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#101 Tesunie

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Posted 03 March 2018 - 12:29 PM

View PostSpare Parts Bin, on 03 March 2018 - 12:23 PM, said:

Why so little ammo? I get nervous unless I have 60-100 rounds.


Personally I find two to two and a half tons of ammo is sufficient. Otherwise, I tend to die with far to much ammo left, which means wasted tonnage. Of course, this presumes I also have back up weapons, such as lasers or something.

All too often, I find people place way more ammo than they need, which reduces their combat effectiveness.

#102 jss78

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Posted 03 March 2018 - 12:33 PM

View PostTesunie, on 03 March 2018 - 12:29 PM, said:

Personally I find two to two and a half tons of ammo is sufficient. Otherwise, I tend to die with far to much ammo left, which means wasted tonnage. Of course, this presumes I also have back up weapons, such as lasers or something.

All too often, I find people place way more ammo than they need, which reduces their combat effectiveness.


Yeah, 2-2½ tons is about right for AC/10 for me.

As a new player, it's highly recommended that you pay attention to how much ammo you use. Do you always have a ton or more remaining at the end? This means you're wasting tonnage that could be used elsewhere.

Optimally, you will occasionally run out of ammo. This means in the vast majority of games you've done good use of your tonnage.

#103 Spare Parts Bin

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Posted 03 March 2018 - 01:03 PM

View PostTesunie, on 03 March 2018 - 12:29 PM, said:


Personally I find two to two and a half tons of ammo is sufficient. Otherwise, I tend to die with far to much ammo left, which means wasted tonnage. Of course, this presumes I also have back up weapons, such as lasers or something.

All too often, I find people place way more ammo than they need, which reduces their combat effectiveness.


I have been pretty battle damaged and sometimes the extra ammo is all I got left. You never forget this stuff when it happens.


#104 CFC Conky

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Posted 03 March 2018 - 05:57 PM

Hi Bin,

Tell you what, try taking your build out with two tons of ammo for the AC10. You have a decent number and type of backup weapons so you will still be able to hurt the enemy if you run out of AC10 rounds. I'm willing to bet you won't run out very often, at least in quickplay.

Good hunting,
CFC Conky

#105 Spare Parts Bin

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Posted 03 March 2018 - 06:04 PM

View PostCFC Conky, on 03 March 2018 - 05:57 PM, said:

Hi Bin,

Tell you what, try taking your build out with two tons of ammo for the AC10. You have a decent number and type of backup weapons so you will still be able to hurt the enemy if you run out of AC10 rounds. I'm willing to bet you won't run out very often, at least in quickplay.

Good hunting,
CFC Conky


Will try this out, I will not be back to my computer until Tuesday.

#106 Horseman

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Posted 04 March 2018 - 01:27 AM

View PostSpare Parts Bin, on 03 March 2018 - 12:23 PM, said:

Why so little ammo? I get nervous unless I have 60-100 rounds.
In my experience, 25 salvos is a good rule of thumb for a typical Quick Play match (except for some very specific high-ROF weapons). If you survive long enough to run out, tack on another ton until you arrive at a balance where by the end of a successful match you either just barely run out or are close to it.

Edited by Horseman, 04 March 2018 - 01:27 AM.


#107 Spare Parts Bin

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Posted 04 March 2018 - 06:42 AM

View PostCFC Conky, on 03 March 2018 - 05:57 PM, said:

Hi Bin,

Tell you what, try taking your build out with two tons of ammo for the AC10. You have a decent number and type of backup weapons so you will still be able to hurt the enemy if you run out of AC10 rounds. I'm willing to bet you won't run out very often, at least in quickplay.

Good hunting,
CFC Conky

View PostHorseman, on 04 March 2018 - 01:27 AM, said:

In my experience, 25 salvos is a good rule of thumb for a typical Quick Play match (except for some very specific high-ROF weapons). If you survive long enough to run out, tack on another ton until you arrive at a balance where by the end of a successful match you either just barely run out or are close to it.


