463 replies to this topic

[Edustaja]

I've had hard time getting a decent consistent score in the piranha. Maybe it's because it's such a feast or famine mech. If you get behind some fat assaults you can just devastate half the enemy team, but expose yourself a second too long and you're dead.

I've had those 5 kill games and then those where I get obliterated with almost zero damage

Edited by Edustaja, 06 July 2018 - 10:19 AM.

[Dee Eight]

Geee I'd think a streak crow or streak shadow cat must be broken in comparison given how I can 1-volley/2-volley kill any piranha...

[Toek]

This mech enables such a destructive gameplay experience.

[Brenden]

Piranhas need Missile Hardpoints. I want to spam SRM2s.

[DigitalMerc]

zero 'op IS quirks' and peeps raging about the 'nuclear metldown pirahana'...?

We're seriously not crying about the firestarter, locust, or any other quirk-centric mech that can melt pretty much anything without breaking 50% heat?

Bwhahahaha.

I guess the REAL problem is.... can't we not aim legs?
They have like 19 max armor on legs, stop raging and aim low, or hit em in the back where they likely have >8 armor

This is a typical 'this new light mech is out playing me!' post. Next you'll be asking to nerf their speed, torso-twist and other 'ghost armor' capabilities that keep this light mech from being instantly CT'd by any other mech.

I feel the pain when I'm in any assault and a piranha gets close, but that doesn't mean I rage about it on the forums and ask to hit it with the nerfhammer.

Again, aim legs, back or... i dunno, throw a single flammer its way and you'll see the quickest overheat shutdown ever [aside from a Nova, lol]
There, three simple tactics to counter it.

Edited by DigitalMerc, 06 July 2018 - 08:33 PM.

[Y E O N N E]

Piranha is fine.

That said, comparing the gigantic "SHOOT ME" brick that is the Firestarter to a Piranha is laughable at best.

Also, the most powerful Locust is the 1E and it has no major quirks to speak of. The Flea even more so, and it has even less quirks.

[Cer6erus]

Sorry for formatting, copy pasted from stats.
In order - Games - Won games - Lost games - Ratio - Kills - Deaths - Ratio

ARCTIC CHEETAH ACH-PRIME 66 38 27 1.41 84 28 3.00
JENNER JR7-F 32 19 13 1.46 37 19 1.95
LOCUST LCT-1E 37 22 15 1.47 43 23 1.87
MIST LYNX MLX-B 35 20 15 1.33 34 33 1.03
PIRANHA PIR-1 19 15 4 3.75 45 9 5.00
Sure its anecdotal, but this PIR-1 is a clear outlier for me, and I firmly believe the thing is busted. To everyone saying 'Assault mechs can turn around and fight it *as soon* as they hear the machinegun noise' are wrong. I don't know what magical assault mech you run that can manage to torso twist faster then a strafing light often below your torso yaw range doing 13.5 DPS with no heat cap and a small hitbox. Plus the little pelvis section between a mechs legs can be hit from nearly 180 degrees so that you can keep hitting the rear center torso even AS they torso twist. With 13.5 DPS plus crit damage. (news flash, the crit reduction really doesn't do that much) Last game I stripped from the front a fresh HBR's side torso during the cool down of his medium lasers. In the 4.5 seconds it took for a 65 ton mech to cooldown his weapon systems I stood still and removed a side torso. From the front. Standing still. Facetanking.

Edited by Cer6erus, 06 July 2018 - 11:13 PM.

[Weeny Machine]

Cer6erus, on 06 July 2018 - 11:11 PM, said:

Sorry for formatting, copy pasted from stats.
In order - Games - Won games - Lost games - Ratio - Kills - Deaths - Ratio

ARCTIC CHEETAH ACH-PRIME 66 38 27 1.41 84 28 3.00
JENNER JR7-F 32 19 13 1.46 37 19 1.95
LOCUST LCT-1E 37 22 15 1.47 43 23 1.87
MIST LYNX MLX-B 35 20 15 1.33 34 33 1.03
PIRANHA PIR-1 19 15 4 3.75 45 9 5.00
Sure its anecdotal, but this PIR-1 is a clear outlier for me, and I firmly believe the thing is busted. To everyone saying 'Assault mechs can turn around and fight it *as soon* as they hear the machinegun noise' are wrong. I don't know what magical assault mech you run that can manage to torso twist faster then a strafing light often below your torso yaw range doing 13.5 DPS with no heat cap and a small hitbox. Plus the little pelvis section between a mechs legs can be hit from nearly 180 degrees so that you can keep hitting the rear center torso even AS they torso twist. With 13.5 DPS plus crit damage. (news flash, the crit reduction really doesn't do that much) Last game I stripped from the front a fresh HBR's side torso during the cool down of his medium lasers. In the 4.5 seconds it took for a 65 ton mech to cooldown his weapon systems I stood still and removed a side torso. From the front. Standing still. Facetanking.

