190 replies to this topic

[Cloves]

Mister Glitchdragon, on 14 June 2018 - 08:08 AM, said:

I'm pretty much doing the same thing, but with an SNS. I've been looking at the Blasp, but I really like the speed I get out of the SNS. With tweaks, I'm moving close to 90kph, which means I can re-position often. This is essential in solo qp matches that turn NASCAR. I can hang back, throw a few rounds into the enemy, and still catch up with the herd, sometimes even getting to the front of the pack before they make contact. Sometimes they drop me with alpha lance, and it's pretty cool to be able to support the lights with a fast heavy. Couple mechs on the Opfor go chasing a squirrel and get lead into twin-gauss fire. Even if I don't sit them down, they report back to their unit and I can stop their whole team's progress if they turn around looking for me while I bug out and join the rest of my team moving up. I'm the biggest f'n squirrel you'll never catch. Speed (+ECM) kills.

I agree about spending too much of the match "flanking" (running around and not engaging), but that's true of just about all styles of play, with the exception, in my opinion, of brawling (you need to be patient and let the enemy close or let the distance builds on your team soften them up so you can close; endgame is your time to shine!). I know I'm having a bad game when I see the rest of the team is fighting and I'm stuck running around looking for my spot to set up. Mining Collective and Canyon Network are notoriously bad for flanking: you get stuck driving around in those side-channels for half the game if you don't come with jump jets!).

Canyon is all about flanking, yesterday was in match with soap and he took 6 kills due to the nascar at around the center.
-edit I think I was in an unskilled spider, I think I got one kill, at best.

Edited by Cloves, 14 June 2018 - 08:25 AM.

[Luminis]

Kubernetes, on 13 June 2018 - 03:36 PM, said:

Note that no one ever complains that a 10-0 win streak is evidence of a broken matchmaker.

Can't remember a streak like that, but I sure as hell can complain about winning one-sided, imbalanced matches. Because it feels shallow stomping a team that is apprx. 60th to 70th percentile according to Jarl's List while your own is closer to 85th to 95th percentile. Sure, it's a win and you can sport with your team mates for damage and kills but does it feel like a satisfying fight and a victory I earned? Nope, not at all.

[KodiakGW]

Kubernetes, on 13 June 2018 - 03:36 PM, said:

Sometimes it happens.

Note that no one ever complains that a 10-0 win streak is evidence of a broken matchmaker.

You've probably had 10 game win streaks, but it never occurred to you that something was wrong.

You likely pumped your fist and told yourself it was a combination of skill and good luck.

But when you lose 10 straight, it's no longer skill and luck at issue, it's a broken matchmaker.

Your right. Looks like perfectly even teams to me. I mean that guy at 2% is in the perfect game against the guy who sits at spot 20 on Jarl's.

[Brain Cancer]

The more I play, the more it feels like the game will simply slap together whatever trash it can find because it must have a match made.

The problem is that it means one team is very often that pile of scraps versus the "good guys", and unless you're Tony Stark on that team, you're there to be farmed. It's not as obvious during events, but when you see that pile of veteran unit tags on one side in top notch chassis and you're looking at the randomest random of trashbots on yours, all you can do is hope they use enough lube and that it's over quickly.

[Luminis]

Brain Cancer, on 15 June 2018 - 12:15 PM, said:

The more I play, the more it feels like the game will simply slap together whatever trash it can find because it must have a match made.

That's pretty obvious, actually. At least to me. Much like KodiakGW, I started stat-checking teams (randomly, though, not systematically, so my sample size is rather low) and the teams are, for the most part, very obviously imbalanced.

My observation is that, worse stat imbalance (be it avg. match score, percentile, WLR, KDR, it really doesn't matter) usually correlates to more lopsided results. The bigger the imbalance, the worse the stomp. Maybe I just never checked the stats on a match where the team with the lower stat totals won (not unlikely), but I've yet to see that happen. Scraping the leaderboard data of both teams at match start, totalling and comparing them would've made me a rich man if betting on MWO quick play matches was a thing.

It's pretty ridiculous.

[RickySpanish]

KodiakGW, on 14 June 2018 - 06:39 PM, said:

Your right. Looks like perfectly even teams to me. I mean that guy at 2% is in the perfect game against the guy who sits at spot 20 on Jarl's.

