49 replies to this topic

[BTGbullseye]

Emden, on 28 May 2018 - 02:21 PM, said:

LOL LRM baby LRM.... If LRMs are your thing, use them.... if not, don't try to have them removed. I don't like clan mechs, should they be removed too?

How can you not like those fluffy little Clan mechs? They're all so cute and cuddly!

Edited by BTGbullseye, 28 May 2018 - 03:17 PM.

[JediPanther]

Lrms are find for t5s. You'll never see any team win the mwo wc with lrms only. Or even lrms and dedicated spotters due to lasers and ac being far more superior a weapon for killing a mech. you know what makes lrms awesome? People smart enough to know how to use them properly with the equipment needed to make them work. But why bother with all those wasted tons on things like bap,uav,narcs and narc ammo when you can just laser and guass spam for a much easier and faster win?

[Brain Cancer]

Vxheous, on 28 May 2018 - 07:05 AM, said:

Lasers require a player to hold the entire 1 second+ burn on target to actually get good use out of it. The amount of players that I see doing the zorro Z across mechs with lasers because they can't aim is staggering. I've been playing LRM boats recently just for the lulz (LRM 80 Supernova A, LRM 70 Orion IIc-A, LRM 60 Hunch IIc-C) lrming at 300-350m, your opponent cannot avoid the missiles now with the increased velocity.

I'm still waiting for someone to obliterate the comp scene with LRMs.

"I don't miss at 300-350m with a spread weapon" doesn't exactly give me much hope, however.

[Steve Pryde]

Quandoo, on 28 May 2018 - 02:10 AM, said:

Use them properly. On less than 500 range. And in combo with other weapons.
They are only meant to support the push of your team, not to stand behind and spam.

Sure, while people killing you with other long range weapons from 1000m+ away and laughing their asses off because they have ECM or hard cover. LUL

[Vellron2005]

If you ask me, LRMs are fun and useful, and one just needs to know how to use them properly..

And people must simply get over the fact that LRMs are not meant to take targets down quickly, effectively, and are not meant for stopping power.

They are suppression, battlefield control and punishment weapon.

If you wanna have lots of kills or to one-shot people, stick to meta direct fire.

If you wanna make the direct-fire meta guy's targets easier to kill so they can get that one-shot kill, or make it easier for them to rush targets or isolate opponents.. play a LRM boat.

[Stinger554]

Vellron2005, on 01 June 2018 - 12:42 PM, said:

They are suppression, battlefield control and punishment weapon.

I laugh when people say this.

Direct fire weapons accomplish this as well difference is that they actually kill people.

Latorque, on 28 May 2018 - 07:22 AM, said:

Still this. I admit, i have no real idea how to implement LRMs in a way that doesn't either make them a completely overpowered indirect fire-and-forget system - as they have been several times already - or a lackluster and rather annoying secondary support artillery. I tried some IS-LRMs on my older, unused assault chassis, and one thing that still stuns me is the absurd amount of ammo per ton. Might be something to adress - if LRMs are made more powerful (either by improving them directly, or weakening the countermeasures), i want their users to actually watch their ammoand choose their targets instead of just farting out endless streams of missiles.

All that will do is make them take smaller engines, less other weapons, etc to get more ammo. Which is sad IMO

Edited by Stinger554, 01 June 2018 - 01:01 PM.

[Erronius]

[Vxheous]

Brain Cancer, on 01 June 2018 - 11:53 AM, said:

I'm still waiting for someone to obliterate the comp scene with LRMs.

"I don't miss at 300-350m with a spread weapon" doesn't exactly give me much hope, however.

This screenshot is probably the closest you're going to to get. 2 LRM boats (Orion IIc-A and Hunchback IIc-C) + Narc Light + rest direct fire mechs. 16 of the best players in the game. Losing side is the starting roster that won MWOWC 2017

Edited by Vxheous, 01 June 2018 - 02:26 PM.

