Yah... Anni had like 12.5t of standard armor... the Atlas carried 19.5t.

[Angus McFife VI]

Khobai, on 07 February 2018 - 07:03 PM, said:

And if that isnt enough, MRMs might need damage dropoff under 90m. MRMs are not really supposed to be point blank splat weapons and they certainly shouldnt be better at point blank splat than SRMs.

It might be necessary to make MRMs worse at point blank splat in order to keep SRMs relevant in that role.

No please don't touch MRMs, they're super heavy no no no no no no no

[CFC Conky]

Dont LRM me please, on 07 February 2018 - 05:05 PM, said:

...


PS: I could also make a similar argument with the Nightstars but I don't own a nightstar, but out of what I've heard they're horrible.

The Nightstar isn't too bad, but with the advent of 12-machine gun mechs, having lots of armor becomes much more important to survival.

Good hunting,
CFC Conky

[Khobai]

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No please don't touch MRMs, they're super heavy no no no no no no no

MRMs are too good at point blank splat compared to SRMs

that needs to be fixed. SRMs deserve a place in the game too.

Giving MRMs damage dropoff under 90m in exchange for an increase in damage above 90m is a fair tradeoff

That change helps keep SRMs relevant as point blank splat weapons. And it makes MRMs better at medium range, which is the range theyre supposed to be used at.

MRMs should not be used to point blank splat. If you want to point blank splat you should use SRMs. Its almost like different weapons have different roles OMG.

Edited by Khobai, 07 February 2018 - 07:37 PM.

[Humpday]

Needs something. I need a reason to buy it.
I dont' have an atlas...one of the, if not the most Iconic mech in Battletech.

What a travesty....PGI please.

[PocketYoda]

Nightstars are a lot worse.. They are about on a par with the marauder but with a larger hit box..

[Humpday]

Samial, on 07 February 2018 - 09:15 PM, said:

Nightstars are a lot worse.. They are about on a par with the marauder but with a larger hit box..

Um what? The MAD and MAD-IIC are some of the strongest mechs in the game.

Dafuk!?

[cougurt]

they could also just give the atlas the ability to twist reasonably well. with a few exceptions, all of the 90+ tonners should handle about as well as the cyclops.

[Khobai]

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they could also just give the atlas the ability to twist reasonably well. with a few exceptions, all of the 90+ tonners should handle about as well as the cyclops.

all mechs need to torso twist to stay alive

there shouldnt be any exceptions to that

[Johnathan Von Tanner]

Khobai, on 08 February 2018 - 01:42 AM, said:

all mechs need to torso twist to stay alive

there shouldnt be any exceptions to that

Yup the engine desnyc is what hurt the atlas most of all.

[cougurt]

Khobai, on 08 February 2018 - 01:42 AM, said:

all mechs need to torso twist to stay alive

there shouldnt be any exceptions to that

i think the annihilator and dire wolf should retain their characteristic sluggishness, though the dire wolf could use some defensive quirks to compensate for it. the atlas seriously needs an agility buff though given that it needs to get up close and personal in order to be effective.

[Khobai]

the annihilator should be one of the least agile mechs. but even the least agile mech should still be agile enough to torso twist.

you cannot make any mech so unagile that it loses the ability to torso twist

because torso twisting is a crucial skill for survival. mechs without the ability to torso twist are outright inferior to mechs that can torso twist. because theyre spreading out damage across different locations while youre getting drilled in the same location. torso twisting may only extend your mechlife by 10%-15% but its still better than nothing.


PGI needs to redo engine desync by setting the lowest agility at a point where its still possible to torso twist. and go from there.

Edited by Khobai, 08 February 2018 - 02:10 AM.

[meteorol]

Atlas needs more than armor quirks.

I have spent hundreds of hours in my Atlas back in the days (in fact, it was the only mech i ever piloted back from CB until the HGN was released).