I wouldn't call that imbalanced tbh. 12 vs 6 is hardly a stomp, it seems more like a game where a slight advantage eventually snowballed as the armour on your team began to run out. Interestingly it appears that the two lowest ranked guys on your team didn't do terribly. Meanwhile the first three players were potatoes by many accounts yet their stats don't reflect that. On the other team two very highly ranked players clearly caused a great deal of carnage. I suppose top 20 players gotta play too, and no matter what match they end up in they are going to create opportunities for their other team mates.

Edited by RickySpanish, 15 June 2018 - 01:53 PM.

[Brain Cancer]

If you didn't notice, the winning team started with 11 to boot, with one of the kills the losers got on the DC/AFK Spider with 0 damage.

[Xetelian]

@OP

Last 8 seasons say you're at or above 1.0 W/L. That is perfectly normal. I too have massive losing streaks but I'm also in a lower percentile than you so I am more to blame for my losses than you are for yours.


Even EmP members and other WC players have losses on their accounts, no one has 100% win rate as far as I've seen, because some teams are just not able to be carried even if you can kill 4-5 guys alone.

Edited by Xetelian, 15 June 2018 - 03:08 PM.

[KodiakGW]

RickySpanish, on 15 June 2018 - 01:52 PM, said:

I wouldn't call that imbalanced tbh.

You’re right. What makes you think I’m saying this is wrong? I think we should keep putting people who rank so low in games against someone who has been getting 11/1 K/D the last three seasons. Why do you think I think that is wrong? I say keep MM exactly the same. Always stack all the sub 60th percentiles on one team. Always leads to fun games. They should just ‘git gud’, accept their role as fodder for the top players, or leave the game.

Brain Cancer, on 15 June 2018 - 02:41 PM, said:

If you didn't notice, the winning team started with 11 to boot, with one of the kills the losers got on the DC/AFK Spider with 0 damage.

Actually, I one shotted him with 2 SnubPPC and an LBX10. Asked him in open chat if it registered through his back armor, because I took a shot at him from his right side. So it shouldn’t have killed him, unless the LBX did extra critical damage.

[Throe]

[deleted by user]

Edited by Throe, 09 November 2018 - 12:15 PM.

[Popcat]

"We should all just take a breath."

Heck no that's why the need person challenges in Solaris! Take it to the field!

" It’s like how I try to kill Bardul in every match I see him in, it’s a stalker fan thing, I guess, like challenging Mike Tyson to a fistfight."

Wow that's a bit psycho fan boy. . can watch

OK just for the record every body posting here has an ego. . . the ones that don't just read. To hold Bandito over the table for misunderstanding the posters intent as having to big an ego is a bit much. Beside if it was truly a "compliment" the poster would have corrected it with respect not malice.

[Popcat]

"The more I play, the more it feels like the game will simply slap together whatever trash it can find because it must have a match made"

So wouldn't a low player base be difficult to balance even for a well balanced match maker. I mean if you selection is limited doesn't that tend to have more extremes in the line up?

Edited by Popcat, 15 June 2018 - 04:55 PM.

[Brain Cancer]

It's worse because it seems to be building a team completely before starting on a second.

Imagine two people having a game of pick-up football. There's 24 people.

One guy gets to pick his 12 before the other one is left with the rest. Obviously, he'll end up with the better team, giving you a "winner" and a "loser" bias from before you even start playing. It'd be better if, say they figured it out (Hey, we're using 12 heavies for this team!) and at least randomized from the pool who gets which from a given weight class.

[Popcat]

So your saying if I'm really good in mediums I can be in a medium on a bad team and if I'm really bad at lights I only get to be on good teams with my light mechs?

Or am I misunderstanding that?

SO MM divides the teams based on tier does it use tonnage as a secondary assessment?

Edited by Popcat, 15 June 2018 - 07:06 PM.

[Dogstar]

We don't really know how the match maker actually works. The only statements about it have been along the lines of 'tier 4 won't face tier 1 (unless there's no one else around)'.