I will reevaluate the tonnage I devote to ammo.

#108 Horseman

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Posted 04 March 2018 - 08:32 AM

View PostSpare Parts Bin, on 04 March 2018 - 06:42 AM, said:

I will reevaluate the tonnage I devote to ammo.
Look at it this way:
  • If you still have a ton or more of ammo at the end of the match, then that ton of ammo did not benefit you in any way.
  • If you still have ammo after losing weapons that used it, you're basically sitting on an unexploded bomb that can easily cripple or destroy your mech if an enemy scores a lucky hit.
Another way to evaluate is to take the mech into testing grounds on Canyon Network - if the ammo is barely enough to kill all eight mechs (going for CT on Cataphract and AWS, backshots on everything else), then it should be enough for the match. There are exceptions, of course - certain builds tend to spread damage too much or aren't particularly good at prolonged engagements - and it depends on your ability to place shots accurately.
Same test can be used to evaluate how your mech handles heat management and if it delivers enough DPS to be effective in combat ( a good build should be able to do that run within 3.5 to 4 minutes, again exceptions for mechs like Annihilator )

#109 Spare Parts Bin

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Posted 04 March 2018 - 02:18 PM

View PostHorseman, on 04 March 2018 - 08:32 AM, said:

Look at it this way:
  • If you still have a ton or more of ammo at the end of the match, then that ton of ammo did not benefit you in any way.
  • If you still have ammo after losing weapons that used it, you're basically sitting on an unexploded bomb that can easily cripple or destroy your mech if an enemy scores a lucky hit.
Another way to evaluate is to take the mech into testing grounds on Canyon Network - if the ammo is barely enough to kill all eight mechs (going for CT on Cataphract and AWS, backshots on everything else), then it should be enough for the match. There are exceptions, of course - certain builds tend to spread damage too much or aren't particularly good at prolonged engagements - and it depends on your ability to place shots accurately.
Same test can be used to evaluate how your mech handles heat management and if it delivers enough DPS to be effective in combat ( a good build should be able to do that run within 3.5 to 4 minutes, again exceptions for mechs like Annihilator )


That sums it up in a nutshell.

#110 Tesunie

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Posted 04 March 2018 - 03:52 PM

View PostHorseman, on 04 March 2018 - 08:32 AM, said:

Another way to evaluate is to take the mech into testing grounds on Canyon Network - if the ammo is barely enough to kill all eight mechs (going for CT on Cataphract and AWS, backshots on everything else), then it should be enough for the match. There are exceptions, of course - certain builds tend to spread damage too much or aren't particularly good at prolonged engagements - and it depends on your ability to place shots accurately.

Same test can be used to evaluate how your mech handles heat management and if it delivers enough DPS to be effective in combat ( a good build should be able to do that run within 3.5 to 4 minutes, again exceptions for mechs like Annihilator )


I do this same test, except on Tourmaline. I try to do the run without overheating once, killing all mechs in any reasonable fashion (back shoot the Atlas, maybe the Catapult, then legs or CT the rest) and the goal is to finish all eight mechs before or around 5 minutes. It's a good heat stress test.

I have my Jaggermech that can't finish before running out of ammo, but it gets to the last mech when it runs out, so I consider it reasonable. One of my very few all ammo designs.

#111 Spare Parts Bin

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Posted 04 March 2018 - 03:59 PM

It has been years since I have run a Jagermech, are those good again? I thought those got nerf hammered!

Edited by Spare Parts Bin, 04 March 2018 - 04:01 PM.


#112 Tesunie

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Posted 04 March 2018 - 04:28 PM

View PostSpare Parts Bin, on 04 March 2018 - 03:59 PM, said:

It has been years since I have run a Jagermech, are those good again? I thought those got nerf hammered!


I don't pull them out much. Not really a mech for me, but it seems to do well enough to be fun to use. I don't normally worry about nerfed or buffed mechs and stuff. I just pick a mech and play it. Either it works for me, or it doesn't.