[LordNothing]

lrms never felt this bad in living legends. of course living legends doesnt have dumbed down electronic warfare and marginalized mechanics either. tag is much more powerful, narc is much more powerful, you dont get free c3 so its not a noob weapon, you have to light yourself up to get your own locks so its not op either. with teamwork its a godweapon. and to counter that everyone runs passive and there are 2 types of ecm available, and neither are marginalized. it also give lights another thing to do (c3 hub), and scouting pays off.

Edited by LordNothing, 01 June 2018 - 07:05 PM.

[Vellron2005]

Stinger554, on 01 June 2018 - 01:03 PM, said:

I laugh when people say this.

Direct fire weapons accomplish this as well difference is that they actually kill people.

The only direct fire weapons that can be considered "suppression" weapons are RACs.. cose' they do lots of damage over lots of time, and people tend to move out of the way..

BUT,

LRMs are superior in this because they don't require face time, and in addition, they actually do more damage, so people tend to care more..

Also, every weapon "kills people", some just do it quicker and others do it slower..

For many, the "slower" part is worth it not exposing yourself..

It's sort of a "give them nothing, and take them of everything" mentality..

[Chados]

I see plenty of LRMboats...old fashioned, cowardly Clan boats with nothing but 60+ tubes...in higher tier play. I’m T2 (not that I belong there, I don’t) so thanks to the matchmaker retooling I end up in all T1-T3 drops because there aren’t enough of us to keep the T1s busy. But still, it’s not uncommon to see two or three LRM80 assault spuds missling it up from a thousand meters behind the action in any QP match. Can they rip you a new one? Yep, with the velocity boost (thank you, o mighty Kerensky, that is something I’m glad for, actually) you’re going to take a pounding getting into cover. Push ‘em, tho, and inside 180 they’re toast, even a Clan LRM80 build drops off fast inside SRM range and they’re really hot.

Speaking of hot, it’s fun to chuck a few salvos back at them, especially when they’re packing Laser AMS. I’ve forced heat shutdowns on LRMboats like that and when you do it with a mixed Artemis LRM/SRM build with a sight lock inside 270 meters it’s Katie, bar the door for the poor shutdown boat. Also, suppression of boaters is a thing. They love to dish the pain but they can’t take counterbattery fire. Land a couple salvos on them and they’ll back off and break their locks, making them tasty prey for wandering hungry Piranhahas and Lolcusts and Trollmandos.

If you’re going to LRM, it should be done with class. Tactical LRMs put your missile mech right there where the action is at. Twenty to 40 tubes at most, depending on weight class, backed with reasonable secondaries that dish at least 20 damage on their own, helpers like an active probe, UAV, NARC, or TAG, lots of sensor skills, mobility on par with big heavies. Move with the brawlers. Shoot over their heads into the scrum. Chase retreating enemies with indirect fire. Sharing armor. Reds hate LRMs. They’ll ignore the Annihilator next to you to take you out first, and his two heavy gauss rifles or four LB10X that they're ignoring will make them pay for their zeal. If you’re not inside the optimal range of your secondary weapons, you’re leaving contributions to overall team damage on the table. An A1 Catapult at 265 meters can lay down over 50 points damage per salvo if it’s packing SRM or MRM10s to back the LRMs. And I suggest that 70 tons ought to be the upper weight limit.

Assault LRM boats hiding half a klick away from the fight are the fun cancer that will get all LRMs eventually nerfed when Paul one day steps into game and gets rained on too much. Yes, kids, that actually happened a few years ago and Paul, then the Lord of the Balance, had the last word, which is how we lost the old Artemis that looked like a swarm of bees. I wasn’t here then but the old vets do tell of the glorious LRMs of old, by the campfires, late at night. A time which will never be seen again.

[BWS2K]

My position on LRMs has become: I wish more people who used them understood them.

You can dumbfire them, which I've done before and confused the heck out of someone standing behind one of those cell walls in Incursion. Dumbfiring will also trigger anyone's active L/AMS, revealing their position(s). And, if you're boating them to a high degree, you're bait - tell your team who you are, what you did, apologize, and then go lure Red's Alpha Lance away while your buddies push. That's not going to help the LRMer much but it can still be better than just hitting buildings and complaining.