There's a bunch of ways it could be implemented and some of them can give unexpected/unintended results.

e.g.
Run some SQL to select 12 players to make first team, run query again to select 2nd team. Doing things this way gets you two teams that are unlikely to be balanced.

Alternatively run some SQL to select 24 players then distribute them to two teams taking account of their W/L ratio. Doing this could get you better balanced teams.

Please note that as a programming task balancing two teams is actually quite hard. Anyone who says it's easy has obviously never written a program.

[El Bandito]

If MM creates one team first, and then tries to match it up with second team's creation, then MM disparity can be explained a bit. Especially since the population is limited during off hours.

[Tarl Cabot]

El Bandito, on 15 June 2018 - 11:57 PM, said:

If MM creates one team first, and then tries to match it up with second team's creation, then MM disparity can be explained a bit. Especially since the population is limited during off hours.

If it did pick one team first then it would be 3/3/3/3 on mech selection then it would take forever and a day to fill up the 2nd team. When it was Elo it alternated but you also have to remember it is not just tier but also weight class.

[TRODDEN]

I feel the same Kerensky. Have been playing consistently now for a little over a year and have also been trying to recognize some pattern or form of winning but in conclusion there isn't any..except for the terrible "randomness" of it all. It's the only game in the world where you'll practice and practice and you'll get better and better as a pilot, but in most cases, this does NOT result in more wins. Why? You're dealing with a match-making system that does NOT take into account tier level and skill, it's only purpose (seemingly) is to fill player gaps and ready the game. Frustrating when you also consider the amount of time, effort, and in some cases, actual money that you put into the game you feel undeserving to be made to lose all of the time by being on a bad team that can't communicate.

Edited by TRODDEN, 07 August 2018 - 11:30 AM.

[BWS2K]

TRODDEN, on 07 August 2018 - 11:30 AM, said:

You're dealing with a match-making system that does NOT take into account tier level and skill, it's only purpose (seemingly) is to fill player gaps and ready the game.

Always intriguing when this thread gets necro'd. The matchmaker does take Tier into account but Tiers don't equal skill. Add to that a low population count, and you can see it's doing exactly what it's supposed to - making games. Folks complained about wait times and things were adjusted but, again, there isn't a whole lot more you can do here. It's not possible to assign evenly-matched games using Tiers since they don't represent anything of value and we're way too far down the tracks for them to switch to any other metric (and most of the others things that get suggested don't work super well either). This is MWO now.

You aren't alone in your frustrations but there's not much of a solution to be had. Take solace that, at least in Quickplay, everyone has an equal chance of getting a team that doesn't work out. *shrug*

Edited by BWS2K, 07 August 2018 - 12:32 PM.

[Plaid Ninja]

Thanos Kerensky, on 04 June 2018 - 12:50 PM, said:

So, I got a 0-10 streak today (10 losses in 10 matches) doing solo queue for Quick Play matches. The teams were just...incomprehensibly bad, and maybe I was too, but seriously...10/10 losses? And it's been like that since I went back into the game after a long period of absence. I win maybe, AT BEST, about 20% of the matches that I play. I literally believe that in 1 month I will be Tier 5 from 3, again.

I just want to hear people's experiences on the subject of queuing solo for quick play with random people., because mine are unbelievably bad, to the point where I'm seriously considering of quitting the game altogether. It's one thing to lose even 60% of your games, it's another to have an entire weekend of being facerolled in every game. I don't mind losing but I have much better things to do than lose ALL the time.

I just want to see if indeed there are people out there who have the exact opposite experiences and I would be very interesting in hearing how did they achieve that.

Maybe this is just a rant but today was a seriously f'd up MWO day.

Cheers

I've had the same problem. I made a new account to try out the clans and came back to the game after quitting for a while. I expected to be out of tier 5 in an hour or two since for all intents and purposes I was an accidental smurf. Nope! The game had other plans. For two days straight I got stuck with the worst teams I've ever seen, I only won maybe 1 out of 15 games if I was lucky. We're not talking close games either. Most of them were 0 to 12 or close to it. There's a limit to how much incompetence one can carry. I can't kill the entire enemy team by myself. Nobody can! After those first two days match making went back to normal and I've managed to slowly drag my win ratio back into the positive since then. It was a really weird and frustrating experience while it was happening though.