I know Battlemasters are considered rather good mechs, yet I can't seem to do much of anything with them. But my Zeus, a mech considered horrible in comparison, I seem to do fairly well in.... Just for an example.

#113 Spare Parts Bin

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Posted 04 March 2018 - 04:36 PM

View PostTesunie, on 04 March 2018 - 04:28 PM, said:


I don't pull them out much. Not really a mech for me, but it seems to do well enough to be fun to use. I don't normally worry about nerfed or buffed mechs and stuff. I just pick a mech and play it. Either it works for me, or it doesn't.

I know Battlemasters are considered rather good mechs, yet I can't seem to do much of anything with them. But my Zeus, a mech considered horrible in comparison, I seem to do fairly well in.... Just for an example.


I need to take a look at the Firebrand again.

#114 Tier5ForLife

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Posted 04 March 2018 - 05:05 PM

View Postjustcallme A S H, on 23 February 2018 - 01:36 AM, said:

Without being rude, there are far better streamers to watch if you want to learn/improve at the game.

Bearclaw / Juju / TheB33f / Writhen / Solitude / Machiina

Etc. All are top level players you wanna learn from and if you ask they will run you through stuff generally. Hell even watch mine (just getting started recently). Although mine is more Oceanic time right now



I know the B33f but I can't find these others. Are they on youtube or twitch?

#115 Spare Parts Bin

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Posted 04 March 2018 - 05:18 PM

View PostLikeUntoBuddha, on 04 March 2018 - 05:05 PM, said:



I know the B33f but I can't find these others. Are they on youtube or twitch?


Bearclaw,Baradul/Molten Metal and JuJu are on You Tube.

#116 justcallme A S H

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Posted 04 March 2018 - 06:02 PM

View PostLikeUntoBuddha, on 04 March 2018 - 05:05 PM, said:

I know the B33f but I can't find these others. Are they on youtube or twitch?


Twitch.

https://www.twitch.tv/the_b33f
https://www.twitch.tv/writhenn
https://www.twitch.tv/jujushinobi
https://www.twitch.tv/bear_cl4w
https://www.twitch.tv/machiiina
https://www.twitch.tv/solitude_mwo
https://www.twitch.tv/twinkyoverlord

There are a few more but yeah, those are the ones you REALLY want to be checking out. I've put them in order of roughly how often they stream to to make it a bit easier but all of the are the ELITE of MWO.

Watch loadouts, positioning, how they mitigate incoming fire etc.

Edited by justcallme A S H, 04 March 2018 - 06:03 PM.


#117 Horseman

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Posted 04 March 2018 - 11:26 PM

All of them run YouTube channels, though not all upload content there regularly.

#118 VitriolicViolet

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 06:36 PM

one thing that should be kept in mind with K/D in particular is that getting kills isnt actually that useful. the amount of games ive seen where 1-3 players whale on an Anni that has nothing but 2 MLs while getting hammered by mediums is ridiculous.
Once an enemy is incapable or near incapable of dealing damage its a literal waste of time to keep shooting it, ive seen people lose when they should win because they are so intent on the kill they dont realise that shooting something that cant hurt them is pointless, they end up being back cored by the enemy mech that still has weapons.

#119 Spare Parts Bin

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 07:07 PM

View PostVitriolicViolet, on 19 March 2018 - 06:36 PM, said:

one thing that should be kept in mind with K/D in particular is that getting kills isnt actually that useful. the amount of games ive seen where 1-3 players whale on an Anni that has nothing but 2 MLs while getting hammered by mediums is ridiculous.
Once an enemy is incapable or near incapable of dealing damage its a literal waste of time to keep shooting it, ive seen people lose when they should win because they are so intent on the kill they dont realise that shooting something that cant hurt them is pointless, they end up being back cored by the enemy mech that still has weapons.


I have done the same thing many times it is bloodlust pure and simple.

#120 TheBlackBear

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Posted 30 July 2020 - 09:53 AM

Generalization leads to victory, specialization to defeat.





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