31 replies to this topic

[Vanguard836]

After a bit of time to play the Jenners and Jenner IICs post patch, what's everyone thoughts on them ?

Personally I'm inching towards the need for some armor/structure quirks.
Most of the other 35 tonners have quirks to help them live longer. These are, as said since the re-scale, very big and easy to hit.

They just seem too fragile compared to other 35 tonners that have better geometry and some better firepower potential.

Edited by Vanguard836, 06 June 2018 - 01:45 PM.

[Weeny Machine]

Jenners are too fragile. In case of Jenner IICs...they are fragile and drive like a school bus. Most of the 35t mechs need a buff in the agility department to compensate somewhat for their enormous size after re-sizing. Heck, some have the size of meds

However, PGI has proven time and again: Jenners are light mechs. Light mechs, especially 35t ones, get no buffs. I remember when they nerfed trash tier Huggin even further despite it wasn't played anymore. Comedy gold.

Edited by Bush Hopper, 06 June 2018 - 02:31 PM.

[Nightbird]

Jenners will never be good, just live with it...

(in MWO)

[Cloves]

All lights got caught by the agility debuff. In my mind this is the worst nerf to effect the whole line. If they really hate quirks, and want them gone, they need to address mobility. Give IS stronger mobility, much like they do now, then scale by weight. They might also bend the knees of the model so that it sits lower, this is a buff to the surviabity whilst being a nerf to it’s firepower. They have done stance changes with other mechs, and would not be a quirk. Personally I would have never done the armor shift, just used quirks, but it’s a stated design goal of the company and I understand that fewer per variant quirks makes thier balance across the 600 or so variants they have in game easier.

[Grus]

Due for a very long time. The IIC is just... sigh.. #makejennersgreatagain.

[JediPanther]

I log ago traded in my jenners for lolcucts long before that lame *** 14 armor crap patch. A locust has more armor now than a jenner. Full survival tree gets my jenner a nice plus three armor to a woop de doo 17 armor. Even Oxide once the most tanky-ist jenner sucks now.

I saw a jenner-dF today and asked what missile it was using. It was srm. I've seen lrm 5x and er/smls become the more common build for them now. The F is simply mia except for those matches where someone is using the trial one. I've found myself playing the lcts a lot for my light mech fun and even running a few of my cads and X5.

Whoever decided that nerf was a good thing should be forced to use the F stock for a month.You can bet the day after we'd get our armor back.

[Weeny Machine]

Cloves, on 06 June 2018 - 01:52 PM, said:

All lights got caught by the agility debuff. In my mind this is the worst nerf to effect the whole line. If they really hate quirks, and want them gone, they need to address mobility. Give IS stronger mobility, much like they do now, then scale by weight. They might also bend the knees of the model so that it sits lower, this is a buff to the surviabity whilst being a nerf to it’s firepower. They have done stance changes with other mechs, and would not be a quirk. Personally I would have never done the armor shift, just used quirks, but it’s a stated design goal of the company and I understand that fewer per variant quirks makes thier balance across the 600 or so variants they have in game easier.

Pretty much this. However, clan lights aren't in a much better shape than IS ones. The nerf to SPLs hurt them much. They have to use long burn lasers which will invite return fire and brawling is a no no no - also because of the terrible clan SRMs. So, they could get a bit mobility as well.

Actually I do not understand why heavy mech pilots complain about lights. Heck, there are few who are dangerous for them (PIRs for example) and then they must get caught with their pants down.

JediPanther, on 06 June 2018 - 02:08 PM, said:

I log ago traded in my jenners for lolcucts long before that lame *** 14 armor crap patch. A locust has more armor now than a jenner. Full survival tree gets my jenner a nice plus three armor to a woop de doo 17 armor. Even Oxide once the most tanky-ist jenner sucks now.

I saw a jenner-dF today and asked what missile it was using. It was srm. I've seen lrm 5x and er/smls become the more common build for them now. The F is simply mia except for those matches where someone is using the trial one. I've found myself playing the lcts a lot for my light mech fun and even running a few of my cads and X5.

Whoever decided that nerf was a good thing should be forced to use the F stock for a month.You can bet the day after we'd get our armor back.

Not only the Oxide was nerfed to the ground. The Huginn was completely nerfed to the ground. I cannot remember a mech which got hit harder and more often by direct and indirect nerfs.

Edited by Bush Hopper, 06 June 2018 - 02:24 PM.

[Cloves]

Bush Hopper, on 06 June 2018 - 02:22 PM, said:

Pretty much this. However, clan lights aren't in a much better shape than IS ones. The nerf to SPLs hurt them much. They have to use long burn lasers which will invite return fire and brawling is a no no no. So, they could get a bit mobility as well.

Actually I do not understand why heavy mech pilots complain about lights. Heck, there are few who are dangerous for them (PIRs for example) and then they must get caught with their pants down.

Oh I think all of them need a mobility buff, just would weigh it heavily in IS favor, as clans have twice the hard points, lighter equipment, better endo/exo and I would never put anything less than an xl in a light. There already is a mobility bias towards IS in the game to try and address this, but currently clans absolutely dominate with having like 10 reasonable lights and IS basically 3.

[JediPanther]

Bush Hopper, on 06 June 2018 - 02:22 PM, said:

Pretty much this. However, clan lights aren't in a much better shape than IS ones. The nerf to SPLs hurt them much. They have to use long burn lasers which will invite return fire and brawling is a no no no - also because of the terrible clan SRMs. So, they could get a bit mobility as well.

