26 replies to this topic

[Zibmo]

Just played a game where it jammed practically every shot. There were 3 occasions where I fired and it didn't. Every other time, it jammed. So, 9 rounds out of 112 were not jammed shots.

In the meantime, every little mech with machine guns eats through assaults. Something feels a bit off.

[Angel of Annihilation]

There is another thread going around about this. Basically PGI nerfed the crap out of all UAC's to bring the damage output of the KDK-3 down in an attempt to balance that one and only one mech. Since they couldn't just nerf UAC/10s which were the problem when boated on the KDK-3, they nerfed all UACs saying that it was because ALL UAC's did too much damage. I am assuming they meant all UAC's when "Boated" did too much damage because UAC's they sure the hell weren't OP'ed when you had one or even two mounted on your mechs. Now they are barely workable with 2 mounted and damn near useless if your only mounting one. Unfortunately for the Clan's, they really don't have another good option unless you think the LBX is actually good which most agree its not. I mean it is better than a sharp stick in the eye but most Clanners would trade it in a heartbeat for a single shot AC so they could ditch both the utterly unreliable UAC and the shotgun LBX.

[El Bandito]

Zibmo, on 25 May 2018 - 10:30 AM, said:

WHAT IS THE C-UAC20 JAM % SUPPOSED TO BE?

17%.

[Loki the Cat]

Due to Ghost heat firing more than once with a CUac 20 is awkward, at the best of times. Can't Double tap, like any other Ultra, or you Ghost, even with only one of the monsters on your mech. Have a build using Deathstrike for the -Jam %, and the timing on it is really rough.

[El Bandito]

Loki the Cat, on 26 May 2018 - 04:20 AM, said:

Due to Ghost heat firing more than once with a CUac 20 is awkward, at the best of times. Can't Double tap, like any other Ultra, or you Ghost, even with only one of the monsters on your mech. Have a build using Deathstrike for the -Jam %, and the timing on it is really rough.

Hold on, I tested it out before and I am pretty sure you can double tap single CUAC20 without GH penalty.

Edited by El Bandito, 26 May 2018 - 04:56 AM.

[lazorbeamz]

Loki the Cat, on 26 May 2018 - 04:20 AM, said:

Due to Ghost heat firing more than once with a CUac 20 is awkward, at the best of times. Can't Double tap, like any other Ultra, or you Ghost, even with only one of the monsters on your mech. Have a build using Deathstrike for the -Jam %, and the timing on it is really rough.

Stop with your bullcrap please?

[Unit 86]

Loki the Cat, on 26 May 2018 - 04:20 AM, said:

Due to Ghost heat firing more than once with a CUac 20 is awkward, at the best of times. Can't Double tap, like any other Ultra, or you Ghost, even with only one of the monsters on your mech. Have a build using Deathstrike for the -Jam %, and the timing on it is really rough.

What the **** are you talking about?

[Seranov]

El Bandito, on 26 May 2018 - 04:28 AM, said:

Hold on, I tested it out before and I am pretty sure you can double tap single CUAC20 without GH penalty.

I have definitely run my 2 UAC20 + 2 HML Deathstrike without significant GH issues. You can totally double tap UAC20s.

[Xetelian]

I've been told many times that double tapping the UAC20 cause the same ghost heat as firing two of them.

[Y E O N N E]

El Bandito, on 26 May 2018 - 04:28 AM, said:

Hold on, I tested it out before and I am pretty sure you can double tap single CUAC20 without GH penalty.

All UACs impose a mandatory 0.5 second gap between the initial shot and the double tap, so you can't self-ghost with a single weapon.

[El Bandito]

Yeonne Greene, on 27 May 2018 - 11:49 PM, said:

All UACs impose a mandatory 0.5 second gap between the initial shot and the double tap, so you can't self-ghost with a single weapon.

Nah, I am very sure you can double tap C/UAC10 in less than 0.5 second. It think CUAC20 works the same.

Edited by El Bandito, 28 May 2018 - 01:50 AM.

[Noey Bunny]

Zibmo, on 25 May 2018 - 10:30 AM, said:

Just played a game where it jammed practically every shot. There were 3 occasions where I fired and it didn't. Every other time, it jammed. So, 9 rounds out of 112 were not jammed shots.

In the meantime, every little mech with machine guns eats through assaults. Something feels a bit off.

As others have said before, 17% is the jam chance for all clan UAC's, and 15% for all IS UAC's. I've heard some heresay about the likelihood of a jam increasing if you fire earlier while the weapon is cycling, but I haven't experienced, nor seen anything to actually reflect that.

Seranov, on 26 May 2018 - 06:41 AM, said:

I have definitely run my 2 UAC20 + 2 HML Deathstrike without significant GH issues. You can totally double tap UAC20s.

seems like a waste of a Deathstrike to me, and double tapping two uac/20's generates huge amounts of ghost heat. to the tune of about double their normal heat IIRC. (7 heat per normal UAC/20 trigger pull with one, and like 28 with one trigger pull with 2)

[Metus regem]

Zibmo, on 25 May 2018 - 10:30 AM, said:

Just played a game where it jammed practically every shot. There were 3 occasions where I fired and it didn't. Every other time, it jammed. So, 9 rounds out of 112 were not jammed shots.