[Clydewinder]

increase LRM velocity when fired direct
reduce LRM velocity when fired indirect

problem solved

[Quxudica]

LRM's have the same issue they've had since the game was in closed beta; They are an entirely feast or famine weapon. Either they feel incredibly OP by single-handedly turning a game, or they are completely and totally useless. There really is no in between. Comes down to their functionality, and how lock-on works in general, lacking any real depth.

I remember being exclusively a light pilot in closed beta and some of the most fun encounters were when I ran into my opposite number out scouting and getting into a duel. It felt like a real test of piloting ability and skill decided the victor. But that was long ago and ever since then the winner of such an encounter, should you be foolish enough to engage to begin with, is whichever side has a half asleep teammate in a LRM boat who happened to pay attention.

[VitriolicViolet]

Vellron2005, on 02 June 2018 - 04:48 AM, said:

The only direct fire weapons that can be considered "suppression" weapons are RACs.. cose' they do lots of damage over lots of time, and people tend to move out of the way..

BUT,

LRMs are superior in this because they don't require face time, and in addition, they actually do more damage, so people tend to care more..

No they dont, in what world do LRMs do more damage than RACs? they simply dont, its fair faster to kill someone with RACs than LRMs. Lrms are spread weapons, RACs less so

Edited by VitriolicViolet, 02 June 2018 - 05:13 PM.

[Alexandra Hekmatyar]

Erronius, on 01 June 2018 - 02:09 PM, said:

You know that horse is actually still walking happily inside faction play.

[Sjorpha]

The velocity buff helped a lot, they're approaching a more useful state. 1 more small buff and i think lrms will be in a pretty good spot.

[Vellron2005]

VitriolicViolet, on 02 June 2018 - 05:13 PM, said:

No they dont, in what world do LRMs do more damage than RACs? they simply dont, its fair faster to kill someone with RACs than LRMs. Lrms are spread weapons, RACs less so

I disagree... For RACs to be effective, you have to facetank and expect your target doesn't move.. LRMs hit the target regardless of it moving, and you don't have to facetank.. and you also do lots more damage to it wth a LRM boat..

Example:

You have a LRM70 Supernova. Most of your damage will spread, but you sill still put more than a good deal into the torsos.

With RACs, you can rarely take more than 3 or 4, RAC2s, and no more than 2 RAC5's.. sure, you will be more precise than with LRM, but again, facetanking, moving target, ect, so it is arguable how much damage you will put on the torsos, or the CT..

I don't have exact numbers, but I'd wager it's about the same or worse than 70 LRMs would do..

I know I'm not comparing single weapon effectiveness, I am comparing most common builds..

I should probably test this on the Training Grounds Atlas.. I usually take that one one in 4 salvos from LRM70 supernova..

Maybe It would be cool to measure in seconds how long it takes for 3RAC2 or LRM70, or 2RAC5 on a stationary training Atlas..

Edited by Vellron2005, 03 June 2018 - 03:23 AM.

[MischiefSC]

The best suppression weapon is a big alpha strike that blows a ST off a mech when he peeks. LRMs are a bad suppression weapon. Most/all the tonnage on your mech devotes to a weapon that just warns so.eone to get into cover to avoid damage in a bit and when the damage shows up (if it shows up) it spreads itself or just flat out misses.

The only thing LRMs do well is shoot people your teammates are tanking for you while you hide.

[JC Daxion]

easy fix to LRMs...


No blind fire unless tag or Narc

Increased Lock speed with LOS and slightly reduced arc. (not to much because being able to lob LRM's over someones head is a good thing.


Yea sure LRM's are not great with top players and peak and poke, But they are a lot of fun. the biggest problem with LRMs are they are used wrong all the time. They are a second line weapon in the 300-500 range, yet most people think they are a long range weapons. the name is part of the issues