Actually I do not understand why heavy mech pilots complain about lights. Heck, there are few who are dangerous for them (PIRs for example) and then they must get caught with their pants down.



Not only the Oxide was nerfed to the ground. The Huginn was completely nerfed to the ground. I cannot remember a mech which got hit harder and more often by direct and indirect nerfs.

I have the Huggin. I remember those times well with it was actually scary to have one come after you with its high srm rof. Now the Huggin has the longest lrm range in the game for IS while the Stalker comes in second. The only real down side to both mechs isn't just the nerf every other patch but the running out of ammo. Many matches were lost in both mechs due to just no ammo and a cherry red ct enemy laughing at you before a laser or ac hit.

[Grus]

Cloves, on 06 June 2018 - 02:40 PM, said:

Oh I think all of them need a mobility buff, just would weigh it heavily in IS favor, as clans have twice the hard points, lighter equipment, better endo/exo and I would never put anything less than an xl in a light. There already is a mobility bias towards IS in the game to try and address this, but currently clans absolutely dominate with having like 10 reasonable lights and IS basically 3.

We only have 2, maybe 3 that are worth a damn. IS has several that are very good. Frankly I like to use IS lights over clans when I want to run them. Love my Deathknell

[Cloves]

Grus, on 06 June 2018 - 03:10 PM, said:

We only have 2, maybe 3 that are worth a damn. IS has several that are very good. Frankly I like to use IS lights over clans when I want to run them. Love my Deathknell

Well, I had more experience with the IS side pre-nerf than I did with clan (cheetah exempted), so when I take out my locust these days I just want to cry, but I love the Adder, the cougar, mist lynx, piranha, and admit I have not tried a MG or Erml cheeta and it might suffer from the same “but it was sooo good” that I feel for half the IS lineup. So my exposure to many of the clan lights is purely post nerf. All this having been said, even a year or so ago I could not have fun with my jenners, whilst everyone was still cheering the oxide as OP. And come on, how many effective LRM boats exist in the light catagory? None of them are IS, as much as my locust lrm5 trollboat may beg to differ.


Oooh, forgot the cute fox!

Edited by Cloves, 06 June 2018 - 04:31 PM.

[ocular tb]

I thought they were okay before this latest patch but now they have some of the weakest arms in the game and it's very noticeable. This change did not help the Jenner. If they reverted this change I would be happy. If they also want to buff it elsewhere I'd be fine with that too but the arms definitely need their armor back.

I think I can see what they were trying to do with this re-distribution but in the case of the Jenner its not been a positive change. I hope to see this changed back soon.

[0111101]

Who knows what they were thinking when they decided redistributing the armor would be a good idea. It certainly wasn't in line with the reality of the situation as pointed out by anyone who's used them since the rescale made them oversized, since the engine/mobility desync made them more sluggish, or since this most recent change made the bulk of their weaponry incredibly vulnerable to being stripped away. LONG overdue for a buff.

And the quirks they DO have just aren't consistent across the chassis despite the hitboxes being identical. No one bothers with the Oxide even though it has the most structure quirks, so obviously there's something wrong.

BASE STRUCTURE (CT): 11.00 BASE STRUCTURE (LT): 8.00 BASE STRUCTURE (RT): 8.00 BASE STRUCTURE (LA): 12.00 BASE STRUCTURE (RA): 12.00 BASE STRUCTURE (LL): 16.00 BASE STRUCTURE (RL): 16.00

What I listed there is the Oxide. And this below is every other variant:

BASE STRUCTURE (CT): 11.00

:thinking:

(Edit: Smurfy formatting from the quirk list didn't transfer properly and made the info unreadable)

Edited by 0111101, 06 June 2018 - 11:57 PM.

[Alilua]

They still need a buff.

[Xetelian]

They very much still need a real buff.

They are still too big. They are still 90% CT.

[Alexander of Macedon]

The rule that if PGI has ever thought something was OP and nerfed it into the ground? That applies double to lights.

[Vanguard836]

The IIC needs some additional durability to the CT and legs IMO. The thing attracts CT fire from any angle.
The IS Jenner has some CT structure at least.

Every other light mechs has some leg durability added to them at the very least. Really think these need some help quirk wise.

Edited by Vanguard836, 09 June 2018 - 07:24 PM.

[Wraith 1]

Since the change, the Oxide is in the same league as the Urbie and Wolfhound when it comes to raw torso hitpoint numbers.

...Which would be awesome, if the Jenner wasn't as easy to hit as a Catapult, but with even worse hitboxes. Also, you lose arms to one lucky hit now. Jenners are still one of the easiest mechs in the game to kill.

I wish they'd just make the Jenner move like it used to. That'd give it a different niche than the tanky Wolfhounds, and there might even be more than one useful 35T mech again.

[LordNothing]

Cloves, on 06 June 2018 - 01:52 PM, said:

All lights got caught by the agility debuff. In my mind this is the worst nerf to effect the whole line. If they really hate quirks, and want them gone, they need to address mobility. Give IS stronger mobility, much like they do now, then scale by weight. They might also bend the knees of the model so that it sits lower, this is a buff to the surviabity whilst being a nerf to it’s firepower. They have done stance changes with other mechs, and would not be a quirk. Personally I would have never done the armor shift, just used quirks, but it’s a stated design goal of the company and I understand that fewer per variant quirks makes thier balance across the 600 or so variants they have in game easier.

seems this should be a quirk intrinsic to the is xl engine. it would really help the lights and it bring back xl engine assault mechs as well.

Edited by LordNothing, 10 June 2018 - 08:37 AM.

[- World Eater -]

IIC arms are too fragile.