In the meantime, every little mech with machine guns eats through assaults. Something feels a bit off.

This meme best covers my feelings on all UAC jam chances....

[Noey Bunny]

Metus regem, on 28 May 2018 - 08:59 AM, said:

This meme best covers my feelings on all UAC jam chances....

the jam chance helps enforce the skirmishing nature of the weapon system, this risk inherently forces players to either deal with jams if they don't have available cover or secondary weapon systems. Or fight from positions of cover that allow them to retreat if they incur a jam.

But given the propensity for boating UAC's, a lower jam chance would vastly reduce TTK's of mech's like the Madcat MCII-B, KDK3, Dire Wolf and Night Gyr, this would likely cause more problems than it would resolve. If they reduce jam chance, they'd have to increase heat, or cooldown. and I'd rather keep those where they are. though; that's just my 2cb!

[lazorbeamz]

Ultra 20 is good when you boat something emphasizing alpha strike and have 1 spare weapon slot to fill. Clan ultra 20 is in fact exceptional in this regard because it still is uac20 but with extra range and much less weight.

Quirked EBJ with 15% jam reduction works. 6 cerml and 1 uac20 on the high mount.
3 x Atm9 and uac20 orion II. 120 something alpha strike.

Edited by lazorbeamz, 28 May 2018 - 09:23 AM.

[Y E O N N E]

El Bandito, on 28 May 2018 - 01:50 AM, said:

Nah, I am very sure you can double tap C/UAC10 in less than 0.5 second. It think CUAC20 works the same.

You cannot.

If you try, you will be rewarded with increased jams.

[Metus regem]

NaniCat, on 28 May 2018 - 09:09 AM, said:

the jam chance helps enforce the skirmishing nature of the weapon system, this risk inherently forces players to either deal with jams if they don't have available cover or secondary weapon systems. Or fight from positions of cover that allow them to retreat if they incur a jam.

But given the propensity for boating UAC's, a lower jam chance would vastly reduce TTK's of mech's like the Madcat MCII-B, KDK3, Dire Wolf and Night Gyr, this would likely cause more problems than it would resolve. If they reduce jam chance, they'd have to increase heat, or cooldown. and I'd rather keep those where they are. though; that's just my 2cb!

I'm well aware of the reasoning, but coming from a TT background where the jam percentage is approximately 2.8%, even with the higher RoF we see in MWO I could see them pushing it as high as 6%, while still retaining the higher heat that they have thanks to the higher RoF we see here.... There is a reason why in universe they replaced normal AC/s with LB's and UAC/s after all.

[El Bandito]

Yeonne Greene, on 28 May 2018 - 09:23 AM, said:

You cannot.

If you try, you will be rewarded with increased jams.

Pretty sure I can. As a matter of fact, I did double tap my CUAC10s in the last FP match within 0.5 seconds. As for increased jam % if you fire within 0.5 second, how did you come to that conclusion? Cause CUAC10 has 2.5 second cooldown so if you click before the time's up you will get 17 jam %, doesn't matter if you clicked within 0.5 second or not.

Metus regem, on 28 May 2018 - 09:29 AM, said:

I'm well aware of the reasoning, but coming from a TT background where the jam percentage is approximately 2.8%, even with the higher RoF we see in MWO I could see them pushing it as high as 6%, while still retaining the higher heat that they have thanks to the higher RoF we see here.... There is a reason why in universe they replaced normal AC/s with LB's and UAC/s after all.

Doesn't UAC get disabled permanently in TT if they jam? Then even 2.8% sounds high.

Edited by El Bandito, 28 May 2018 - 09:46 AM.

[lazorbeamz]

Yeonne Greene, on 28 May 2018 - 09:23 AM, said:

You cannot.

If you try, you will be rewarded with increased jams.

You can with 10. I think it is UAC5 which doesnt allow you to shoot again before its cooldown is halfway done.
With UAC5 it is like BOOM.........BOOM..BOOM

Edited by lazorbeamz, 28 May 2018 - 09:34 AM.

[Noey Bunny]

Metus regem, on 28 May 2018 - 09:29 AM, said:

I'm well aware of the reasoning, but coming from a TT background where the jam percentage is approximately 2.8%, even with the higher RoF we see in MWO I could see them pushing it as high as 6%, while still retaining the higher heat that they have thanks to the higher RoF we see here.... There is a reason why in universe they replaced normal AC/s with LB's and UAC/s after all.

Yes, but on TT I believe it permanently disabled the weapon system, so having a low jam chance made sense. I don't really care for the lore, or other versions of giant robot stompy games. Much of the TT content doesn't translate well to a FPS environment. so I don't really know what the point of using it, or the lore as a reference for balance here is accomplishing.