147 replies to this topic

[Tina Benoit]

Greetings MechWarriors,


The initial intent behind the Player Card in Solaris was to show other players’ standings/stats, an image of their last played ‘Mech in the respective division and a sneak peek at their weapon loadout.

It was discovered that players could look at another player’s Player Card and click MechLab which displayed the entire ‘Mech’s build information. This was never planned to be in place. However, this bug has raised the question… should it be there by design? If so, should we also consider allowing players to look at another player’s Skill Tree for that particular ‘Mech?

These are the questions we’d like to hear your feedback on. It’s not a poll or a vote, it’s to hear your thoughts on why/why not this capability should be a feature of the Solaris Player Card.

Please refrain from non-constructive or off-topic discussions or arguing over thoughts from other players. As stated, this is not about popular vote but thoughts on the competitive aspects of Solaris.

Thank you for your feedback!

[SICk Nick]

First off, let me say thank you so much for offering the opportunity to allow input from the populous.

In my opinion , Yes. The build should be shown since there is a lot of
Variance within divisions on how powerful some mechs are over others.
(I never knew seeing builds was an option)

A skilled player with time in the game has the money to buy a solid mech that is hard to beat. Novice players will be able to see the load out and curb their learning curve, and more experienced players will find weakness to attempt to exploit. This will bridge the gap between some of the weaker mechs VS the tougher mechs in each Division.

Knowing where a single ton of ammo is kept, for example, will give a garbage mech a chance against a bad a$$ build.

Maybe MAKE IT VISIBLE FOR C BILLS? In real life if you’re going to fight in the ring, you can do all kinds of research on your opponent. The more you spend, the more you can learn.

Edited by SICk Nick, 26 April 2018 - 01:16 AM.

[Liveish]

Yes please add the mechlab and skill tree, It's a great way for people to get better and keep up with the meta.

[CptJudas]

I think showing the builds greatly helps the new player experience and helps the players that are looking to improve their game. Don't really see a downside to it. Most high skilled players can figure out the builds on their own anyway.

[Throe]

[deleted by user]

Edited by Throe, 08 November 2018 - 05:41 PM.

[Small Baguette]

I think this is one of those happy little mistakes that works out for the best, I think it should be left and allowed.

People will figure out how to min/max and will post builds on forums, sites etc so it's no harm to make the process a bit more accessible for the regular player that doesn't have the time to invest in researching as much. I would rather players be closer in terms of build and mech quality, with matches being won more by skill than by build. This doesn't stop certain mechs and builds being strong against other mechs and builds, it would just help avoid people running absolutely terrible mechs that they would never have a chance of winning in. That's just not fun for either party involved.

I really really strongly believe that being able to see the other player's mech and skill tree is a good thing.

[Throe]

[deleted by user]

Edited by Throe, 08 November 2018 - 05:37 PM.

[Dracol]

For years, Smurfy has been showing popular builds. People link builds all the time. Seeing how people build their mechs has been a staple of BTech /MW. I say keep it in.

If Solaris is about being the best pilot, then a top player should not need to hide a secret combination of heat sinks, armour values, and options.

[Sagamore]

Yes, seeing loadouts is good for the game. Take it one step further and have an “add to cart” button so you can buy the exact mech and loadout

[Dracol]

Throe, on 25 April 2018 - 04:35 PM, said:

This bug didn't reveal such information, and I think that such information should be kept secret. The loadout information is restricted I believe, to the same information you can normally see when you have "Target Information" loaded in a match, and is combined only with the image of the 'Mech in question(so you can determine which weapons are mounted in which components, but things like heat sinks, jump jets, engine size, and other equipment are still "secret".

The bug actually allows you to see the mech in full detail in the mech lab view.

Intented implementation would have provided just the card, which shows just a tad bit more then the target information, such as weapon location, but not all the details.

[Throe]

[deleted by user]

Edited by Throe, 08 November 2018 - 05:35 PM.

[Lurch98]

A crutch for poor players to copy builds instead of trying to figure out some meta themselves will help even the playing fields a bit, I guess. Some of the more competitive minded players already change the mechs before they put them back in their mechlab to prevent this.

I vote no, but I doubt it'll matter.

[Paul Inouye]

Throe, on 25 April 2018 - 04:46 PM, said:

While I wouldn't argue that Solaris is about being the best pilot, there are portions of a 'Mech's loadout which is still secret in matches. I think this "offline" information should be limited to the same things you can see in a match against any given opponent. Weapons and weapon locations. Nothing more.