...but I totally love it when 1 alpha, e.g. heavy gauss, obliterates any light



Point is: heavy and assaults whine as soons as a light mech is dangerous to them (despite their weapons having no alpha potential, low range etc) instead of adapting while at the same time it is completely acceptable that e.g. a dual HG combo blasts a light to pieces, that streaks hardcounter them etc.
This is simply a double standard. I would wish the old unnerved Huginn would be back

Edited by Bush Hopper, 06 July 2018 - 11:46 PM.

[JediPanther]

I'll take my Ember over any fish any time because of the op jump jets and mg rof.

[LordNothing]

King Kryptor, on 04 July 2018 - 05:47 PM, said:

I don't get the fuss tbh.



That Grinner though...

I've had the piranha since it dropped and personally found it's success to be too circumstantial. Cohesive teams with good defense seem to neutralize mg boating fishies with ease, but maybe it's just me lacking the skillset required to unlock it's op potential. Yes it has a higher k/d compared to 3/4 of the other lights in this list, but I'm looking for wins and I just don't feel that it's as effective as ranged harassment with laser poking.

I have made some adjustments on the pir-1 by adding a couple medium heavy lasers making it similar to my shard. I'll have to give it another go and see if I can raise that win/loss ratio.

i did 3 hmls and 8 lmgs on the a varient today and it was really knocking them dead. i think its moved ahead of my 1 varient in terms of its success rate.

[LordNothing]

i kind of think the problem with most players is that they play lights and fail miserably. so they come to think of light mechs as useless cannon fodder. this is why you get 5 guys to stack on one squirrel to try and get a kill and then have the squirrel kill 2 of them while a 3rd gets team killed by somone trying to get a free kill. they do not understand lights and assume they are bad. so they move on up to other classes. when they get to assault suddenly light mechs are a threat. and of course its the latest greatest light mech that every pro light pilot just had to have, and that everyone else avoided like the plague. so of course it must be op. i remember when this happened with arctic chetahs and 8mg myst lynxes and now we got fish.

the thing to take away is that lights and assaults are for advanced players who use special tactics that the pilots of mediums and heavies seldom understand. thing is new players will always gravitate to the assaults because they see it as a free ride while lights are fodder, when in fact assault is going to be the hardest class to play because of all the real good light pilots out there. and since only really good light pilots gravitate to light mechs you are going to encounter far more competent light pilots as an assault than you will find competent assault pilots as a light pilot.

new players should start with heavies or mediums and when they are familiar with things like gunnery, positioning and some basic tactics, then you can move on to other classes. you might want to run some 40 tonners to train for lights and 75 tonners to train for assaults, get the feel for the tactics before committing to a chassis that has no margin for error. id actually suggest doing lights first so you can understand what kind of tactics you will need to counter as an assault. practice stealth, try getting behind the enemy without being observed. this will require good map knowlege, which you should have before moving onto lights/assaults. also dont go with the most extreme 20 tonner or 100 tonner, go with something like 35/80 tons. if you jump into a slow assault or a light with paper armor with no knowlege of how to play the class you are going to have a bad time. as you advance then move into the extremes.

Edited by LordNothing, 07 July 2018 - 06:14 AM.

[Laser Kiwi]

Brenden, on 06 July 2018 - 07:43 PM, said:

Piranhas need Missile Hardpoints. I want to spam SRM2s.

no you don't, cause then you would have to actually lead a shot and use skill, a machine gun doesn't even have to lead on a moving target, hence OP.

The only way they will properly nerf mgs is to put in an effective velocity, leave the damage the same, if the light stands still behind a still assault he deserves the kill, but against a moving target it shouldn't be that easy to keep dealing dps at those ranges for no heat

[Laser Kiwi]

DigitalMerc, on 06 July 2018 - 08:31 PM, said:

Again, aim legs, back or... i dunno, throw a single flammer its way and you'll see the quickest overheat shutdown ever [aside from a Nova, lol]
There, three simple tactics to counter it.

Since the only piranha anyone really gives a **** about is the pir-1, the flamer tactic won't work, the other ones are all valid solutions.

I guess the point is, does any other light get the attention a piranha does?

It used to be "don't chase the squirrel", now its literally, "oh it's a piranha, hold up we better deal with that"

having said that, the piranha can't be nerfed, the mech is fine, the machine guns need velocity of some kind, it could be a high velocity, but any velocity will contribute to spread and knock a few points effectiveness off all machine guns which i think are a surprisingly powerful weapon for little weight and no heat.

Edited by Laser Kiwi, 07 July 2018 - 07:26 AM.