It's one of the mechs with ragtag hardpoints that can't really boat anything and is thereby forced into a mid/closerange role which is an absolute pain in the *** to play on 100t assaults thanks to mobility values.

• I'd like to see armor quirks for all variants. No structure, structure is useless trash thanks to the crit system.
  
• Considerable buff to mobility. It's a wide as a barn, close to midrange mech with terribly low mounts. It needs torso twist speed to deal with incoming damage, armor quirks won't save it.

While we are at it, also add considerable buffs to the Spirit Bears mobility, but zero armor quirks. I'd like to see both the Spirit Bear and the Atlas as viable 100t options with the spirit bear edging out on mobility, and the atlas heaving considerably better durability.

edit: fixed a few things

Edited by meteorol, 08 February 2018 - 02:09 AM.

[cougurt]

Khobai, on 08 February 2018 - 02:05 AM, said:

the annihilator should be one of the least agile mechs. but even the least agile mech should still be agile enough to torso twist.

you cannot make any mech so unagile that it loses the ability to torso twist

because torso twisting is a crucial skill for survival.

i don't really disagree with you, but the annihilator is pretty strong as it is. i would be somewhat hesitant to buff its agility unless its armor quirks were reduced as well. the dire wolf probably wouldn't benefit that much since its hitboxes prevent it from effectively spreading damage anyway. ideally these would be things you could tailor to your own preferences through the skill tree, but i don't see them making any major changes to that any time soon.

meteorol, on 08 February 2018 - 02:06 AM, said:

Atlas needs more than armor quirks.

I have spent hundreds of hours in my Atlas back in the days (in fact, it was the only mech i ever piloted back from CB until the HGN was released).

It's one of the mechs with ragtag hardpoints that can't really boat anything and is thereby forced into a mid/closerange role which is an absolute pain in the *** to play on 100t assaults thanks to mobility values.

• I'd like to see armor quirks for all variants. No structure, structure is useless trash thanks to the crit system.
  
• Considerable buff to mobility. It's a wide as a barn, close to midrange mech with terribly low mounts. It needs torso twist speed to deal with incoming damage, armor quirks won't save it.

While we are at it, also add considerable buffs to the Spirit Bears mobility, but zero armor quirks. I'd like to see both the Spirit Bear and the Atlas as viable 100t options with the spirit bear edging out on mobility, and the atlas heaving considerably better durability.





edit: fixed a few things

this is exactly what i want as well, and it's pretty much what we had pre-skill tree and engine desync.

[meteorol]

Khobai, on 08 February 2018 - 02:05 AM, said:

the annihilator should be one of the least agile mechs. but even the least agile mech should still be agile enough to torso twist.

you cannot make any mech so unagile that it loses the ability to torso twist

because torso twisting is a crucial skill for survival. mechs without the ability to torso twist are outright inferior to mechs that can torso twist. because theyre spreading out damage across different locations while youre getting drilled in the same location. torso twisting may only extend your mechlife by 10%-15% but its still better than nothing.


PGI needs to redo engine desync by setting the lowest agility at a point where its still possible to torso twist. and go from there.

Honestly, i don't think any changes are needed for the Anni, it's in a very good spot right now. The thing is already among the few strongest mechs in the game, despite its low agility. Unlike the Atlas it can play around the mobiltiy stats thanks to its better hitboxes and way better boating abilities.



That is T1 soloqueue, allegedly the worst place for 100t assaults with a low engine cap, because they constantly get left behind and ganked etc. etc.

Despite its shortcomming in mobiltiy and speed, it's a monster for people who are somewhat decent with assaults. Bad pilots will die to their bad positioning, movement and general lack of awareness, but that is not on the mech. The ANH is brutal when played to its strenghts, but brutally punishes mistakes as well (there is no way you will get out alive if you messed up on positioning and movment). IMO, it's one of the mechs that's in a perfect spot currently.

Edited by meteorol, 08 February 2018 - 02:50 AM.