This bug did not reveal non-weapon equipment, armor values, or Skill selections, all of which can safely be kept proprietary to each pilot. It adds another level of depth to the top tier of game play, and gives those top pilots a method to differentiate their builds, since part of being a top pilot is in the 'Mechlab.

Go to Solaris. Pick someone on the Leaderboard and look at their Player Card. Now click the MechLab button. You can see what color underroos he's wearing.

Good feedback so far folks.. thanks.. I'll be watching it over the next few days.

Lurch98, on 25 April 2018 - 04:49 PM, said:

A crutch for poor players to copy builds instead of trying to figure out some meta themselves will help even the playing fields a bit, I guess. Some of the more competitive minded players already change the mechs before they put them back in their mechlab to prevent this. I vote no, but I doubt it'll matter.

As mentioned, this isn't a popularity vote.. your feedback is very appreciated.

[Atlai]

I think it is a great thing. It let's players who may not be as skilled in crafting mechs view builds that are way more competitive, and then learn from that in their own building.

Like someone else said above me, even going a step further and adding a "add to cart" option might be a pretty good idea.

Also, I think it would be a good idea to allow people to view skill allotment as well. Some people might not be used to the skill tree yet, or maybe they don't know how it works at all or what is good to invest in, so showing them what the elite players are doing would probably do way more good than harm. I actually can't think of any way this harms the elite players to be honest.

Lurch98, on 25 April 2018 - 04:49 PM, said:

A crutch for poor players to copy builds instead of trying to figure out some meta themselves will help even the playing fields a bit, I guess. Some of the more competitive minded players already change the mechs before they put them back in their mechlab to prevent this.

I vote no, but I doubt it'll matter.

I think this is a very poor mindset. Think about it, would an elite player want no one else to ever learn and become good at the game? If showing their builds helps newer or inexperienced players learn, then isn't that a good thing? I don't see how this hurts the elite players at all, and changing your build after each match to hide it is really rather petty and somewhat sad.

[Throe]

[deleted by user]

Edited by Throe, 08 November 2018 - 05:39 PM.

[Throe]

[deleted by user]

Edited by Throe, 08 November 2018 - 05:39 PM.

[Kamikaze Viking]

I like the idea of being able to see a full detailed loadout from the perspective of training new players. Assuming they used it and actually copied and understood what they saw.

But as a comp player I know how much of a difference knowing your enemies loadout can make. It can tip the scales in an otherwise 'balanced' matchup.

I'm kinda split on this.

ideas on restricting who can view your loadouts via elo.

a ) either put a cap so that the best of the best can hide from the other best of the best? hmmm not sure i like that. OR allow it so that it also becomes an extra layer of metagame that you have to know each others loadouts, and experimental changes away from the predicted build become a guessing game meta.

b ) restrict mech build full viewing only to Significantly lower elo players, so that they can learn from their betters.
BUT once you are close to or above another players elo you can no longer see them. (interesting idea, values would need tuning). Once you are close to the other players Elo or above it, you can only see the general loadout tab as you should be able to build it better anyway. - the 'close to' aspect of this idea would be to prevent you playing a match, and then afterwards directly going to that player on your friends list (assuming you have them) and looking up the exact details of the build you just fought.

Edited by Kamikaze Viking, 25 April 2018 - 05:22 PM.

[Small Baguette]

Another point, people will find mech builds regardless. Keeping it in game and not requiring players to go to 3rd party sites, forums etc to find viable builds is DEFINTELY a good thing overall. The only people I can imagine being really against are those that are protective of their builds and want to keep that competitive edge, but I feel like a true top tier mechwarrior will welcome the challenge.

We could always have a option to keep builds private? Could be a good middle ground. I'm all for keeping it as is though and also adding in the skill tree. Thanks!

[Kamikaze Viking]

Small Baguette, on 25 April 2018 - 05:24 PM, said:

Another point, people will find mech builds regardless. Keeping it in game and not requiring players to go to 3rd party sites, forums etc to find viable builds is DEFINTELY a good thing overall.

yeah THIS is a goood point. It might allow them to open up a way to consciously link builds to others via friends list. Aka sending a smurfy link, but keeping it all in game.

A 'Generate Smurfy Link' button in game, that you can copy and paste to and from has been a long time dream of many. I still want that, but hopefully this would allow similar functionality within the game client.

[Panthros]

Why would I want someone to see my skill tree if I worked hard and feel I have something unique? If people want to display their build out or skill tree sure, but this should not be allowed by default. Let this be a setting to turn on.