[Heisenbug]

LordNothing, on 07 July 2018 - 06:13 AM, said:

i kind of think the problem with most players is that they play lights and fail miserably.

It's as if people are willfully ignoring the constant message being repeated over and over: the problem is not other lights or people who can't play or heavies (and probably not even machine guns). The Piranha's are unique and stand out as such. They are ridiculously op'd; a bad light pilot will be better in a Piranha and a good light pilot will be godly. It's not crying to point out that a third of my deaths are by Piranha. So in review, the problem is not with light mechs, it's with this one specific frame.

It's so bad that it makes me not want to play (for example, here I am Saturday morning sick of dying by Piranha and eyeballing Darkest Dungeon...).

[Y E O N N E]

Heisenbug, on 07 July 2018 - 07:33 AM, said:

It's so bad that it makes me not want to play (for example, here I am Saturday morning sick of dying by Piranha and eyeballing Darkest Dungeon...).

If Light players were like you and had the same thought process because of Streaks, dual Gauss, and Heavy Gauss, the Light queue would be empty.

[Heisenbug]

Yeonne Greene, on 07 July 2018 - 08:27 AM, said:

If Light players were like you and had the same thought process because of Streaks, dual Gauss, and Heavy Gauss, the Light queue would be empty.

I play lights and fast mediums exclusively: streaks are not an issue, and if you can hit me with gauss then you deserve the kill. There is nothing that the bigs bring to the table that is a comparable threat to what the Piranha is accomplishing (against everything else) game after game.

[Y E O N N E]

Heisenbug, on 07 July 2018 - 09:16 AM, said:

I play lights and fast mediums exclusively: streaks are not an issue, and if you can hit me with gauss then you deserve the kill. There is nothing that the bigs bring to the table that is a comparable threat to what the Piranha is accomplishing (against everything else) game after game.

I play everything, with a bias toward Lights and Mediums. I'm not worried about streaks.

By the same token, those who play Heavies and Assaults competently are not worried about Piranhas.

Check your bias.

[Weeny Machine]

Laser Kiwi, on 07 July 2018 - 07:17 AM, said:

no you don't, cause then you would have to actually lead a shot and use skill, a machine gun doesn't even have to lead on a moving target, hence OP.

The only way they will properly nerf mgs is to put in an effective velocity, leave the damage the same, if the light stands still behind a still assault he deserves the kill, but against a moving target it shouldn't be that easy to keep dealing dps at those ranges for no heat

A light rarely does need to lead shots because a good pilot will be on you when you won't expect it or be distracted. That's the only way most lights live long enough in an environment of absurd alphas, double heavy gauss, and lock on weapons

Heisenbug, on 07 July 2018 - 07:33 AM, said:

It's as if people are willfully ignoring the constant message being repeated over and over: the problem is not other lights or people who can't play or heavies (and probably not even machine guns). The Piranha's are unique and stand out as such. They are ridiculously op'd; a bad light pilot will be better in a Piranha and a good light pilot will be godly. It's not crying to point out that a third of my deaths are by Piranha. So in review, the problem is not with light mechs, it's with this one specific frame.

It's so bad that it makes me not want to play (for example, here I am Saturday morning sick of dying by Piranha and eyeballing Darkest Dungeon...).

God, I must be a great player because I faced 2 PIRs today in my WLF2. They went after me and I had no chance to make it back to my team (bad positioning of myself) so I decided to fight them.
Ran behind a pillar, looked at seismic and fired point black 5MPLs in its CT it fired as well and I took it. It went down to my surprise.
The other one fired like mad but I kept swerving and twisting and fired the MPLs whenever possible - all shots on its legs. And boom, leg gone after 4 or 5 passes. Then the second leg - dead PIR. My armour was still yellow and in some places orange.

It was pitiful how the MGs bounced of the armour. But hey, survival tree an all

Personally I don't like the PIR that much. It is an extreme feast or famine mech.

Edited by Bush Hopper, 07 July 2018 - 12:26 PM.

[dario03]

Heisenbug, on 07 July 2018 - 09:16 AM, said:

I play lights and fast mediums exclusively: streaks are not an issue, and if you can hit me with gauss then you deserve the kill. There is nothing that the bigs bring to the table that is a comparable threat to what the Piranha is accomplishing (against everything else) game after game.

So Piranha over the Mad Cat MKII? Like I said earlier I have found them and other bigger mechs to be more carry than a PIR.

[Prototelis]

Laser Kiwi, on 07 July 2018 - 07:17 AM, said:

no you don't, cause then you would have to actually lead a shot and use skill, a machine gun doesn't even have to lead on a moving target, hence OP.

Try holding lasers or mgs on a single component on a moving mech at full speed while rapidly turning back and forth and then tell me it doesn't take skill.